Author Topic: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules  (Read 1258 times)

Grendlykins, Simp of Azalin Rex

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Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« on: December 03, 2022, 06:10:28 PM »
Where: Barovia - Vallaki - Western Outskirts - Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn

Since my return I've noticed an increase in the number of people disregarding the local rules of the temple. Summoning familiars, bringing in wolves, going invisible via spells, etc. Some portion of these individuals are doing so out of ignorance of the established temple rules, which are only located on the forums. Granted, some people will always do the above for varied reasons, but being that the ML faction members make a point of putting up the rules and a donation box at the front of the temple, I don't think it would be unreasonable to have the rules permanently placed within the temple to refer people to, IC.

This would save a lot of effort for those not in the know, as well as avoiding incidences where one has to go OOC and say 'go to the forums and look for the rules there' and all the disjointed breaking of immersion that entails.

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2022, 06:25:07 PM »
If this is possible it'd be much appreciative! I do try my best with each restart to put the sign up and needed guidelines. It's of course up to ML members to also be there to make sure things are under control but sadly we cannot always be online to do so!

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Grendlykins, Simp of Azalin Rex

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2022, 06:35:28 PM »
If this is possible it'd be much appreciative! I do try my best with each restart to put the sign up and needed guidelines. It's of course up to ML members to also be there to make sure things are under control but sadly we cannot always be online to do so!

The efforts of faction members are definitely appreciated; it's part of why I made the request. Having seen the rules board at the entryway only makes sense, since the Outskirts is the landing point for every newly misted.

KovosDatch

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2022, 07:27:29 PM »
Having played a ML faction member, I wholeheartedly support this. By having the rules posted, one could easily distinguish what is allowed in the temple and what is ignoring NPCs.

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2022, 07:38:43 PM »
Holy heck yes please <3
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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2022, 07:40:51 PM »
Please. The ML folks suffer enough. +1
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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2022, 08:16:39 PM »
Not a Mler but someone who agrees +1

cheese tornado

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2022, 08:48:57 PM »
Echoing Kovos' sentiment. Having to learn carpentry just to put these signs and boxes up is both necessary and tedious! Some permanency would go a long way.

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2022, 09:25:30 PM »
Echoing Kovos' sentiment. Having to learn carpentry just to put these signs and boxes up is both necessary and tedious! Some permanency would go a long way.

Used to be that was part of the initiation to join the clergy. I'm not sure a chaotic organization would be posting rules in their temples though.

Grendlykins, Simp of Azalin Rex

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2022, 09:28:24 PM »
Used to be that was part of the initiation to join the clergy. I'm not sure a chaotic organization would be posting rules in their temples though.

https://www.nwnravenloft.com/forum/index.php?topic=48962.msg603170

There's multiple instances of them having rules posted publically. This one is the most recent one I could find that's comprehensive.

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #10 on: December 03, 2022, 09:32:22 PM »
Quote
Used to be that was part of the initiation to join the clergy. I'm not sure a chaotic organization would be posting rules in their temples though.

Chaotic does not mean we still don't have simple rules to keep some level of order in the temples. The rules are meant to be there ICly as I understand.
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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2022, 09:43:27 PM »
Used to be that was part of the initiation to join the clergy. I'm not sure a chaotic organization would be posting rules in their temples though.

https://www.nwnravenloft.com/forum/index.php?topic=48962.msg603170

There's multiple instances of them having rules posted publically. This one is the most recent one I could find that's comprehensive.

I remember those rules. My lawful good ML rogue loved to remind people of them. But she was, I think, an anomoly within the faith. Personally, I'm not opposed to them being posted. Just remeniscing the past.

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #12 on: December 03, 2022, 10:26:14 PM »
Quote
Used to be that was part of the initiation to join the clergy. I'm not sure a chaotic organization would be posting rules in their temples though.

Chaotic does not mean we still don't have simple rules to keep some level of order in the temples. The rules are meant to be there ICly as I understand.
^ Yeah.
+1, a reasonable suggestion for something that should have already been.

cheese tornado

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #13 on: December 03, 2022, 11:06:44 PM »
Echoing Kovos' sentiment. Having to learn carpentry just to put these signs and boxes up is both necessary and tedious! Some permanency would go a long way.

Used to be that was part of the initiation to join the clergy. I'm not sure a chaotic organization would be posting rules in their temples though.

We were also a Good organization, and a church, too much chaos overwhelms the good part, so rules were established. Carpentry was only part of the initiation because there was no permanent signage. Now there can be.

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2022, 02:10:47 AM »
I recall making a similar request and being told it was a chaotic aligned cult, and while I get that, even a Chaotic good cult isn't going to want to have people shaping into wolves or chugging magic potions rapid fire in their temple making a ruckuss. Especially if they are responsible for their sanctuary and the garda hold them to account. I think some rules would be useful.

inkcorvid

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2022, 10:28:29 AM »
In addition to the thread linked above, there are some official policies from Lizuca herself here. It's also an acommodation for new players, many of whom legitimately don't understand the behavioural expectations there, and feel it's just downright reasonable to quarter their oxen overnight, assemble a menagerie of animals, shapeshift, keep their glowing flaming swords out, or charge towards Lizuca in monstrously intimidating form (umber hulks and bears, most commonly) because it's convenient for carrying corpses. It's also sometimes considered something of a setting-free safe zone. It is a sanctuary, but in a subtler way: violence is prohibited, but the Garda do go in there and will drag you out if you shouldn't be.

I mean, if the cult is so Chaotic that the idea of rules is a no-no, maybe we could have a sign saying:

NO MASTERS UNDER THE SUN
DO AS THOU WILT

 :P
« Last Edit: December 04, 2022, 10:30:37 AM by inkcorvid »
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Cody

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2022, 11:42:24 AM »
I never knew the temple had specific rules until after 10 months of playing. It felt just recently people have been making more if an IC effort to bring them to everyone else's attention.

Famous Seamus

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #17 on: December 04, 2022, 01:57:22 PM »
As someone who's spent a lot of time in that temple, I'll add another +1 in favor of this idea.

The faction is Chaotic-aligned, but the rules have existed for years. "Chaotic" also doesn't equal anarchy, right? Even several of the most Chaotic-leaning organizations, both within POTM and the larger D&D canon, have a set of loose guidelines (however threadbare) that define their interactions either internally or externally. It isn't unreasonable to think the Morninglordians would have the same, especially as a good-aligned faith.

Apart from helping newer players who don't know what's expected, having the rules clearly posted on a permanent basis sets expectations with all players for acceptable behavior and removes the chance for someone to use "I didn't know" as an excuse when they're barred from the sanctuary or set to faction hostile for ignoring/abusing said rules. It would increase fairness by removing any ambiguity.


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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #18 on: December 04, 2022, 01:59:49 PM »
My favorite part remains the fact that any divine casters casting spells in the temple, while not being worshippers of the Morninglord, are technically committing a blasphemy. Imagine the number of character retired for reaching stage 6 of corruption if the module was set up to roll a power check everytime a blasphemy was committed as per the source material.  :lol:
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Calad

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #19 on: December 04, 2022, 02:42:27 PM »
The chaotic nature of the ML faction is due to the fact that there's no tangible hierarchy beyond the Vicar's word being mostly listened to, and the least amount of organization between the other churches. The Church in Vallaki can do what they want and the Churches in other places won't say much.

Though we see this Chaotic alignment falling everytime a DM NPC speaks, the High Priest doing a proclamation, or Ilie, or Lizuca and so on. It is loosely supported, it just shows itself in things like;

Anyone can do sermons in the clergy, and no one will slap them and be like "NO YOU CANNOT BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT VICAR" or whatever. There are no 'specific' orders Lightcarriers of Dawnbringers need to listen to beyond "keep the peace, be nice, have common sense and praise the Morninglord" after initiation.

..this doesn't mean they will allow people to summon whatever in the Church, run around with weapons, cast all sorts of magic- nah. The Chaotic alignment of the faction is more internal than external. I could go on and on about this but..

I am in favor of this change.
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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #20 on: December 04, 2022, 02:58:27 PM »
The chaotic nature of the ML faction is due to the fact that there's no tangible hierarchy beyond the Vicar's word being mostly listened to, and the least amount of organization between the other churches. The Church in Vallaki can do what they want and the Churches in other places won't say much.

Though we see this Chaotic alignment falling everytime a DM NPC speaks, the High Priest doing a proclamation, or Ilie, or Lizuca and so on. It is loosely supported, it just shows itself in things like;

Anyone can do sermons in the clergy, and no one will slap them and be like "NO YOU CANNOT BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT VICAR" or whatever. There are no 'specific' orders Lightcarriers of Dawnbringers need to listen to beyond "keep the peace, be nice, have common sense and praise the Morninglord" after initiation.

..this doesn't mean they will allow people to summon whatever in the Church, run around with weapons, cast all sorts of magic- nah. The Chaotic alignment of the faction is more internal than external. I could go on and on about this but..

I am in favor of this change.

Took the words out of my mouth.

This also will help enforce the rule to people that while ML PCs may not be there all the time there is still NPCs. The same rule for other NPCs applys to them too. Most new players don't know this of course but I've seen a few people who should know better ignore the fact there is NPC Lightcarriers and such standing inside.
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Calad

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #21 on: December 04, 2022, 03:05:46 PM »
Also the rules exist as a placeable. I am not entirely sure of what this entails, but if not a sign, putting this up could be nice? I haven't had a time to check it for a whlie though.

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Grendlykins, Simp of Azalin Rex

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #22 on: December 04, 2022, 05:09:20 PM »
This also will help enforce the rule to people that while ML PCs may not be there all the time there is still NPCs.

I'd personally like to bring attention to this fact specifically. In addition to the rise of people doing things in the temple that they shouldn't, there also seems to be a rise in the incidence of people who are under the assumption that if a DM or faction member is not present, that serves as carte blanche to do anything. But this is likely not the thread for it.

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2022, 10:35:00 PM »
My favorite part remains the fact that any divine casters casting spells in the temple, while not being worshippers of the Morninglord, are technically committing a blasphemy. Imagine the number of character retired for reaching stage 6 of corruption if the module was set up to roll a power check everytime a blasphemy was committed as per the source material.  :lol:

Is that a fact? I sincerely didn't know this. I recall coming across some IC books saying how the Cult is largely accepting of other religions. I can't recall the specific one, may have been a player generated book, or essay. I'll have to look for it again.

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Re: Sanctuary of the Coming Dawn - Permanent Noticeboard/Rules
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2022, 12:51:40 AM »
People seem to think that the Lightcarriers will protect them from the garda, too. Commit crimes in broad daylight and then run into the sanctuary. A bit of in game clarification about the sanctuary and what the rules are would go a long way.
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