Author Topic: Markovia Feedback Thread  (Read 3957 times)

Cody

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #50 on: November 28, 2022, 01:55:49 PM »
I find the submerged ruins curse checks to be too heavy to work against on your standard rogue/crypt raider build. The two classes give almost 0 saves towards Will, and on top of that the ruins drain your saves even further.

Even with my +4 curse saves from being a Crypt Raider, combined with all the effects of the dungeon and such, I don't have more than +0 for modifiers against the curses. If I used an owls, virtue, and protection from curses. Maybe I can get that up to +7. But only a 25% chance to pass these checks is not hopeful.

I understand that this section should be giving crypt raiders an advantage, but their saves are still abysmal here.

Would it be possible to make crypt raiders immune to the dread effects of dungeons to help give them better saves? At level 10 if anything?
Or to change the Will save into a Fortitude save? Crypt Raiders at least receive those kinds of saves instead of Will.

DM Erebus

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #51 on: November 28, 2022, 02:30:31 PM »
I find the submerged ruins curse checks to be too heavy to work against on your standard rogue/crypt raider build. The two classes give almost 0 saves towards Will, and on top of that the ruins drain your saves even further.

Even with my +4 curse saves from being a Crypt Raider, combined with all the effects of the dungeon and such, I don't have more than +0 for modifiers against the curses. If I used an owls, virtue, and protection from curses. Maybe I can get that up to +7. But only a 25% chance to pass these checks is not hopeful.

I understand that this section should be giving crypt raiders an advantage, but their saves are still abysmal here.

Would it be possible to make crypt raiders immune to the dread effects of dungeons to help give them better saves? At level 10 if anything?
Or to change the Will save into a Fortitude save? Crypt Raiders at least receive those kinds of saves instead of Will.

Fort vs Curse is a good idea.

Kaninchen

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #52 on: November 28, 2022, 11:26:48 PM »
I rather like the fact the domain, and various dungeons don't play 100% nice with ninja-looting strategies. Means investing in some amount of Remove Curse effects, or having friends able to do the thing.

If design philosophy does shift to having more curse effects on chests opening, I'd suggest altering the general feat "Expert Dungeoner" to also include an amount of saves vs curses.

MAB77

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #53 on: November 30, 2022, 05:14:28 PM »
Some of the new herbs seem to do nothing on their own, an d can’t be crafted. I’ve not seen a single other herb that just does nothing when placing 1 or multiple of them on the table. Is this intended? This goes for Lobster claw, bird of paradise and oleander from what i’ve checked at least

This should now be fixed. Please advise.
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Ryujin

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #54 on: November 30, 2022, 05:36:33 PM »
Some of the new herbs seem to do nothing on their own, an d can’t be crafted. I’ve not seen a single other herb that just does nothing when placing 1 or multiple of them on the table. Is this intended? This goes for Lobster claw, bird of paradise and oleander from what i’ve checked at least

This should now be fixed. Please advise.

Confirmed - The herbs now successfully craft into potions
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DM Erebus

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #55 on: December 01, 2022, 03:37:05 PM »
Forthcoming update:

Ravine will allow easier travel between Jhurgen's camp and the Vistani camp.

Added support for turn-in activities at Jhurgen's camp and the Vistani camp.

Increased Flooded Section tremor intervals (less frequent)

Machete bonus will apply to Rangers, Druids, Barbarians and Grimetrekkers


EarlofEtheria

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #56 on: December 02, 2022, 04:19:05 PM »
After letting an adventure stew in me for a week or so, I really liked the randomization of the Broken Ones. It's a way to reward PC investments (such as poison resistance) without making the area prohibitive to those without. I would actually like to see old dungeons given similar treatment, even if it's as little as diversifying NPC spell lists, or one skeleton marksman has rapid shot for the dungeon.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2022, 04:20:37 PM by EarlofEtheria »

Zyemeth

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #57 on: December 06, 2022, 06:01:32 PM »
Twice now in the sunken ruins there has been a golem that spawns stuck in the stone head statue to the left immediately after entering the dungeon. I might also toss out a suggestion to remove or lower the fish physical DR (Or maybe it's just for piercing?) and maybe boost their ab or something in return? As a dex finesse char with enchanted weapons I was dealing 6-9 damage on a hit when str warded. Normally this isn't an issue if I can do sneak attack dmg but since they are immune I feel incredibly useless as a primary rogue. Bows don't work underwater either so I'm out of options to do any real damage down there.

Aside from that the dungeon seems fun. Glad to have discipline be useful for something again.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2022, 06:08:51 PM by Zyemeth »

Kaninchen

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #58 on: December 06, 2022, 06:56:16 PM »
I've had similar cases of this with dual wield short swords, probably is a DR to piercing, like the Jelly fish in the shipwreck. It might be feasible to keep another weapon with a different weapon type, or punch. It's what I do against various pudding monsters as well! Also, a varnish for another damage die has helped me feel useful for most of the server, what with the no sneak damage on most things.

e: I'll also toss out that a rogue's damage isn't why one is brought to this particular dungeon.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2022, 06:59:04 PM by Kaninchen »

Zyemeth

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #59 on: December 07, 2022, 03:32:38 AM »
I've had similar cases of this with dual wield short swords, probably is a DR to piercing, like the Jelly fish in the shipwreck. It might be feasible to keep another weapon with a different weapon type, or punch. It's what I do against various pudding monsters as well! Also, a varnish for another damage die has helped me feel useful for most of the server, what with the no sneak damage on most things.

e: I'll also toss out that a rogue's damage isn't why one is brought to this particular dungeon.

If it is specifically piercing I would still think it makes sense for bludgeoning and maybe slashing but piercing should be the most effective damage type to underwater foes since a knife or spear is the only thing unimpeded with underwater use. Food for thought.

DM Erebus

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #60 on: December 07, 2022, 11:39:56 AM »
I've had similar cases of this with dual wield short swords, probably is a DR to piercing, like the Jelly fish in the shipwreck. It might be feasible to keep another weapon with a different weapon type, or punch. It's what I do against various pudding monsters as well! Also, a varnish for another damage die has helped me feel useful for most of the server, what with the no sneak damage on most things.

e: I'll also toss out that a rogue's damage isn't why one is brought to this particular dungeon.

If it is specifically piercing I would still think it makes sense for bludgeoning and maybe slashing but piercing should be the most effective damage type to underwater foes since a knife or spear is the only thing unimpeded with underwater use. Food for thought.

I'll have a look at the golem spawn.

re. piranah immunities: they're the same as the ratuda quippers (I reused the skin). The damage immunity is to represent the fact that its a swarm of creatures. I think the rationale is that stabbing motions are the least effective vs a swarm than slashing or swiping motions.

I will, however, have a think about a better alternative maybe. That might just be an AC boost, which would at least be equally unfun for everyone.


Anarcoplayba

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #61 on: December 07, 2022, 02:28:22 PM »
Been there recently and, although not my piece of cake, I can understand the idea and found it to be really good.

What I liked:
Secret Passages and mysteries to be found by dedicated "archeologists".
Living enemies (which favors some playstyles).
Dungeons that demand long time investment gathering the keys.

What I disliked:
To me, the pathways are awful. AWSD is a pain to go through the meanders. Clicking is awful due the visibility.
The canopy closing your visibility.

I may not be a huge habitue of Markovia, but I REALLY enjoyed a domain tailored for lvls 14~15. Hopefully it will cause less predation of low level content.

Suggestions:
I would love to see more wood and herb nodes there. Come on, that is a tropical island that has less wood and herbs than temperate domains?
I would also love to see more tropical dangers: disease checks and mosquitoes for instance.
This is the place to have some HIPS foes.
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Zyemeth

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #62 on: December 07, 2022, 03:37:56 PM »
Another point or two of AC would be preferred imo. Hitting is already a little bit of a struggle but it's nice to feel like when I do manage a hit that it actually does something. Normally I use a bow if I need punching power but the whole water thing is limiting that.

Edward

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #63 on: December 07, 2022, 04:22:02 PM »
I like the Dire Jaguar and Monastery, good job.

Vissy

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #64 on: December 08, 2022, 04:48:37 AM »
The only gripe I really have with Markovia is that navigating the domain can be really long and painful at times, and it could use a few more shortcuts and more circular design, but I do recognize that that is a part of the jungle-theme. Still, I feel like a shortcut at the end of a dungeon back somewhere near the beginning of the jungle would help. Otherwise, 10/10. I love everything from the dungeons to the flavor and environments.
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DM Erebus

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #65 on: December 18, 2022, 03:40:55 AM »
In a future update:
- Added exit shortcuts to Sunset Bay, Broken One Village, Monastery Cellar and Flooded Section to 'close the loop' on these dungeons and reduce backtracking. These will also make these areas easier to escape as a ghost.

- Rebalanced piranah skin properties (removed most DR, increased AC).

As Markovia has been in for a month and you've all had the opportunity to run it a hundred times, now would be a good time for any thoughts on creature/loot balance. I have some time off over christmas to work on things here-and-there.

In terms of Markovia going foward - I have a phase 2 and phase 3 roadmap for what I'd like to add next, but no timescale. I worked on Markovia solidily for two months, so right now I'm kinda resting. For those interested, below is the design I'm working to. I've also included Ghastria at the same scale, so you get an idea of relative size.

Spoiler: show

Frankz

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #66 on: December 18, 2022, 10:36:51 AM »
Having now run Markovia like a hundred times, some feedback.

I'll give a disclaimer I am a sadist / masochist

Great zone, the maze factor was amazing. I actually preferred it at night pre-nerf where you would get murdered by 12 tiger men while you tried to find what path you took in the first place.

The Rusted Safe seems to have a really high lock DC. I often find myself being forced to bring a rogue who is a high level above the zone in order to open it.

Some of the other races of the beast men are just so weak. I'd love to see more variety in the spawns. The goat model / soundset is amazing, it is just sad it can't be used more. Perhaps some giant variants of the beast men that can get mixed in with the strong spawns for visual variety?

The easily accessible platinum vein seems to have crashed the value of the resource on the server.

Sunset Bay has been very underwhelming in terms of loot and difficulty. Seems like it could use another building or transition or zone or something with a higher CR to make venturing to that section of the map worth it.

Dire Ancient Jungle Elephant. I don't know if this exists or not, but it needs too.

I really am looking forward to the future additions in Markovia. This is the first island I had to actually use map pins to navigate which I deeply enjoyed. If I were to ask for anything in the new content it would be to make it even /more/ of a convoluted mess. Using tree canopy that covers the maps roads is a pretty great way to do that.

Zyemeth

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #67 on: December 25, 2022, 05:33:08 AM »
I agree with the above point that if this zone is intended for 12-15th level characters that the rusted safe could come down maybe two points in DC? Playing a level 15 dex rogue and it still takes a level 20 wizard knock, a cat spell, a +10 lockpicks, AND a bit more from another source of some kind to get that thing open. The hidden rubble crack in the sunken temple is also too high a search DC. I am a full skill invested rogue with decent int, a fox cunning, two held search items, and I still can't see it at 34 search. It took stacking many other consumables to jump a considerable amount higher to find it. I'm not sure what the DC actually is but maybe a mid to low 30s range would be more appropriate?

Cody

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #68 on: December 25, 2022, 01:59:28 PM »
Here I was thinking the search DCs were basically perfect, could even be higher as a level 14 crypt raider since I was finding things at 32~ search range with some equipment and no buffs. Having to beef myself up to 40 for things past the first entrances is not much of an issue. I could pump out even a lot more with all the various spells that exist up to 60+. To clarify I do have the advantage of being a CR, high int, and Search Focus though.

On that same note it would be very helpful if there were more items that gave spells like Insight and Find Traps a much longer duration than one minute and a few rounds. It makes it very awkward having to re-apply those so often when you're stealthing around.

The rusted safe required me to put on my unenchanted tailored set for a change; but I was able to hit it with a bard, a good knock, and a ray of hope and a +6 lockpick. I thought the reward was good enough for the difficulty. Although personally I don't get very excited over finding
Spoiler: show
one rare ore just for crafting
but others in my parties seem to like it.

My main gripe is that I cannot ninjaloot every dungeon alone. sadface. With physical barriers forcing you to go out of invisibility and stuff.

And that even if I limit my raids to once a week, once every two weeks, or longer, I'm not getting as close to good loot as I was getting the first time I visit some of those dungeons. :(
« Last Edit: December 25, 2022, 02:08:35 PM by Cody »

DM Erebus

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #69 on: December 25, 2022, 02:45:43 PM »
- There is a planned extension to Sunset Bay, but I'm waiting on a hak update. I brought Sunset Bay forward because I had the time, and its useful enough without the extension dungeon (think Trolls/Hotep sort of arrangement)

- The Rusted Safe is meant to be a bit of fun, rather than an integral part of the loot balance. It's mostly for bragging rights. I guess if its really a pain I can lower the DC, but it's nowhere near as much of a flex.

- I think Search DCs are fine, they're pitched with buffs in mind. Much lower and Find Traps makes them trivial (too easily findable by non-Searchers).

- If more beastfolk are added, it'll be in the form of new bosses most likely. I have to be economical when filling the palette with new monsters. I designed eight variants of new Broken Ones - on top of the seven already in the palette and used elsewhere. It's hard to justify adding more rank and file.

- There is an Ancient Dire Elephant, but hurting it is an Act of Ultimate Darkness.

- I'm a certified loot freak, but not every dungeon has to be lootable. I think a mix is the healthiest approach. I'm satisfied that 2/4 (current) Markovia dungeons can be looted, and I think that's OK.

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #70 on: December 30, 2022, 02:02:52 PM »
In a future update:
- Added exit shortcuts to Sunset Bay, Broken One Village, Monastery Cellar and Flooded Section to 'close the loop' on these dungeons and reduce backtracking. These will also make these areas easier to escape as a ghost.

- Rebalanced piranah skin properties (removed most DR, increased AC).

As Markovia has been in for a month and you've all had the opportunity to run it a hundred times, now would be a good time for any thoughts on creature/loot balance. I have some time off over christmas to work on things here-and-there.

In terms of Markovia going foward - I have a phase 2 and phase 3 roadmap for what I'd like to add next, but no timescale. I worked on Markovia solidily for two months, so right now I'm kinda resting. For those interested, below is the design I'm working to. I've also included Ghastria at the same scale, so you get an idea of relative size.

Spoiler: show


These changes are now in.

noah25

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #71 on: December 31, 2022, 12:08:46 PM »
Looking forward to seeing the pirahna changes. IMO they were the only thing I have encountered there I didnt love.

cooachlyfe

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #72 on: January 01, 2023, 09:57:43 PM »
Quick question but is there a particular reason Markovia doesn't have a mistway? (if there is and I just missed it then completely disregard this comment)

HM01

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #73 on: January 01, 2023, 10:06:33 PM »
Not sure if it has been reported or not, but the rope swing at the end of the treetop dungeon doesn't seem to function.

It prompts if you want to double click, but takes you nowhere.

DM Erebus

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Re: Markovia Feedback Thread
« Reply #74 on: January 02, 2023, 09:40:35 AM »
Quick question but is there a particular reason Markovia doesn't have a mistway? (if there is and I just missed it then completely disregard this comment)

It does, and should work. It's in the Central Region - Foothills area.

Not sure if it has been reported or not, but the rope swing at the end of the treetop dungeon doesn't seem to function.

It prompts if you want to double click, but takes you nowhere.

Found problem, will fix that.