Mist Camp

[McNastea]

Unsettling is how it was described to me, and after entering the area for the first time since it was altered-I have to say I agree!

Not that it isn't well done, and kinda neat if you can get over the... oddness of it-it's just that, well....



 

Really though, out of curiosity, what was the reason the area was changed anyway?

[QuitFightingCats]

What baffles me is that the Vistani Caravan Master is still right next to the main place where PCs congregate, so the conversation spam still floods the screen - especially if a caravan is out and someone checks the NPC every two seconds to see if a caravan is ready. 

If the areas are to be split, then can they at least be split so that the NPC for the caravans is moved a bit out of the social spot range?

[FinalHeaven]

I think the intent is to show that outsiders shouldn't really be loitering right inside the Vistani part of the camp.  

Though since the overall rules laid down by the Vistani seem to still apply even in the outsider area, I'm not sure it matters much.  I'd almost say the better idea would be to have one area just with the caravan where you embark/disembark, then a transition into the actual camp area.  That solves the pesky NPC dialogue situation as well.

[Soren / Zarathustra217]

Yeah, FinalHeaven has it right. I did consider moving the caravan to the other area as well, but that would eliminate the natural traffic through the place that generate roleplay encounters.

It's the first revision though, so expect more improvements. Suggestions are welcome too :-)

[Olywynn]

I would suggest a return of the randomly spawned in caravans of Vistani.  Perhaps at a couple Vistani guards in the area, to remind the outlanders that they're being watched.

[EO]

I would suggest a return of the randomly spawned in caravans of Vistani.  Perhaps at a couple Vistani guards in the area, to remind the outlanders that they're being watched.

Part of the reason why we removed most NPCs was to make the area more dynamic. You can more easily kill another PC there than before, which should make it feel a bit less like an OOC safe haven from any form of external conflict.

[Olywynn]

Hm, true enough.

[Blight]

Isn't the fact that the Vistani won't let you use their caravans ever again if you spill blood doing the same thing anyways?

[MJ_Johansson]

Should change the sign to not state no violence as a rule if you ask me, maybe change it to something like do not damage vistani property? Might help make people less affraid to engage in PvP conflict within the mist camp.

[whatdoesitmater]

So, after seeing the new camp, I am left scratching my head. I get the visitors shouldn't be in the main camp idea, but 2 areas, (plus interiors) begin to make it more a town feel, than a camp. I preferred it as one outdoor area. The original had 3-4 circles of Vistani wagons- I thought that this was good- though un-utilized. It was my opinion, that each wagon circle should have been the departure for one realm that the Vistani Visit- One would go to Har-Akir, a different wagon, in another circle would go to port..

The visitors tent, and bench location needs to be moved further away from, but not out of sight of, the NPCs. The spam of conversation for the wagon ruins immersion- though not enough to make anyone quit spamming it. Maybe setting the wagon captain to whisper?

Over all, I dislike the mist camp- It is too much of a safe zone, let's go afk till something happens place.

I believe a check should be added to the wagon travel system, where if a PC tries to book passage on the wagon, and it is already in use, that it should check if there is just one PC in it. If so speed up the travel time for the one PC. The wagon system is suppose to be an RP enhancement, yet it's more of annoyance than anything. Especially when after waiting for the wagon to show up, only one PC pops out.

[herkles]

of course the problem is that people have a wrong view of the vistai as the good guys who are only distrusted in Invidia, and where their main role is to be carvaneers througout the wold. You add that to the image that the mist camp is perfectly safe and you have a recipe for a pseudo-OOC area.

Personally I would have removed it and make people rely on the domains themselves more. Or if you want to keep them there. Have it if you are there for over an hour you get randomly telaported to a mist zone not in the vistani camp.

[McNastea]

I would suggest a return of the randomly spawned in caravans of Vistani.  Perhaps at a couple Vistani guards in the area, to remind the outlanders that they're being watched.

Part of the reason why we removed most NPCs was to make the area more dynamic. You can more easily kill another PC there than before, which should make it feel a bit less like an OOC safe haven from any form of external conflict.

I'd definitely change the sign then if that's the case, even without them there, there's still the captain in sight and as it is it's pretty clear the vistani don't want you to fight. Just making there be less of them but keeping the rules the same doesn't really make it clear that fighting is okay

[Iconoclast]

I'd also suggest we give it a try, moving the Vistani npc to the main camp, leaving the visitor's tent outside of the npc area, opening the mid-high level hub to pvp and mpc involvement. The sign can be changed to only protect the actual Vistani camp, not the visitor's area.

The Vistani would not want outlanders, especially those running away from violence, to loiter within their camp alongside their very own children and families, at least not without permission and some form of agreement.

[Feronius]

I thought the entire open area within the mists was considered the Vistani camp, meaning literally everything in between the surrounding mists, including the visitor tent.
It just seems doubtful that the Vistani would tolerate any kind of conflict or violence taking place within the area, even if it is not directly next to their own tents and vardo.

Have not seen the new layout yet, but planning to pass through Dementlieu soon again. So I am bound to see the changes eventually.

[Geiger]

Here is how you should always deal with a situation like this - Do you want to do PvP in the mist camp?

Ask for a DM.

If they say they can and will watch to accurately portray the NPCs - you can!

If they they say no, you'll just have to wait for another moment.

If you want to be more subtle and plotty about it you'll need to try and find a way to arrange that with the Vistani...

That is quite literally all you have to do!

[Miuo]

Here is how you should always deal with a situation like this - Do you want to do PvP in the mist camp?

Ask for a DM.

Issue with that is, you then have to have everyone stop what they are doing and wait to see if a DM happens to be on and reply's to you. If not you have to force a interaction in which both sides just walk away from the rp. I think the proposed idea of changing the camp rules to being pretty much "Dont damage vistani property" to be more ideal and rp friendly then having to wait on a dm to continue any rp.

[Geiger]

No, you don't - just obey the NPC rules when you're in the mist camp. lol.

Sometimes you have to let OOC influence the IC because you can't always do everything you want because of rules and limitations. It's part of being on a PW.

Yes a DM overseeing conflict there is conditional.

But you can also get things like permission to do an attack there, or to catch someone, or whatever. Just needs to be done through a DM. Doesn't necessarily need overwatch...

[Iconoclast]

Having a dm present for hostile actions in the mid-high level up of the mist camp, doesn't solve the problem, however. At least it hasn't for me, in my attempts to involve my mpc in the mid-high level hub. Dm involvement in other matters of pvp in proximity to npcs, has always been an option that I have good experience with, however. The Mist Camp, however, is a different bird.

From an mpc perspective, the mid-high level hub of the mist camp is a hostile free zone even if it is possible to have dm supervision.

Unless if my mpc, or any character, is willing to become unwelcomed by the Vistani, he can only be hostile in situations in which the Vistani give their permission.

My mpc approached the Vistani to attempt to receive their permission, but was charged something like 80k.  Of course, mpcs are not intended to be used for dungeoning, so I didn't make any effort to start farming for coin or treasure to be able to afford conflict with someone in the mist camp.

At the moment, the mid-high level up is not conducive to mpc or conflict dynamics, which is why I'm curious to see if our developers can come up with a viable alternative to the Mist Camp areas.

[herkles]

At the moment, the mid-high level up is not conducive to mpc or conflict dynamics, which is why I'm curious to see if our developers can come up with a viable alternative to the Mist Camp areas.

Its called Dementlieu, Hazlan, Blauestien, and so on. I think being based out of those domains would bring much more rp then being based in the mist camp. and More chances for dynamics.

[Iconoclast]

Using other domains is another topic, herkles.

I could expand on how mpc vampire play translates into using other domains other than Barovia, but that would be off topic, and I'd rather keep this thread focused on how the current set up of the Vistani's Mist Camp affects dynamics.


 

[julienchab]

One thing i learned today is taht you can steal people in the mist camp and getting out of it without any consequences

[Legion XXI]

One thing i learned today is taht you can steal people in the mist camp and getting out of it without any consequences

I don't know what this is about but I can pretty much guess and say that this line of conversation shouldn't be taking place on the open forums.  If you think a rule was broken, or something was done wrong, or are just uncomfortable with how things turned out, contact the CC and voice your complaints privately.  It's never constructive to do it in public, people feel like they're being attacked and it usually gets out of hand.

[Geiger]

One thing i learned today is taht you can steal people in the mist camp and getting out of it without any consequences

I don't know what this is about but I can pretty much guess and say that this line of conversation shouldn't be taking place on the open forums.  If you think a rule was broken, or something was done wrong, or are just uncomfortable with how things turned out, contact the CC and voice your complaints privately.  It's never constructive to do it in public, people feel like they're being attacked and it usually gets out of hand.

Indeed. Repeated violations of this can even result in the removal of forum privileges so please be considerate to your fellows and when you have concerns bring them up with the CC and the staff. Do not air dirty laundry in public.

Else I will show you pictures of my underwear.

[herkles]

One thing i learned today is taht you can steal people in the mist camp and getting out of it without any consequences

I don't know what this is about but I can pretty much guess and say that this line of conversation shouldn't be taking place on the open forums.  If you think a rule was broken, or something was done wrong, or are just uncomfortable with how things turned out, contact the CC and voice your complaints privately.  It's never constructive to do it in public, people feel like they're being attacked and it usually gets out of hand.

Indeed. Repeated violations of this can even result in the removal of forum privileges so please be considerate to your fellows and when you have concerns bring them up with the CC and the staff. Do not air dirty laundry in public.

Else I will show you pictures of my underwear.

listen to treason. no one wants to see him in his underwear.

[APorg]

listen to treason. no one wants to see him in his underwear.