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Author Topic: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind  (Read 997 times)

Always_a_hero

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Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« on: January 27, 2018, 12:03:27 AM »
I've made a new character recently and through the hard times of low-leveling I got curious about the feats.

"Once per day, as a free action, the character may heal a number of hit points equal to his Constitution modifier (minimum of 1)." Of course, being healed for a constitution modifier might not seem like a good deal to make for a feat: the maximum constitution one could have would be 25 base + 7 with max con buff + 10 with barbarian rage, + plus maybe some shapeshifting and some UMD things, so I'd suppose the maximum one could get at lvl 20 would be about 30 HP, which is not half of what the said barbarian would gain with his/her rage con. boost. So I thought to myself "maybe you can use it when your unconscious", so I tried, even if it sounds ridiculous, and it didn't work. Worse than that, I get called a witch by local Barovians for a feat which heals 2 hp, but that's another story.

All that to say that no non-healing classes would take such a feat at the moment. My first suggestion would be to augment the healing power of the feat. Though I don't know the full capabilities of the system, I thought of using the 5th ed DnD player handbook (as I believe the feat was taken from) and simply adapt it to the online game, considering the HP per lvl is not the same as the table game.

It would go as followed:

"Once per day, as a free action, the character may heal a number of hit points equal to its hit dice(i.e. character lvl) + its Constitution modifier (minimum of 1)."

Another idea would've been to replace the amount healed by:
(A fourth of the hit dice+1)*(the class hit dice i.e. 1d12 for Barbarians or 1d10 for Fighters)+ the constitution mod., but I doubt it would work.

Also, to remove it's spell property, as the character would heal from his/her inner "pool of stamina", as I believe it's said in the 5th ed.

Thank you for considering.
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Pav

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2018, 12:25:04 AM »
You can only increase an ability by an additional 12 points over your base, so the maximum healing someone would receive from this feat is 13.

Using the 5th edition feat would be a little against the spirit of the server as a 3.x experience but that is up to the Development team -- not to mention balancing for 5e and 3.x is leagues apart.

Overall, I do agree that the feat is pretty bad and nonsensical if it can't be used while downed, which is probably its best application -- make it so it specifically does not stop bleeding, but rather just delays your bleedout period.

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aprogressivist

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2018, 10:04:04 AM »
Hmm, yeah. If the Feat can't be used when you're unconscious, then it's pretty useless. That's the only reason I'd even consider taking it. Might have to check whether that's a bug.
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aprogressivist

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2018, 10:17:29 AM »
And yeah, the feat shouldn't appear as a spell to frighten locals... :/
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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2018, 12:57:51 PM »
Hmm, yeah. If the Feat can't be used when you're unconscious, then it's pretty useless. That's the only reason I'd even consider taking it. Might have to check whether that's a bug.

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aprogressivist

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2018, 01:29:21 PM »
OK, maybe I'm misunderstanding something here, but here's the feat as written on the forum:

Quote
Second Wind

Type of Feat: General
Prerequisite: None.
Specifics: The character can shrug off minor wounds with ease. Once per day, as a free action, he may heal a number of hit points equal to his Constitution modifier (minimum 1), even when unconscious. This feat does not work for non-living creatures and does not stabilize unconscious characters.
Use: Selected.

Emphasis added by me.

I'd understand that to mean that you could use Second Wind while bleeding out; that if you did so, say, at -9, it would put you up to, say, -7 (assuming CON 14), but not stabilise you -- so you're still bleeding out, just have a few more rolls to hope you do stabilise.

If you can't use it as such, then its usefulness is dramatically reduced.
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EO

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2018, 01:40:41 PM »
I changed that today actually. I like Pav's idea that you can use it while unconscious without stabilizing (unless you go above 0 HP obviously). Also it won't trigger OcR reaction s anymore.

Juxtaposition

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2018, 06:49:52 PM »
I changed that today actually. I like Pav's idea that you can use it while unconscious without stabilizing (unless you go above 0 HP obviously). Also it won't trigger OcR reaction s anymore.

But how would it work, exactly? To be specific, will the script that stabilizes someone when they are healed simply not fire if it is by self-healing, or? And will it be changed to a supernatural ability, for the last point?

Either way, :cheer: :cheer: :cheer:
« Last Edit: January 27, 2018, 06:56:36 PM by Juxtaposition »

Syl

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2018, 06:24:12 PM »
I don't mean to brign this back to life but i have to comment after putzing around a bit I thought about taking the feat on my tiefling fighter thinking it might help until realizing it is a very useless feat. It's about as useless as the Literate feat for barbarians. But i wont linger on that.

Second wind should be more useful.  I don't recall off the top of my head if it is a class specific feat, or a open feat for all. but it should be more useful then just your con mod. most people are averaging a 14-16 con. meaning they are really only getting back 2-3 hp... which is a mouse fart.

it can be used while unconscious? great, means i take longer to bleed out for people to save me.

I agree with Always_a_Hero in that it should add in your level as well. or at worst half your level.  this makes it turly more a "Second wind." and not a "Kiss booboo."

or even make it function as 1d6+ con mod+ half level

( though i really see this as more a fighter feat then anything but [shrugs] )

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Arawn

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2018, 09:05:57 PM »
It gives you more chances to stabilize—ask anyone bleeding out alone and tell me that’s not useful!
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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2018, 10:04:18 AM »
I've bleed out countless times, as has everyone else..

I don't mean to bash the person who made the feat but it is truely a useless feat. Those  average 2 points of hp. Are practically useless, especially more so if it can't get you back up to your feet.

If I was that worried on bleeding out I would just get die hard.

If you intend to use it as just a way to prolong death, then just name it "prolong death." and not have such a skill be advertised incorrectly.

Second wind is pulling from your inner stamina reserves, or fighting spirit. Allowing you to go just go a little further.

The feat we get is either named incorrectly, or it is just another feat that's only helpful at level 1 in a combat situation where you would actually a second wind. Because by the time you hit level four, you have anywhere from 24-56 hp ranging from a wizard to a barbarian with 14 con and no toughness. Where that tiny 2 hp return can hardly if even truely be classified as useful.


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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2018, 11:55:17 AM »
It does get you back on your feet if you heal enough damage to get to 0 or more but it won’t stabilize you. It’s not for all builds either. Healing two points when you’re below 0 is equivalent to 20% more chances to recover (40% if you have Diehard), which is significant.

DM Raven

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2018, 12:47:12 PM »
For me it is a very useful feat, in it's current state, it is not the actual number of points that is important, the feat in itself is something that can be roleplayed around also, the number of points maybe small but a few times i have been lying there wanting to hang on to that last point just in case there is that chance. Or i just need a point or two to get than final swing in before the enemy drops...  just one swing...

misses the swing and collapses....[takes a deep shuddering breath trying to hold on]....

So for me the mechanics while minor can at that point in time be critical and it is that every little chance of hanging on too life (or defeating the enemy while your left on that 1-2 points) that is what the feat is all about, no matter how insignificant it may seem.

Iridni Ren

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Re: Proposition for feat adjustment: Second Wind
« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2018, 02:11:55 PM »
Increasing the HP received based on level could make it very OP.

Perhaps a small tweak of 1D4 additional HP would make it stronger but not too strong because of the uncertainty involved and lack of scaling.

It would be a very good feat for low levels then and not as useful at high, but at high you have more feats to burn.

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