Author Topic: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.  (Read 1007 times)

Anarcoplayba

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I was reading the thread on increasing the adamantine drops and remembered that the main strategy on adamantine farming is to clear the first room of the temple to have a safe-ish spot for resting.

Killing stuff in the temple, however, triggers the reset of the spawn, therefore, a group that goes for adamantine ends spoiling the temple, what is, in the end, bad for the server as a whole for it is one less dungeon.

I'd like to suggest the adition of a small room before the temple (with or without enemies) so the players that go for adamantine do not spoils the temple.

I know that the idea of Perfidus is to be challenging and a "safe haven" would be counterintuitive, but it would be to preserve server content to allow more people to have more fun.
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myrddraal

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2022, 02:42:10 PM »
People could alternatively use the cave to rest.  If they dont want to screw over everyone else.

Ryujin

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2022, 02:48:35 PM »
People could alternatively use the cave to rest.  If they dont want to screw over everyone else.

+1. I always avoid going to into the temple for this exact reason. People that use the temple for that know what they are doing, when an alternative is already readily available.
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zDark Shadowz

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2022, 03:29:05 PM »
Both of those places affect each other and the outside spawns. There's some interesting (albeit weaker) enemies that show up when things are cleared out of order. Sometimes groups have issues with the 5x Pit Fiend group so they used to be ignored (when they didnt roam), the cave could be a lot worse for them.

Anarcoplayba

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2022, 03:58:29 PM »
People could alternatively use the cave to rest.  If they dont want to screw over everyone else.

The cave is a LOT harder, as far as I know. Every time I saw it, the cave was three groups of five pit fiends.
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cooachlyfe

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2022, 06:05:46 PM »
While I don't have a solution and I don't think putting a safe rest area in Perfidus is a good idea, 10+ pit fiends are harder to kill than four balors and some fiendish aberrations.

However, I do not believe that the first room affects the rest of the temple, mostly based on experience and speculation. There have been times I have been to Perfidus where the first room was a low spawn and the rest of the temple was max.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2022, 06:09:19 PM by cooachlyfe »

Anarcoplayba

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2022, 07:03:55 PM »
While I don't have a solution and I don't think putting a safe rest area in Perfidus is a good idea, 10+ pit fiends are harder to kill than four balors and some fiendish aberrations.

However, I do not believe that the first room affects the rest of the temple, mostly based on experience and speculation. There have been times I have been to Perfidus where the first room was a low spawn and the rest of the temple was max.

If that is true, forget about what I said.

My suggestion is not to create a safe area in Perfidus, it is only to separate the area everyone makes safe from the temple to not murder the spawn and suck the fun from other people.
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Ryujin

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2022, 07:06:42 PM »
Personal experience, It does. Seen people use it as a rest at max spawn, and it nuked the temple down to min spawn after
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Vallaki Justice

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2022, 07:32:11 PM »
I think that all of the Pit Fiends and Cornugons need to be removed and all of the other fiend stat blocks buffed. These guys are generals and big shots of the lower planes. The Black Duke is canonically a Cornugon. Another topic, but this should also be done for the Aboleth as well, with something else in its place. These creatures are too powerful lore-wise to let players minimize their influence by being another alchemy or leather grind.

On another note, I also recommend Perfidus should be 3-4 transitions to feel like a bigger area, not just the temple. Also if this is done, I feel the spawn rate of the rocks shouldn't be tied to the spawn of the temple but independent of it.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2022, 07:34:07 PM by Look Man »

noah25

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2022, 08:55:44 PM »
Personally, I always just went back in the mist to rest [shrug]

noah25

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2022, 08:56:44 PM »
Personally, I always just went back in the mist to rest [shrug]

Wouldnt mind the temple having some more interesting pieces to it or expanded though.

Anarcoplayba

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2022, 09:00:28 PM »
Personally, I always just went back in the mist to rest [shrug]


I had an awful experience with mist shifting.
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noah25

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2022, 09:10:24 PM »
It can be risky but even outside of the general "ruining the dungeon problem" you then are trekking a bunch of metors on your back through the entire map. I have bad luck with most the transitions in general where the mists surround you. THey can get buggy at the wrong time  :lol:

PrimetheGrime

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2022, 09:48:49 PM »
Removal of the pitfiends, cornugons etc. Sounds like a good idea to me. They are, as dardonas said, generals and war leaders in the ranks of hell. Seems strange we use them as fodder in a not even max level zone.

cooachlyfe

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #14 on: November 07, 2022, 10:45:47 PM »
I don't mind removing the pit fiends for lore reasons but I think you'd need to replace them with creatures of similar strength mechanically and similar abilities.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2022, 01:01:55 AM by cooachlyfe »

noah25

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2022, 11:16:33 PM »
If you eliminate them its literally just free addy for walking around in the mists for 15 minutes...

Anarcoplayba

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2022, 11:55:12 PM »
I don't mind removing the pit fiends but I think you'd need to replace them with creatures of similar strength mechanically and similar abilities.

Agree. As far as I care, if you substitute the pit fiends by "evil bob", being evil bob any kind of challenging enemy thar demands a well rounded party to fight, I'm cool with that.
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myrddraal

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2022, 12:59:14 AM »
People could alternatively use the cave to rest.  If they dont want to screw over everyone else.

The cave is a LOT harder, as far as I know. Every time I saw it, the cave was three groups of five pit fiends.

People could not run skeleton crews for, literally, storming the gates of hell.  I feel like if you're adequately prepared, the cave isnt that bad.  I dont recall having many issues with it with a moderately sized group of like 6.

cooachlyfe

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2022, 01:13:46 AM »
People could alternatively use the cave to rest.  If they dont want to screw over everyone else.

The cave is a LOT harder, as far as I know. Every time I saw it, the cave was three groups of five pit fiends.

People could not run skeleton crews for, literally, storming the gates of hell.  I feel like if you're adequately prepared, the cave isnt that bad.  I dont recall having many issues with it with a moderately sized group of like 6.

I mean every dungeon in the server isn't that bad when you have a prepared, well-equipped and well-rounded group. Sure, that cave can also be soloed. That doesn't mean it isn't difficult. And it is fine that it is difficult but for just collecting adamantine (which most of the time are smaller groups so that the adamantine isn't rolled for), I imagine much groups will clear the easier 'safe rest area' than the more difficult one. Kind of common sense.

Anarcoplayba

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2022, 07:01:20 AM »
People could alternatively use the cave to rest.  If they dont want to screw over everyone else.

The cave is a LOT harder, as far as I know. Every time I saw it, the cave was three groups of five pit fiends.

People could not run skeleton crews for, literally, storming the gates of hell.  I feel like if you're adequately prepared, the cave isnt that bad.  I dont recall having many issues with it with a moderately sized group of like 6.

I mean every dungeon in the server isn't that bad when you have a prepared, well-equipped and well-rounded group. Sure, that cave can also be soloed. That doesn't mean it isn't difficult. And it is fine that it is difficult but for just collecting adamantine (which most of the time are smaller groups so that the adamantine isn't rolled for), I imagine much groups will clear the easier 'safe rest area' than the more difficult one. Kind of common sense.

^ This.

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myrddraal

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #20 on: November 08, 2022, 11:08:25 AM »
People could alternatively use the cave to rest.  If they dont want to screw over everyone else.

The cave is a LOT harder, as far as I know. Every time I saw it, the cave was three groups of five pit fiends.

People could not run skeleton crews for, literally, storming the gates of hell.  I feel like if you're adequately prepared, the cave isnt that bad.  I dont recall having many issues with it with a moderately sized group of like 6.

I mean every dungeon in the server isn't that bad when you have a prepared, well-equipped and well-rounded group. Sure, that cave can also be soloed. That doesn't mean it isn't difficult. And it is fine that it is difficult but for just collecting adamantine (which most of the time are smaller groups so that the adamantine isn't rolled for), I imagine much groups will clear the easier 'safe rest area' than the more difficult one. Kind of common sense.

^ This.

Do not trust in people's sense of self sacrifice for the greater good. They will do what  is easier and what they can.

The alternative already exists.  I would be on board with adding another dungeon but it will face the exact same problem as the temple, people will ruin its spawn clearing the first area so they can re-ward for meteor farming.  The cave is already there and doesn't trash the dungeon spawn, I feel like when we rested in the cave more meteors fell than every time we did it in the temple, but maybe thats just how I saw it at the time its been quite a while since i went on a rock run.

SardineTheAncestor

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2022, 02:11:22 PM »
I think that all of the Pit Fiends and Cornugons need to be removed and all of the other fiend stat blocks buffed. These guys are generals and big shots of the lower planes. The Black Duke is canonically a Cornugon. Another topic, but this should also be done for the Aboleth as well, with something else in its place. These creatures are too powerful lore-wise to let players minimize their influence by being another alchemy or leather grind.

On another note, I also recommend Perfidus should be 3-4 transitions to feel like a bigger area, not just the temple. Also if this is done, I feel the spawn rate of the rocks shouldn't be tied to the spawn of the temple but independent of it.

I agree. Even though patrols were added to make things a bit less certain, Perfidus just seems a bit off thematically, and I think expanding the outdoor area would be a plus. It's not that I'm against the idea of taking trophies from demons and turning their very flesh against them, but the current structure of the place takes that to extremes.
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McDuck

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #22 on: November 08, 2022, 04:36:47 PM »
whole point of a helish place. It needs to be extreme. Otherwise it would be to easy.

Place is fine as it is part from the dungeon it self might need some tweaks.  Large beings need to stay scarry. Otherwise you could just theme this server Theme park Ravenloft

It all go's back to the topic of making adamantine farming easyer to what i see with all the sugestions.

And same people complaining again that it should be easyer. Wich it should not.

It should stay a challange as it is


SardineTheAncestor

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #23 on: November 08, 2022, 04:43:27 PM »
whole point of a helish place. It needs to be extreme. Otherwise it would be to easy.

Place is fine as it is part from the dungeon it self might need some tweaks.  Large beings need to stay scarry. Otherwise you could just theme this server Theme park Ravenloft

It all go's back to the topic of making adamantine farming easyer to what i see with all the sugestions.

And same people complaining again that it should be easyer. Wich it should not.

It should stay a challange as it is

By extremes, I mean reliably harvesting these resources from swarms of demons which should be stronger than they are. The resource itself is available to an extreme level, people pile up the corpses of these fiends and harvest them like nothing.

I've never said it should be easier. Who are you referring to exactly? I'm suggesting it should be more dangerous and more uncertain, just as Look Man is, and also suggesting that there could be a larger area to battle them in, rather than a single map where every spawn is known.
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Anarcoplayba

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Re: Perfidus Temple - small changes to allow better enjoyment of the area.
« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2022, 05:19:24 PM »
So... just to clarify and try to keep the discussion on topic:

What I am suggesting is not to make adamantine farming easier or harder.

I am suggesting that we detach the first room of the temple from the temple so people do not spoil the spawn of the temple to farm adamantine.

I like the system, I just don't like that people destroy the spawn of the temple to harvest Adamantine and vice-versa.
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