Author Topic: Shamanic items  (Read 808 times)

MAB77

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Shamanic items
« on: August 22, 2023, 08:29:28 AM »
Good morning all.

In preparing for the eventual addition of the shaman class, I am looking for inspiration and suggestions for shaman themed items. Ideally, several options for each of the following: Light Armors, Simple Weapons, Helms, Belts, Cloaks and Boots; and for all range of character levels. Because they are variations on a same theme (dealing with spirits), said items will also be usable by voodan characters.

Follow the same guidelines as the Item Request Thread. No spell slot items, those are already covered by providing equivalents to the current voodan spell slot items. No feats on items (for balance reasons as this class already gets plenty of bonus feats).
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MAB

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Merry Munchkin

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2023, 10:02:00 AM »
"Altjiranga" (the Dreamtime)

A "turndun" or "bullroarer" is an ancient ritual musical instrument and a device historically used for communicating over great distances.  It consists of a piece of wood attached to a string, which when swung in a large circle produces a roaring vibration sound.  This particular version has been imbued with limited enchantments from its spirit creator, causing the roaring sound to be extremely disorienting to the hearers.

Item type: Sling (item must be equipped)
No damage
Charges: 24
Cloud of Bewilderment (2 charges per use)
Confusion (4 charges per use)
Listen: -4

Class:  Shaman, Voodan


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Anarcoplayba

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2023, 12:10:08 PM »
Allow monk items to be used by shamans also and most of the stuff is covered. At least gloves/gauntlets.
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Edward

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2023, 01:22:21 PM »
Allow monk items to be used by shamans also and most of the stuff is covered. At least gloves/gauntlets.

I agree with this

MAB77

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2023, 12:12:18 AM »
Allow monk items to be used by shamans also and most of the stuff is covered. At least gloves/gauntlets.

You will have to be more precise than that. Some of the monk items may fit, but certainly not all of them. There are thousands of items in our treasuries, I'm not going through them one by one to see which ones may fit.  If you want to see a class restricted item available to shamans, give the item names and I will assess the pertinence. Although the idea is also to give shamans and voodans some unique items.

Beside, remember that the unarmed damage part of the Oriental Adventure shaman will not be implement, because unarmed damage is hardcoded in NWN. Gloves/gauntlets will see little use from shamans.
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MAB

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Kireek

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2023, 07:50:48 AM »
What is the identity of the class then that is being designed? If the goal is just another divine caster, than those items already exist, but if for example.. the bonus feats are now intended to take summoning abilities, or to give buffs to an animal companion, that opens fertile ground for item ideas that havn't been implemented to help support that class identity.


Merry Munchkin

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2023, 08:51:02 AM »
Per 3.5e rules, a shaman is a sort of hybrid between a cleric/druid/monk.  They prepare spells like a cleric and can spontaneously cast healing like a cleric, but their spell set is more like a druid's, and they can fight unarmed like a monk (although per MAB, it will be only a partial implementation due to game engine limitations).  It is an interesting concept.


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Kireek

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2023, 01:11:00 PM »
Its deffo an interesting concept, and a class I'd want to play, what i'm getting at is, if it loses the monk h2h stuff, what is it getting in its place? I know the h2h stuff isn't a huge component of the class, but it is a major one that def would direct where the gear would of been going.. a monk/voodan gear hybrid type place.. but without the h2h damage dice, the bonus feats appear to be somewhat of a waste, so.. I'm just wondering if the bonus feat list was expanded to compensate and if it was, to encompass what? and if we had that list.. it could inform where the class might be leading, etc.

For example, if the class is leaning towards summons/animal companions as I suggested it could above..

It would not be inappropriate to make some shaman only magic fang type items, or the like. Shrug.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2023, 01:23:36 PM by Kireek »

MAB77

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2023, 01:31:06 PM »
When a feature cannot be implemented in a way that is close enough in spirit to the intended design it is just dropped, not replaced by anything else. This is true for all the classes we added in the past.

Game engine limitations means the following differences.
- No unarmed damage modifications.
- No third clerical domain at level 11.
- Bonus feats to be unrestricted.
- Spirit Sight adapted to 3 uses of See Invisibility (self only) per day.
- Regular clerical domains to be used instead of the shamanic domains of the Oriental Adventure sourcebook.
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MAB

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Anarcoplayba

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2023, 02:55:17 PM »
Allow monk items to be used by shamans also and most of the stuff is covered. At least gloves/gauntlets.

You will have to be more precise than that. Some of the monk items may fit, but certainly not all of them. There are thousands of items in our treasuries, I'm not going through them one by one to see which ones may fit.  If you want to see a class restricted item available to shamans, give the item names and I will assess the pertinence. Although the idea is also to give shamans and voodans some unique items.

Beside, remember that the unarmed damage part of the Oriental Adventure shaman will not be implement, because unarmed damage is hardcoded in NWN. Gloves/gauntlets will see little use from shamans.

Oomph. That is sad. May I suggest a "workaround"? Give them as free feats imp unarmed strike at level 1, weapon focus unarmed strike at lvl 6 and Weapon Specialization Unarmed Strike at level 11. That will not be not even near the original unarmed strike, but may help.
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Kireek

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2023, 03:40:33 PM »
What the class needs then is perhaps some class feats or more general magic feats maybe, the problem with the items is.. got a good list of them, it's more just finding the ones out there and making them cross compatible.  I honestly would of much preferred that d6 divine caster class that works like a wizard that can learn most divine spells, this class as kind of lacks an identity when it is put up against Voodan/Favored Soul/Cleric/Druid... unless it can put it's Ravenloft bonus feats, + its class bonus feats to good use to go deep on a tree that no other class can do without serious sacrifices.
Yah I'm just thinking like.. I guess..

Chewstick
Staff
1 charge per use
50 charges total
Magic fang- CL 5
Chewlog
Staff
200% increased weight
3 charges per use
30 charges
GMF- CL 15

umtic

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2023, 07:11:24 PM »
Love the class, and we can live with the limitations imposed by NWN.

Many cultures that have spirits/forces/manifestations as a core of their beliefs use masks on ceremonies. Although the interpretation of those masks change from one religious expression to the other, they're still an important part of many rituals. I'll throw my two pieces at one. I'm not happy about the description, and even less on the name, as they both lack on inspiration. Anyway, since the post asks for ideas, here's one ;)

Ceremonial Mask

It's said some spirits have no face discerned by a mortals. Those strange and almost aberrant masks, frequently used on religious rituals, help to sink into their focus of faith, and to ignore the influence of the world around them.

Base item: mask (helmet)
Weight : 1.0

Special properties:
Skill Bonus: Concentration +4
Skill Bonus: Discipline +4
Bonus vs Mind Effects and Spells : +2
Skill Penalty: Listen -4
Skill Penalty: Spot -4

If it was an option, I'd add influence depending on certain groups, both negative and positive. Since it's not, I'll stop here.
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SardineTheAncestor

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2023, 08:11:41 PM »
Although you specifically called for no spell slot items, I might propose some different or improved/"greater" versions of the Voodan items I suggested a long time ago.

I'd ask what Voodan players in particular think about them. They drop only a little more commonly than other spell slot items but their drawbacks seem extreme to me now in retrospect, and there's nothing past them besides using class-agnostic gear. I put so many drawbacks on them that they seem to just sit in shops and that kind of ruins the feeling of discovery. I hoped more of them would be available to low level Voodan as drops before level 8 but I don't think it turned out that way in practice.

--

While Shaman won't be getting unarmed features, it might be nice if they can at least try. Any class can fight unarmed, especially if they have high strength (for damage), good parry rating, access to weapon finesse (for dexterity builds) and access to improved unarmed strike.

Along those lines I would at the very least like to ask that items like the Practice Baton receive the ability to change appearance. I think it would be appropriately thematic to see certain characters who fight unarmed or with a 1h weapon wielding ankhs and other holy symbols, or censers and lanterns. Not that I would mind proposing some of these as offhands with parry, spellcraft, and/or save bonuses. I think they'd look really good and a decent amount of characters would be able to make use of them, not just monks.

Just some food for thought, let me know what you think.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2023, 08:13:28 PM by SardineTheAncestor »
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MAB77

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2023, 08:19:43 PM »
If it may help. Take it with a grain of salt as this might come to change with the final version but here are the current properties of the shaman.
Oriental Adventure and it's update to D&D 3.5 in Dragon Magazine 318 are the source material.

Quote
Shamans are intermediaries between the mortal world and the realm of spirits - the vast multitude of living beings that infuse the entire world with divine essence. Shamans play a vital role in many communities - communicating with ancestor spirits, demons, nature spirits, and the most powerful of spirits, who might be considered deities. The shaman offers sacrifices, prayers, and services to the spirits, and in return gains the favor of patron spirits who bestow spells and other magical abilities upon him. Shamans have some power over undead, but not as great as clerics have. All shamans can heal wounds and bring people back from the brink of death, and powerful shamans can even raise the dead. Likewise, powerful shamans have authority over undead creatures, and they can turn away or even destroy these creatures. Shamans are trained in the use of simple weapons and can use light armors without penalty, since armor does not interfere with the casting of divine spells. In addition to his normal complement of spells, every shaman chooses to focus on two domains associated to its patron spirits. These domains grants the shaman special powers, and give him access to spells that he might otherwise never learn.

WARNING: To cast a spell, a shaman must have a Wisdom score of 10 + the spell's level. For example, to cast a 9th-level spell, a shaman must have a Wisdom of 19.

- Base Attack Bonus: +3 / 4 Levels.
- Hit Die: d6.
- Primary Saving Throws: Fortitude, Will.
- Proficiencies: All simple weapons and light armor. Shamans are not proficient with shields.
- Skill Points (*4 at 1st level): 4 + Int Modifier.
- Spellcasting: Divine (Wisdom-based, spell failure from armor is ignored).

Class Skills: Concentration, Heal, Influence, Lore, Parry, Spellcraft.
Unavailable Skills: Animal Empathy, Use Magic Device.

ABILITIES:

Level
1: Animal Companion - Summon an animal ally.
   Improved Unarmed Strike - Unarmed attacks no longer incur attacks of opportunity.
2: Spirit Sight - Cast See Invisibility (self only) 3x/day.
3: Turn Undead - Cause undead to flee in terror.
5: Divine Grace (Spirits' Favor) - Add Charisma modifier to all saving throws.

The shaman's clerical domains must be selected from the following list: Air, Earth, Fire, Healing, Knowledge, Luck, Animal, Plant, Repose, Travel, Trickery, War, Water.

Shamans receive bonus feats at level 4, 8, 12, 16 and 20.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2023, 08:26:57 PM by MAB77 »
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MAB

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SardineTheAncestor

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2023, 08:37:20 PM »
Looks like a really capable and versatile core.
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MAB77

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2023, 08:51:25 PM »
The balance comes from it's limited spell selection. Great buffer, but very little in terms of offensive spells. Ancestral Vengeance and Castigate are fun spells though.
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DoctorLuxo

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #16 on: August 24, 2023, 10:54:05 AM »
I have a question regarding unarmed strike damage. If they can't have the normal damage progression, will they have access to a free feat that gives dmg like eldritch claws? Because without that it seems kind of a redundant class, or a class that could be a prc for druid.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2023, 10:56:34 AM by DoctorLuxo »

MAB77

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #17 on: August 24, 2023, 11:24:16 AM »
Options are being explored, but if a feature can't be implemented reasonably as per the source material it is usually simply dropped.
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MAB

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Merry Munchkin

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #18 on: August 24, 2023, 12:34:31 PM »
"Talking Stick"

The talking stick, also called a speaker's staff, is an instrument of aboriginal democracy used by many tribes. The talking stick may be passed around a group, as multiple people speak in turn, or used only by leaders as a symbol of their authority and right to speak in public.  This particular talking stick is solid, heavy, and intricately carved with spiritual totems, and is imbued by its spirit creator to assist its user in becoming more focused and influential to others, although the ornateness of the talking stick makes it somewhat cumbersome to utilize in battle.

Item Type:  Quarterstaff
Weight: 6
Skill bonus: 
Influence +4
Concentration +4
Parry -2
Tumble -2


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Merry Munchkin

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #19 on: August 24, 2023, 12:59:20 PM »

The Lesser Macuahuitl

A macuahuitl is a weapon, a wooden club with several embedded obsidian blades. Obsidian is capable of producing an edge sharper than high quality steel razor blades, and can cause severe lacerations.  This particular version is carved with spirit totems that make the weapon significantly more potent in battle.

Item type:  Club
Extra Damage Type:  Slashing
Enhancement Bonus: +1
Special Properties:  on-hit Wounding


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Merry Munchkin

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #20 on: August 24, 2023, 01:00:08 PM »
The Greater Macuahuitl

A macuahuitl is a weapon, a wooden club with several embedded obsidian blades. Obsidian is capable of producing an edge sharper than high quality steel razor blades, and can cause severe lacerations.  This particular version is carved with spirit totems that make the weapon significantly more potent in battle.

Item type:  Greatclub
Extra Damage Type:  Slashing
Enhancement Bonus: +1
Special Properties:  on-hit Wounding


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Merry Munchkin

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Re: Shamanic items
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2023, 03:48:19 PM »
Smudge Stick

Smudging, or a rite involving the burning of sacred herbs or resins, is a ceremony practiced by many indigenous cultures. There are many varieties of rituals involving smoke, notably those that use smoke for spiritual cleansing or blessing, the purposes and particulars of the ceremonies, and the substances used, can vary widely among tribes, bands, and nations, and even more so among different world cultures.  This particular smudge stick is a bundle of aromatic herbs that has been empowered by its spirit creator to ward off enemies and opposing spirits.

Item:  consumable
Special Effect:  single use, magic circle against alignment

Note:  Smudge sticks could be created for a variety of unique single-use consumables, and given the theme of area purification (area effects) and seeing spirits, I would suggest the following effects can be used for different smudge sticks -- magic circle against alignment, sphere of invisibility, mass see invisibility, mass protection from curses, mass aid, and mass spell resistance (none of these are part of the druid spell list).  As a side note, it might be neat to allow these to be crafted, using the various herbs/spices that players find in random loot.


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