Author Topic: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.  (Read 1863 times)

Disorder

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Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« on: November 23, 2018, 03:52:04 PM »
Looking at the tendency of implementing 3.5 D&D rules and feats on this server I'd like dev. team to consider changes for the flurry of blows feat.

This what I found to be 3.5 edition flurry:
Quote
When unarmored, a monk may strike with a flurry of blows at the expense of accuracy. When doing so, she may make one extra attack in a round at her highest base attack bonus, but this attack takes a –2 penalty, as does each other attack made that round. The resulting modified base attack bonuses are shown in the Flurry of Blows Attack Bonus column on Table: The Monk. This penalty applies for 1 round, so it also affects attacks of opportunity the monk might make before her next action. When a monk reaches 5th level, the penalty lessens to –1, and at 9th level it disappears. A monk must use a full attack action to strike with a flurry of blows.

Moreover, there's further improvement (Greater Flurry) at lvl 11:
Quote
When a monk reaches 11th level, her flurry of blows ability improves. In addition to the standard single extra attack she gets from flurry of blows, she gets a second extra attack at her full base attack bonus.

Is it possible to alter flurry of blow feats to add the progression I listed above?


EO

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2018, 10:56:08 PM »
Flurry of Blows is hardcoded so it's not possible.

Disorder

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2019, 05:41:42 PM »
Flurry of Blows is hardcoded so it's not possible.

Alright. I can understand that.
Now I have off-topic question.
I've been thinking that the main and the most significant difference between EE and Diamond 1.69 Edition is the possibility to modify any core NWN feat. Am I wrong?
Does EE only allow to add new custom feats?

EO

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2019, 05:48:17 PM »
Flurry of Blows is hardcoded so it's not possible.

Alright. I can understand that.
Now I have off-topic question.
I've been thinking that the main and the most significant difference between EE and Diamond 1.69 Edition is the possibility to modify any core NWN feat. Am I wrong?
Does EE only allow to add new custom feats?

Neither. We could add feats, classes pre-EE and did so. EE gave us new scripting functions that help with new feats and also preloading haks which is major.

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2019, 06:06:12 PM »
And custom shaders, and model scaling, and area instancing, and a huge sack of other massive changes.
Hir yw'r dydd a hir yw'r nos, a hir yw aros Arawn.

Disorder

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2019, 06:24:43 PM »
Quote
EE gave us new scripting functions that help with new feats. 
Does that mean that changes to flurry of blows can be added as completely new feat? Is it possible for monks to receive regular flurry of blows amongst with feat adjusted as per 3.5 progression?

EO

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2019, 06:30:08 PM »
Once again, no.

buyonegetonefree

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #7 on: January 01, 2019, 06:43:45 PM »
Once again, no.

Could you provide a bit more detailed explanation? I am not versed in NWN toolset and coding.

Philos

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2019, 06:53:14 PM »
Basically, anything that is a combat mode or modulal action cannot be changed as I understand. This includes power attack, expertise, dirty fighting, rapid shot, etc.

EO

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2019, 07:02:40 PM »
Basically, anything that is a combat mode or modulal action cannot be changed as I understand. This includes power attack, expertise, dirty fighting, rapid shot, etc.

Essentially. These are all hardcoded and can’t be messed with. The closest I got was Unorthodox Flurry but only because it’s an unused feat from the Disciple of Shou PrC, one of the two PrCs that were cut from the game.

Destinysdesire

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2019, 07:03:45 PM »
Basically, anything that is a combat mode or modulal action cannot be changed as I understand. This includes power attack, expertise, dirty fighting, rapid shot, etc.

This is actually false, it CAN be done, but it takes a fair bit of effort on the part of the Devs, what COULD be offered instead is what Arelith does.

Kensai
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Shadow Mage

Different classes based on base classes with specific benefits and consequences. Using the Shadow Mage as an example of this..a class could be made to duplicate this using the Dark Powers...Again this is the Shadow Mage as made on Arelith with the custom pros and cons:

Shadow (Weave) Mage is a path for Wizard and Sorcerer characters. It can be obtained after creating your character via selection on the path menu in the starter area, or by talking to a special NPC IG, which is strictly IG information.

Restrictions
A Shadow Mage uses the Shadow Weave to power their spells. This means:
They cannot cast any Evocation spell and Evocation epic spells. However, they can cast Darkness.
They cannot become Wild Mages (or take any other wizard/sorcerer subclass), and are not affected by Wild Magic zones.
They cannot cast arcane spells if their deity is not Shar.

Bonuses
May take levels in Shadowdancer without meeting the usual skill and feat requirements. Instead of gaining Sneak Attack from their shadow, Shadow Mages get +1 caster level per Shadowdancer level.
Shadow Mages get +2 DC on all Illusion, Enchantment and Necromancy spells.
At Wizard/Sorcerer level 20, they are granted the Hide in Plain Sight feat.

EO

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2019, 07:08:07 PM »
I feel like I do this every once in a while. DestinysDesire, if you know a way to edit the combat modes please share it with us since you obviously know better. As for what Arelith does it’s not particularly complex, just scripting/retooling things that aren’t hardcoded. It’s not something we want to pursue though in that vein but we already do it for custom classes.

Philos

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #12 on: January 01, 2019, 07:09:01 PM »
Can you elaborate a bit more on how these combat modes can be modified Destinysdesire?

Destinysdesire

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2019, 07:17:53 PM »
I personally am not a scripter, though I have spoken with other Devs in the past on other servers that actually have done this, its still scripting and to my understanding required a LOT of manipulation of the coding. Instead of demanding the Devs do this though, I offered an alternative to what might be easier and more efficient rather then waste literal months trying to do this. This has been answered though in EO's response

" It’s not something we want to pursue though in that vein but we already do it for custom classes."

That's fine, it was simply a suggestion.

EO

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Re: Improvement for the flurry of blows. Greater flurry.
« Reply #14 on: January 01, 2019, 07:41:29 PM »
I personally am not a scripter, though I have spoken with other Devs in the past on other servers that actually have done this, its still scripting and to my understanding required a LOT of manipulation of the coding. Instead of demanding the Devs do this though, I offered an alternative to what might be easier and more efficient rather then waste literal months trying to do this. This has been answered though in EO's response

" It’s not something we want to pursue though in that vein but we already do it for custom classes."

That's fine, it was simply a suggestion.

Once again, and as someone who's been scripting and modding this game for the past 15 years, it's not feasible. It's actually been one of the most highly demanded features of Beamdog for EE but even they have put it in their Icebox, meaning it's not something they will make possible in any short or far future because of the complexity of it (https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/67761/the-allow-customization-of-hardcoded-feats-card-discussion
).

Now, if you know people who can do it when neither us nor Beamdog can, well invite them to reach out to me, I'd be all ears. Until then, I'll assume it's an unsubstantiated claim.