Author Topic: Summoning Spells  (Read 5496 times)

RedwizardD

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #25 on: February 26, 2014, 05:42:41 PM »
Trying raising the amount of rounds/level, and that should be a good compromise.

That would be nice.

Budly

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #26 on: February 26, 2014, 06:16:38 PM »
Mayhaps. In an out of combat "script" where they stay the full 24 Hour to symbolise that they ARE creature stuck here.

I had awesome RP with summons before. DMs controlling them and doing fun stuff, Slaads, succubus, imps. All that stuff. Frogson and Arcu want to discuss the planes!  :cry:

Crimson Shuriken

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #27 on: February 26, 2014, 07:28:51 PM »
Mayhaps. In an out of combat "script" where they stay the full 24 Hour to symbolise that they ARE creature stuck here.

I had awesome RP with summons before. DMs controlling them and doing fun stuff, Slaads, succubus, imps. All that stuff. Frogson and Arcu want to discuss the planes!  :cry:
A summon killed the character in your signature following a rp scene  :twisted:


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swbf2lord

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #28 on: February 26, 2014, 07:31:05 PM »
Mayhaps. In an out of combat "script" where they stay the full 24 Hour to symbolise that they ARE creature stuck here.

I had awesome RP with summons before. DMs controlling them and doing fun stuff, Slaads, succubus, imps. All that stuff. Frogson and Arcu want to discuss the planes!  :cry:

I want to say another server does this. Where the counter for their rounds/level only begins when combat is entered.

BahamutZ3RO

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #29 on: February 26, 2014, 08:18:29 PM »
Mayhaps. In an out of combat "script" where they stay the full 24 Hour to symbolise that they ARE creature stuck here.

I had awesome RP with summons before. DMs controlling them and doing fun stuff, Slaads, succubus, imps. All that stuff. Frogson and Arcu want to discuss the planes!  :cry:

I want to say another server does this. Where the counter for their rounds/level only begins when combat is entered.

This would make me so happy.
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Dread

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #30 on: February 26, 2014, 09:53:32 PM »
I think the idea being thrown around of summons lasting until they enter combat is a really good one, but I wonder... is it possible for summons to stick around after the duration's over and simply have them go hostile? It would be wonderful yet simple way to reflect the nature of creatures conjured into the Demiplane of Dread.

It doesn't matter if what you summon is a hound archon or whatever, he's going to be pissed off at you for bringing him to a demiplane where he's now trapped and pulling him away from whatever business he was preoccupied with before.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2014, 09:56:08 PM by Vengeful Seraphim »

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #31 on: February 26, 2014, 10:08:48 PM »
Clarification: As far as I am aware, in PnP, the spell Gate is the only one that actually brings outsiders in from their native plane, via a one-way portal. But I you're using something like Planar Ally or Greater Planar Binding, you're still summoning an outsider albeit one that's been in the Demiplane for a while - if anything, it's probably been made corrupt by its extended stay, and would still be pissed off that you summoned it.

LackofCertainty

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #32 on: February 27, 2014, 09:04:48 PM »
I feel like DM's are the way to go if you want to rp out an extended encounter with a summon as has already been said.  Summons are short duration combat spells, not pets that hang around all day for you to play with.  (for that you need an animal companion or a familiar. :P)

To put it another way, if I wanted to rp out an extended scene where I light parts of the town on fire with fireballs, I'd ask the DM's for help.  I wouldn't ask for fireball to make a 24 hour zone of fire to make my rp work.  ;)

BahamutZ3RO

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #33 on: February 27, 2014, 09:37:09 PM »
I feel like DM's are the way to go if you want to rp out an extended encounter with a summon as has already been said.  Summons are short duration combat spells, not pets that hang around all day for you to play with.  (for that you need an animal companion or a familiar. :P)

To put it another way, if I wanted to rp out an extended scene where I light parts of the town on fire with fireballs, I'd ask the DM's for help.  I wouldn't ask for fireball to make a 24 hour zone of fire to make my rp work.  ;)

DMs have a lot of things to deal with, it's a big server, and they're not always going to be inclined to help a player with such a minor request. May as well give players the ability to enable summon RP themselves, since it isn't like you're actually asking for a drastic change (like modifying a spell to set things on fire).
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swbf2lord

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #34 on: February 27, 2014, 10:25:34 PM »
As Bahamut said, it's often hard to find a DM who's online, and when they're online, one who's not busy with other things. Sometimes RP happens spur of the moment, you don't want everything choreographed, otherwise it becomes less fun, and more forced.

RedwizardD

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #35 on: February 28, 2014, 12:15:17 AM »
We also already have options for roleplaying with summons in a limited aspect through the @summon command.

LackofCertainty

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #36 on: February 28, 2014, 10:22:09 PM »
DMs have a lot of things to deal with, it's a big server, and they're not always going to be inclined to help a player with such a minor request. May as well give players the ability to enable summon RP themselves, since it isn't like you're actually asking for a drastic change (like modifying a spell to set things on fire).

I'm not sure how much of a drastic change it would be.  I know that the "don't start summon duration until combat starts" idea was suggested... years ago I think?  I figured that the reason why it hasn't been implemented is because it's something that's hard to implement.   (since it'd require some custom scripting at the least I'd think?)

Also, you have to consider the added power that such a change would make.  One of the biggest fears of a mage is to be caught unprepared.  It's a lot harder to surprise a mage when they have a summoned guardian who basically lasts forever until combat starts.  I know I'd sure as hell think twice before attacking someone if they were constantly followed by a hound archon.  ;)


If you want to do some custom rp with a summon, it should be a significant scene for your character and preferably others as well.  If you're planning such a significant scene, get a DM to help.  Wanting to make your short term combat summon last long longer for rp reasons is... kinda cheesy.   It'd be like a cleric asking for divine power to last until combat started, so they have more time to rp with the massive str it grants.  Part of the downside of short duration spells is that they have a short duration.  You don't have time to stand around and flex while you're using divine power; you cast it, beat some things to death, and then it runs out.   

And if you want to do spur of the moment rp with the summons, then try to work around their short duration.

Summon a dire wolf, then emote:
*The snarling wolf leaps at McBadGuy.  Just before it makes contact, McWizard snaps his fingers, and the beast disappears*
Then unsummon the wolf.

^You've effectively threatened McBadGuy with your summon, and it didn't require any extra dev/DM work to make it happen.

BahamutZ3RO

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #37 on: March 01, 2014, 03:04:01 PM »
DMs have a lot of things to deal with, it's a big server, and they're not always going to be inclined to help a player with such a minor request. May as well give players the ability to enable summon RP themselves, since it isn't like you're actually asking for a drastic change (like modifying a spell to set things on fire).

I'm not sure how much of a drastic change it would be.  I know that the "don't start summon duration until combat starts" idea was suggested... years ago I think?  I figured that the reason why it hasn't been implemented is because it's something that's hard to implement.   (since it'd require some custom scripting at the least I'd think?)

Also, you have to consider the added power that such a change would make.  One of the biggest fears of a mage is to be caught unprepared.  It's a lot harder to surprise a mage when they have a summoned guardian who basically lasts forever until combat starts.  I know I'd sure as hell think twice before attacking someone if they were constantly followed by a hound archon.  ;)


If you want to do some custom rp with a summon, it should be a significant scene for your character and preferably others as well.  If you're planning such a significant scene, get a DM to help.  Wanting to make your short term combat summon last long longer for rp reasons is... kinda cheesy.   It'd be like a cleric asking for divine power to last until combat started, so they have more time to rp with the massive str it grants.  Part of the downside of short duration spells is that they have a short duration.  You don't have time to stand around and flex while you're using divine power; you cast it, beat some things to death, and then it runs out.  

And if you want to do spur of the moment rp with the summons, then try to work around their short duration.

Summon a dire wolf, then emote:
*The snarling wolf leaps at McBadGuy.  Just before it makes contact, McWizard snaps his fingers, and the beast disappears*
Then unsummon the wolf.

^You've effectively threatened McBadGuy with your summon, and it didn't require any extra dev/DM work to make it happen.

There are classes like Palemaster, which primarily get a number of summons that are useless (19 hp, 12 AC) for anything short of RP. The duration change doesn't seem that big a deal to me, given that other servers have already implemented it. Aside from the potential of a bit of work going into it, there isn't any real downside to this change that I can see.

Quote
It's a lot harder to surprise a mage when they have a summoned guardian who basically lasts forever until combat starts.

This rings false to me, because anyone walking through the Outskirts with a hound archon behind them is going to be lynched in seconds - and even a hound archon isn't going to save them.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2014, 03:06:30 PM by BahamutZ3RO »
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Theorem Of Neutrality

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #38 on: July 08, 2014, 02:35:22 PM »
I think the idea being thrown around of summons lasting until they enter combat is a really good one, but I wonder... is it possible for summons to stick around after the duration's over and simply have them go hostile? It would be wonderful yet simple way to reflect the nature of creatures conjured into the Demiplane of Dread.

It doesn't matter if what you summon is a hound archon or whatever, he's going to be pissed off at you for bringing him to a demiplane where he's now trapped and pulling him away from whatever business he was preoccupied with before.

Might mean I could finally play that Master of Shrouds...
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Dire Corby

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #39 on: July 09, 2014, 04:11:48 AM »
I think we can all agree that Mordenkainen's Sword and Black Blade of Disaster are perfectly fine the way they are and don't need an enhanced duration.  Not much call for RP with a shimmering plane of force anyway  :P

Oh, and Elemental Swarm is quite burly also, not having had the duration nerfed due to the "repeated summon" nature of the spell.

Indigocell

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #40 on: July 09, 2014, 06:37:57 PM »
Yes, it is mostly the regular summon spells that are not really worthwhile in my opinion.

BahamutZ3RO

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Re: Summoning Spells
« Reply #41 on: July 09, 2014, 07:31:09 PM »
つ ◕_◕ ༽つ GIVE Palemaster durations!
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