Author Topic: Languages & PoTM  (Read 15473 times)

Sorrow00

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Languages & PoTM
« on: May 07, 2013, 06:06:56 PM »
I have quite abit on my mind right now about the server, including . .

1) Languages
2) Racial Concepts


I know im relatively new to this server, have only been playing here for a month and a few days at best, but i have been roleplaying for quite a long while over several games and years. (Arelith, Game: Champions Online, DnD, Dark Heresy warhammer 40k)
So, to start off this, I have both a Outlander fey, and a Native barovian from the village.
I have noticed, that the native language of Barovia, is being spoken by a great deal of outlanders, hins, elves, and so on, whats the point of being a local and speaking in our native tongue when everybody supposively knows it. Languages are supposed to be a difficult thing to manage and learn , More so when its Balok, and Barovians will probably not teach outlanders their tongue, finding it offensive and an insult to their country. This also includes people switching their languages or known languages whenever the hell they feel like it to suit their rp.

Geiger

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2013, 06:09:09 PM »
you can't stop them, just deal with it in terms of roleplay and have fun

post less

enjoy life

literally we've no mechanism but roleplay in which to deal with this and in extreme cases of just DERRRRRRR

it's up to the staff, IE, DMs to mete out justice.

peace

Boots

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2013, 06:10:34 PM »
^

Usually, I just log to avoid the explosion of frustration I feel. Sometimes you just wanna bitch about the outlanders with another local in your home tongue, y'know?


Badelaire

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2013, 06:23:55 PM »
I always find the use of the word outlander by supposed "native" players rather over-used. I think they really mean "non-Ravenloft origin PC" as opposed to one of the many others from the various domains who would no doubt speak Balok fluently or as a second language as it is the oldest and most widespread language in the setting. It's also a rather narrow perception to think everyone plays their Barovian native PC's as the usual cliché "LADUL OUTLANDERS" type or that a PC wouldn't be able to learn other languages if they have the intelligence score to reflect that. My own had actual "How to speak Balok" books on him at one time and had no less than 3 tutors, Barovian, Dementlieuse and Richemuloise who taught him the language and another was exposed to a lot of it as a result of where he worked his was barely passable and reflected a lack of tutelage. Don't be so over-concerned with what everyone else is doing and just have fun. I also suggest grabbing copies of the Gazeteers which are generally found in PDF free with some google help and doing some thorough reading.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 06:27:48 PM by Badelaire »

Erebus

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2013, 06:25:11 PM »
Quote
and Barovians will probably not teach outlanders their tongue, finding it offensive and an insult to their country.

Balok is also the mother tongue of Borca, G'Henna, Invidia and also spoken as a lingua franca in Hazlan, Kartakass, Richemulot, Sithicus, Verbrek


Any of which would not care and/or encourage teaching of Balok.

dutchy

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2013, 06:26:10 PM »
I always find the use of the word outlander by supposed "native" players rather over-used. I think they really mean "non-Ravenloft origin PC" as opposed to one of the many others from the various domains who would no doubt speak Balok fluently or as a second language as it is the oldest and most widespread language in the setting. It's also a rather narrow perception to think everyone plays their Barovian native PC's as the usual cliché "LADUL OUTLANDERS" type or that a PC wouldn't be able to learn other languages if they have the intelligence score to reflect that. My own had actual "How to speak Balok" books on him at one time and had no less than 3 tutors, Barovian, Dementlieuse and Richemuloise who taught him the language and another was exposed to a lot of it as a result of where he worked though can barely get by. Don't be so over-concerned with what everyone else is doing and just have fun.

what this guy means is you mean well but stand up walk to a mirror look in it and the one that looks back at you in that mirror thats the one you should be thinking about and worry about.

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Mihas Mandruleanu- He is the law
Gurdan- priest of the allfather, and current head of the silverhand trading company

Badelaire

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2013, 06:43:02 PM »
And not forgetting any Barovian with some self-respect wouldn't stand in the middle of a throng of outlanders (See: Non-native of the domain you're currently in), scowl and go " Stupid outlander doo doo heads." in Balok if they didn't want to incur some trouble. We know what those pesky people are like.

Dusk

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2013, 06:43:25 PM »
Regardless of my character's intelligence score, I only have them begin to learn a new language if they have a tutor or some method of studying the language, and it takes at least six months IRL before they are able to speak it with some fluency. Generally speaking, my characters won't learn more than one new language unless their intelligence score is 18+. Even then, I won't ever have them learn languages simultaneously. Those are the rules I follow, and with Constance three months into learning Balok, with the help of Zavier's translation volumes, it's pretty fun having her screw up what she's trying to say.

By no means do I expect everyone to follow my rule, but when characters speak fifteen foreign languages, or learn new languages in an absurdly short amount of time, I generally avoid RP with that character.

dutchy

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2013, 06:45:57 PM »
at times i do it with my barovian that he doesnt get certain words, or that he has trouble prenouncing names.

Tagdar Stonebeard- the lone statue
Mihas Mandruleanu- He is the law
Gurdan- priest of the allfather, and current head of the silverhand trading company

Norture

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #9 on: May 07, 2013, 06:46:07 PM »
If you found yourself stranded in a new country, wouldn't you make an effort to learn the local language? I don't know why people are surprised that smart outsiders try to learn the language.

Elfric

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2013, 06:54:10 PM »
From what I recall of the languages in the Ravenloft campaign, your character know your domain/realm's tongue and anything beyond that [Isn't common] you'd need a +1 intel to learn another language. So yeah, when someone keeps going back and forth in different dialects and lacks the intelligence stat wise... I can see the frustration.

"You left the campfire back in the field. The entire grass field is on fire. Smokey the Bear is on the edge of the field, on his knees, sobbing into his hands."

Badelaire

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #11 on: May 07, 2013, 06:54:31 PM »
^

I've generally gone off the intelligence score modifier for languages known rule and exposure/tutelage in any new languages if there's a free "slot" to learn a new one they don't start off with. For example, I have a high int Paridonian who can only speak Common and Zherisian as he's never been exposed to languages from the Core in any lengthy capacity. Others like the one I mentioned before can speak passable Balok because they were taught. Any PC I have with 10 int or less isn't going to be learning any new languages fluently enough to be understood.

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« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 06:58:01 PM by Badelaire »

HoshaZilo

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2013, 06:55:00 PM »
If you found yourself stranded in a new country, wouldn't you make an effort to learn the local language? I don't know why people are surprised that smart outsiders try to learn the language.

One of President what's his face's characters was actually selling Balok dictionaries it would be quite easy for any outlander with 16+ int (just a random number) to learn with that resource

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2013, 08:01:16 PM »
if my characters are from beyond the land of mists, then as a general personal preference I have them never capable of speaking Balok or any other language from Ravenloft, but in the end its personal preference.   
However, most of my Ravenloft characters speak Balok as a second or third tongue, its a common language in the core.


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Elfric

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2013, 08:08:16 PM »
^

I've generally gone off the intelligence score modifier for languages known rule and exposure/tutelage in any new languages if there's a free "slot" to learn a new one they don't start off with. For example, I have a high int Paridonian who can only speak Common and Zherisian as he's never been exposed to languages from the Core in any lengthy capacity. Others like the one I mentioned before can speak passable Balok because they were taught. Any PC I have with 10 int or less isn't going to be learning any new languages fluently enough to be understood.

"My hovercraft is full of eels."
The more troublesome domains are those with multiple languages. I feel you need to stick with one language to speak fluently, while selecting a rough understanding secondary or third based on intel score and character background.  Then again to each their own, so long as it's not just out right cheesing.

"You left the campfire back in the field. The entire grass field is on fire. Smokey the Bear is on the edge of the field, on his knees, sobbing into his hands."

Miuo

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2013, 08:16:38 PM »
It does make sense for outlanders to pick up common phrase or words spoke often with repetition. My char speaks in common phrases but does not actually know the language. Which i prefer as i think a language barrier can add fear. Also rather then using talk channel, one can always speak in hushed whispers in a foreign tongue to limit those who would over hear.

Sidhel

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #16 on: May 07, 2013, 08:21:09 PM »
^

I've generally gone off the intelligence score modifier for languages known rule and exposure/tutelage in any new languages if there's a free "slot" to learn a new one they don't start off with. For example, I have a high int Paridonian who can only speak Common and Zherisian as he's never been exposed to languages from the Core in any lengthy capacity. Others like the one I mentioned before can speak passable Balok because they were taught. Any PC I have with 10 int or less isn't going to be learning any new languages fluently enough to be understood.

"My hovercraft is full of eels."
The more troublesome domains are those with multiple languages. I feel you need to stick with one language to speak fluently, while selecting a rough understanding secondary or third based on intel score and character background.  Then again to each their own, so long as it's not just out right cheesing.

Most sourcebooks for specifics (I know FR does) basically says that you get your regional/racial languages free.
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dutchy

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #17 on: May 07, 2013, 08:58:14 PM »
ok so most of the core speaks balok.

in the real world several langauges have the same thing.

english english
american english

those 2 are a good example if an american or a british person speak their own tongue then good chance they are not able to communicate unless they tune their accents down.

same with dutch and african dutch    we can communicate but it is a slow procces as the area has devolped some oddeties langauge wise.

does this not apply to the core?

Tagdar Stonebeard- the lone statue
Mihas Mandruleanu- He is the law
Gurdan- priest of the allfather, and current head of the silverhand trading company

Elfric

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #18 on: May 07, 2013, 09:07:08 PM »
ok so most of the core speaks balok.

in the real world several langauges have the same thing.

english english
american english

those 2 are a good example if an american or a british person speak their own tongue then good chance they are not able to communicate unless they tune their accents down.

same with dutch and african dutch    we can communicate but it is a slow procces as the area has devolped some oddeties langauge wise.

does this not apply to the core?
Only on the terms of Balok, yet like American and British... A few things differ.

"You left the campfire back in the field. The entire grass field is on fire. Smokey the Bear is on the edge of the field, on his knees, sobbing into his hands."

Norture

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #19 on: May 07, 2013, 09:13:44 PM »
ok so most of the core speaks balok.

in the real world several langauges have the same thing.

english english
american english

those 2 are a good example if an american or a british person speak their own tongue then good chance they are not able to communicate unless they tune their accents down.

same with dutch and african dutch    we can communicate but it is a slow procces as the area has devolped some oddeties langauge wise.

does this not apply to the core?

Roleplay with one of Vinculum's Borcans and see how he speaks Balok and his language usage.

DM Nocturne

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #20 on: May 07, 2013, 09:58:02 PM »
The important part is to avoid cheesing.

I believe the principle for languages is:

 :arrow: Starting languages = Common + one racial language + bonus languages (additional number of languages is equal to your starting Intelligence modifier. Make this one believable as it is rare for a level 2 to know Abyssal/Draconic/more obscure languages)
 :arrow: Capacity for learning additional languages = Intelligence modifier - already learned bonus languages

One should roleplay learning a language land make the process believable.

Dread

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #21 on: May 07, 2013, 10:26:34 PM »
I always find the use of the word outlander by supposed "native" players rather over-used.

You have to have a word to describe the characters who are obviously not from the Land of Mists. People just use "outlanders" because it's the most familiar term, even if it is used to describe all outside Barovia. Plus the Gazetteer do it, too, if I am not mistaken.

Norture

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #22 on: May 07, 2013, 11:37:26 PM »
Whoa whoa whoa, stop the presses for a moment. I just saw Vengeful's sig.


The silhouettes. Are those Star Wars blasters, and Leia? WTF is going on in Port these days!?!

Elfric

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #23 on: May 07, 2013, 11:45:28 PM »
Whoa whoa whoa, stop the presses for a moment. I just saw Vengeful's sig.


The silhouettes. Are those Star Wars blasters, and Leia? WTF is going on in Port these days!?!

A Star Wars convention.

"You left the campfire back in the field. The entire grass field is on fire. Smokey the Bear is on the edge of the field, on his knees, sobbing into his hands."

Norture

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Re: Languages & PoTM
« Reply #24 on: May 07, 2013, 11:48:54 PM »
The silhouettes. Are those Star Wars blasters, and Leia? WTF is going on in Port these days!?!

A Star Wars convention.

Ok so who's who? Are you Han Solo? Is Bernard the Emperor, and Magnus Darth Vader? This writes itself.