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Author Topic: Crafting tools  (Read 1436 times)

Quartermaster

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Crafting tools
« on: August 20, 2019, 12:18:57 AM »
I have been plugging away learning the various crafting systems and I am thoroughly impressed. Each system seems to have been well thought out fairly logically implemented in the server.

However I have noticed something of an oversight.
The tools to craft in the server all, with the exception of the Alchemy tools and the Herbalist's mortar, seem to sell from the NPCs for a single gold piece. 
The interesting and RP problematic result of this 1 gold price set up is that often these tools are buy - use - then discard.  I have seen carpentry saws, woodworkers kits, mining picks of both sizes, smith hammers, gilding pliers, smelters bellows, leather worker kits, curing knives, and boiler hooks, all left on floor near the craft stations, next to the trash barrels in the craft locations, and at the feet of the NPC's who sell them. Because of this "drop it and leave it" habit the crafting areas tend to get junked up after a few real hours, and can even with enough of these things left around add to the lag problems the server gets after awhile. The IC reason for leaving it seems mainly to come from some sort of idea that, leaving it will benefit some future crafter who can't afford the 1 gp cost of the tool.  I have had 3 separate RP conversations about this behavior with 3 different characters. Each one firmly believed that dropping tools on the floor was no big deal. Each of these conversations took place in the Dverghiem smithy. After the 3rd conversation I realized that it wasn't going to change anything. The reason it won't is simple, the tools are so cheep that they have become disposable. If anyone thinks that is an unfair assessment,  I humbly point out that I have never encountered a free herbalist mortar left for use at any of the herbalist cauldrons, most likely due to the high cost (56 gp) of purchasing one. I have however seen the herbalist mortar, and the Alchemy tools in the regular merchants stores.

I have read other posts about the crafting systems here on the forums and a common early point was the crafting skills are suppose to be a "gold sink" for a PC. I certainly have come to believe that to be true as my PC has spent most of every gold piece found on continuing the craft. I ooc'ly am a cheep miser and hate to spend good money (real or in game) on stuff I already own. So my PC has the same tool he bought to craft with for each crafting disciplines. All the tools he has takes up an entire bag. The entire weight of the tools, Alchemy, Woodworking, Herbalist, and Smithing with the large pickax comes to 9 lbs. In the 40% magic bag it comes to 5. It isn't that much compared to the bags of ore he ends up lugging back to the smithy.

As far as the IC part of this. My dwarf has chosen to live in Dvergheim, and considers it his home. He takes pride in his home and his chosen "profession" as a steel and silver smith. He will continue to remind others, especially non-dwarves to please clean up after themselves. He also hopes that by sticking around Dvergheim that other dwarves will follow suit and maybe something will happen to propel the "Dark Crystal" story line along. OOC'ly I doubt that is going to happen if players continue to treat the NPCs and the areas as non-important.

Thanks for reading please know my intent is to help make things more immersive and fun.

« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 12:22:23 AM by Quartermaster »

Iridni Ren

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Re: Crafting tools
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2019, 12:52:51 AM »
As someone who has posted before about clutter, I really think this is incidental. Consider that it is unlikely more than one of any tool will be left at any work station because thereafter any wishing to use that workstation will use the tool already there.

In contrast, I have found 10 screens of practice crafted goods left in a work station.

I don't think raising the price will help alleviate the problem all that much unless the increase is signficant and that will hurt low levels disproportionately. Crafting--which in my opinion should be a way for low levels to get a leg up, especially those who don't yet have friends because it can be done in relative isolation--would become even more reserved for the higher levels.

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Ryltar/ Robert Archer

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Re: Crafting tools
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2019, 05:04:04 AM »
As someone who carries A LOT of those disposable tools around I know its frustrating to see them so casually discarded. I think alot of it has to do with weight and space management myself rather than price.

MAB77

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Re: Crafting tools
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2019, 07:16:01 AM »
I do find it annoying to find tools on the ground too. As Ryltar said it has more to do with weight, size and space than price really. Even raised a little they would never be expansive to acquire and that would not change the problem. All we can do is try to change the culture and do remind others that crafters really don't need that you leave tools behind. Most carry their own anyways and even if they don't the prices are so cheap as to be inconsequential. So please put them in the trash barrel.

To be frank, the occasional tool on the ground cannot be blamed for causing significant lag on its own, but it does add up over time with anything else dropped on the ground across the server. As it happens, PC Merchants not using boxes or chests is a bigger source of lag, though at least they pick their stuff back after a while. Still you guys should make it a point of honor of using a container.

More irritating to me is those not cleaning their workstations afterward. Not all workstations reset after a while and it is highly disrespectful to your fellow players to leave your 20 pages of byproducts there and force others to clean your own mess.

So please:
1) Anything, anywhere, that needs discarding goes in a trash barrel or an npc corpse. Never on the ground.
2) Crafters, clean up your workstations once done.
3) Merchants, use containers and stop displaying items on the ground.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 07:18:14 AM by MAB77 »
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Dante101

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Re: Crafting tools
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2019, 08:03:24 AM »
As it happens, PC Merchants not using boxes or chests is a bigger source of lag, though at least they pick their stuff back after a while. Still you guys should make it a point of honor of using a container.

More irritating to me is those not cleaning their workstations afterward. Not all workstations reset after a while and it is highly disrespectful to your fellow players to leave your 20 pages of byproducts there and force others to clean your own mess.

So please:
1) Anything, anywhere, that needs discarding goes in a trash barrel or an npc corpse. Never on the ground.
2) Crafters, clean up your workstations once done.
3) Merchants, use containers and stop displaying items on the ground.

Do we have concrete evidence that displaying items on the ground causes lag? That seems like a bizarre claim to me. Wouldnt the same argument be applicable to any sort of placeable in the game?

It seems to me that merchants laying things out on the ground ought to be a minimal source of lag, at best.

EO

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Re: Crafting tools
« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2019, 08:20:04 AM »
As it happens, PC Merchants not using boxes or chests is a bigger source of lag, though at least they pick their stuff back after a while. Still you guys should make it a point of honor of using a container.

More irritating to me is those not cleaning their workstations afterward. Not all workstations reset after a while and it is highly disrespectful to your fellow players to leave your 20 pages of byproducts there and force others to clean your own mess.

So please:
1) Anything, anywhere, that needs discarding goes in a trash barrel or an npc corpse. Never on the ground.
2) Crafters, clean up your workstations once done.
3) Merchants, use containers and stop displaying items on the ground.

Do we have concrete evidence that displaying items on the ground causes lag? That seems like a bizarre claim to me. Wouldnt the same argument be applicable to any sort of placeable in the game?

It seems to me that merchants laying things out on the ground ought to be a minimal source of lag, at best.

Everything that’s non static causes lag in a module, items included.

Iridni Ren

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Re: Crafting tools
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2019, 08:38:16 AM »
The performance hit of having many items on the ground is not that bad. For DM events we often spam in hundreds of the things. I'm not saying go crazy, but this isn't something that needs to be policed by players over each other. If your character really can't stand IC clutter, do something about it IC. If you are more upset by it OOC than IC... go do something else.

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MAB77

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Re: Crafting tools
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2019, 04:16:07 PM »
Oh I agree with Soren. It's not a big deal if you leave some items on the ground, but it is better when you don't.

As for workstations, it is just common sense and plain respect to your fellow players to keep them clean for the next user.
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SardineTheAncestor

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Re: Crafting tools
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2019, 05:00:21 PM »
Could we get a "dump" action that just removes everything from a workstation?

If not, IC solution to an IC problem, I guess.

It would be griefing/passive-aggressive either way when the person comes back and asks why all their stuff has been thrown into the trash/deleted.
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