domains with slavery

[herkles]

Hello,

I am just curious; aside from falkovinia, hazlan and har'kair. are there any other domains that have slavery insititued in the mists?

-herkles

[APorg]

Sri-rajan almost certainly.

Barovia being feudal, it probably has a form of "indentured sevitude" that is slavery in virtually all but name.

[HellsPanda]

Well Nova Vaasa preaches that all who do not serve the Lawgiver will suffer an eternity in the Pit of Slaves

[Bluebomber4evr]

Hello,

I am just curious; aside from falkovinia, hazlan and har'kair. are there any other domains that have slavery insititued in the mists?

-herkles

Those three are the only domains with true slavery. Souragne had slavery in its past but it has been abolished recently.

[Dread]

Keep in mind a lot of domains, while not having institutionalized slavery, have some things that are ... well, nowhere near modern labor practices. Dementlieu has its Dickensian-style workhouses for children, Souragne hasn't improved much since the time of slavery, and Barovians have to toil to pay their taxes

[dutchy]

Hello,

I am just curious; aside from falkovinia, hazlan and har'kair. are there any other domains that have slavery insititued in the mists?

-herkles

Those three are the only domains with true slavery. Souragne had slavery in its past but it has been abolished recently.

really? didnt see it on cnn   or not that recently?    ..sorry tried to resist, am suprised there not more core countries with slavery was common in the olden days no?

[tzaeru]

really? didnt see it on cnn   or not that recently?    ..sorry tried to resist, am suprised there not more core countries with slavery was common in the olden days no?

Ravenloft is not a copy of the real world. Whilst Ravenloft, like most Dungeons & Dragons settings, is clearly inspired by real world mythologies, stories, events and cultures, it's still not the real world.

But aside of that, slavery in the manner it existed in ancient Egypt for example, was not particularly common place in most of Europe during early middle ages, albeit many countries did practice it. In 1500s, few countries fully abolished it and the 1600s were generally quite low on slavery.

Serfdom was used instead and well, peasants didn't live any better than "actual" slaves. In fact, it might be argued that several ancient powers treated slaves better than most European countries treated their peasants during the middle ages.

[Jeebs]

And in modern days we're all slaves to the almighty dollar and the banking cartels... slavery has many forms really, so as someone said above, the Barovians are likely in a similar situation most people in the world today are, where they have to work themselves to death just to be able to pay all the taxes and the costs of living and any other things they might want/need. It actually does sound like a serfdom in many ways if you think about it. I could see indentured servants being in practice in Barovia though, but I don't think there's a very large upper class in the country to support it on a large scale, so it would likely be somewhat rare.

[Bluebomber4evr]

Let's not get into figurative or broad definitions here, guys. This isn't a philosophy class.

[APorg]

Most slavery in olden days tended to be the product of warfare, and invasive war on that scale is rare in Core. Even when it does happen, it's even rarer that major population centres are sacked. The Gundarak invasion was a notable exception but then Srahd chose annexation and assimilation over slavery.

Which probably means that most slaves are born into it; born of slave parents, and probably viewed as cattle by their masters.

Though, again, being a serf is not much different from being a slave: you're the property of your lord, with few if any rights.

[Miuo]

Let's not get into figurative or broad definitions here, guys. This isn't a philosophy class.

Arnt we all slaves in some way. 

[Budly]

People, you need to know the diffrence between slavery and feudal/serfdom/similar systems farmers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serfdom

This was more or less slavery in some nations. Except Sweden, our farmers had crossbows and some what of a voting right. 

[Miuo]

Sweden is a lie. Its not real. (nods)

[Budly]

Sweden is a lie. Its not real. (nods)

Mayhaps we could keep to the subject instead?  [nods]

[Bluebomber4evr]

People, you need to know the diffrence between slavery and feudal/serfdom/similar systems farmers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serfdom

This was more or less slavery in some nations. Except Sweden, our farmers had crossbows and some what of a voting right. 

It's still not exactly the same thing, and that article even explains the (few) differences between the two.

Probably the biggest distinction would be that slaves could be bought and sold while serfs could not.

[Budly]

People, you need to know the diffrence between slavery and feudal/serfdom/similar systems farmers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serfdom

This was more or less slavery in some nations. Except Sweden, our farmers had crossbows and some what of a voting right. 

It's still not exactly the same thing, and that article even explains the (few) differences between the two.

Probably the biggest distinction would be that slaves could be bought and sold while serfs could not.

True, but eastern Europe almost had a slave like system after the Black Death.

While the western farmers became more freely able to pick where to work. They where fewer and in need so t hey could pick a better lord.

Eastern Europe on the other hand, had so few peasants that it became more or less slave like when they where tied to their lord. They where so little they had no choice to make. So those who did work on farms, had a very bad life. And not the option of picking a lord like the western opposite. Barovia might fit in there a bit?

[Bluebomber4evr]

Look, Barovian serfs might have it pretty bad, but they're still not slaves. They have some rights--they can choose who to marry, they can own things (but not own land), and they are not bought and sold.

The original question of the thread was concerning actual, literal slavery, not the "modified slavery" of serfdom, or silly philosophical things like "we're all slaves to money!" I don't see how it's productive to bring up "things that are kind of like slavery, but not really" when that's not what herkles was asking about.

[Amon-Si]

I think, to modify the question, Herk meant: "In what domains is Slavery a common institution, supported by the local lord."

[herkles]

I am aware of what serfdom is; I am a getting a minor in medieval studies after all.

It was as blue said, actual slavery that interested me. I am curious though how long ago was slavery abolished in Scourgne?

[Jeebs]

Heh, I only pointed out the serfdom/indentured servituted thing in case it was related to wanting to RP being a slave to someone.

[Bluebomber4evr]

I am curious though how long ago was slavery abolished in Scourgne?

It was before the domain formed in 635 BC (so a little over a century ago), thus it's part of the domain's "false history."

Before he was drawn into Ravenloft, the domain's darklord, Anton Misroi, had slaves on his plantation outside the city of Sasserine, in the Amedio region of the Greyhawk setting (see Dragon #349 "Beyond Sasserine").