Rogues & Open lock

[-narwhal-]

so ppl can get 6 open lock from another items, 10from these rings and basicly 2from potion and if they have atleast 12dex.. + one +1thieves tool (costs like 30gold) everyone can open a DC40 stuff and with a Thieves tool +12 a DC50 without a single point on open lock skill.. its fair ? : )

There's an argument to be made that these rings do upset the "Lockpicking paradigm", becasue there's no DC60 locks out there to test the upper end of the spectrum anymore, but fair? Yes. A rogue benefits from those rings too, and a rogue with the same gear could simply whack ten skill points or so into Open Lock and not even need to break out Thieves tools to hit DC50.

i think only one class should be able to open a DC50 stuff not everyone who gets the proper items lol... already as people told me lots of traps gone makes rogues less important in a team , everyone can open a DC50 stuff and now for open stuff they are not needed either if you have gold to buy the proper stuff :\ (everyone can reach a dc 39 which is enough for the most things i guess.. but well thieves tool +3 is cheap enough also to reach dc 41.)

if just these rings would be removed or make it useable only by rogues.. atleast people would have to invest in UMD or deal with -10skills on it which would raise the rogues value still...

(Sorry for bad english)

[dutchy]

so ppl can get 6 open lock from another items, 10from these rings and basicly 2from potion and if they have atleast 12dex.. + one +1thieves tool (costs like 30gold) everyone can open a DC40 stuff and with a Thieves tool +12 a DC50 without a single point on open lock skill.. its fair ? : )

There's an argument to be made that these rings do upset the "Lockpicking paradigm", becasue there's no DC60 locks out there to test the upper end of the spectrum anymore, but fair? Yes. A rogue benefits from those rings too, and a rogue with the same gear could simply whack ten skill points or so into Open Lock and not even need to break out Thieves tools to hit DC50.

i think only one class should be able to open a DC50 stuff not everyone who gets the proper items lol... already as people told me lots of traps gone makes rogues less important in a team , everyone can open a DC50 stuff and now for open stuff they are not needed either if you have gold to buy the proper stuff :\ (everyone can reach a dc 39 which is enough for the most things i guess.. but well thieves tool +3 is cheap enough also to reach dc 41.)

if just these rings would be removed or make it useable only by rogues.. atleast people would have to invest in UMD or deal with -10skills on it which would raise the rogues value still...

(Sorry for bad english)

only visited low lvl dungeons so far? or have you been to the more profitable dungeons that are mid to high lvl? don't wish to do any bashing here but youre post count is very low so i am assuming you are not a long time player and there for only have a limited view on the server which does not mean a bad view on the low lvl areas you are spot on 100% right, but the real chests that often have something worthy in the are not dc 40 and a rogue with umd is needed.

[-narwhal-]

so ppl can get 6 open lock from another items, 10from these rings and basicly 2from potion and if they have atleast 12dex.. + one +1thieves tool (costs like 30gold) everyone can open a DC40 stuff and with a Thieves tool +12 a DC50 without a single point on open lock skill.. its fair ? : )

There's an argument to be made that these rings do upset the "Lockpicking paradigm", becasue there's no DC60 locks out there to test the upper end of the spectrum anymore, but fair? Yes. A rogue benefits from those rings too, and a rogue with the same gear could simply whack ten skill points or so into Open Lock and not even need to break out Thieves tools to hit DC50.

i think only one class should be able to open a DC50 stuff not everyone who gets the proper items lol... already as people told me lots of traps gone makes rogues less important in a team , everyone can open a DC50 stuff and now for open stuff they are not needed either if you have gold to buy the proper stuff :\ (everyone can reach a dc 39 which is enough for the most things i guess.. but well thieves tool +3 is cheap enough also to reach dc 41.)

if just these rings would be removed or make it useable only by rogues.. atleast people would have to invest in UMD or deal with -10skills on it which would raise the rogues value still...

(Sorry for bad english)

only visited low lvl dungeons so far? or have you been to the more profitable dungeons that are mid to high lvl? don't wish to do any bashing here but youre post count is very low so i am assuming you are not a long time player and there for only have a limited view on the server which does not mean a bad view on the low lvl areas you are spot on 100% right, but the real chests that often have something worthy in the are not dc 40 and a rogue with umd is needed.

well, yes iam really new and what i said is based on the info i got from others and on my own experience.. anything has mroe dc than 50 ? so not everyone can open it with zero point on open lock skill?

[MadJKevlar]

Rouges are not the only guys who should be able to open high DC locks.

There are Trickery clerics and Bards to consider.
also there are plenty of character types from all the different settings that may not be full rouges but still have associated lore suggesting they may be good at one of the given rouge abilities... using Krynn as my example, Red Robes, Lilly Knights, Skull knights, Thorn Knights, Sirrionites, Zebiomites, Hidites, Sargonites, Sentinals, Kender, Gnomes, The Legion of Steel, to name a few, so I am content with the 1%

[Lucadia]

leave it at 1pct and its pretty much means only rogue/looters are going get them anyways

and yes there lock dcs above 50, your also assuming every pc has access to all the lock picking gear, some that only a few would ever see.

and you cant open anything with zero open lock.

Home server I was from implemented chests to be open by rogues and you needed to have certain amount rogue levels to even do that past a certain dc. dc 40 required least one rogue level .

[Dumas]

Make them much more rare, or rogue/bard only, please!!! My rogue never gets to open a lock with a group... Everyone and their mother can do it... And +5 gear? Seriously, that should be ultra rare... I mean, having two of these rings on a character should not be making you an expert lockpicker. We rouges have a lot of skills to invest in, so choosing pick lock is a careful consideration we have to make, and if some other class can just be good in it with no devotion... Well... Kinda silly.

[Juice]

[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4F4qzPbcFiA[/youtube]

Never seen these rings and i want one.
Ok Victoria is a mid level rogue and with the gear ive got on her....can pop DC 41 without tools. (i think it, might be higher)
Hearing that just anyone with the gear can pop a DC 50 isnt right. Locks are ment for rogues.
And for the players of the high level characters i see in this thread how bout this for an idea

TAKE A ROGUE OUT AND STOP TRYING TO DO EVERYTHING YOURSELVES

Rogues are the hardest class to play in Ravenloft because:
1. Most of the monsters are undead and cant be sneak attacked or crit'd
2. In a straight up fight rogues dont have the AB or HP to stand a chance and half the time they dont have the AC.
3. RP wise rogues are generally thieves, merchants or killers. Which makes them considered untrustworthy right off the bat.
4. Rogues HAVE to go out with a party they cant solo yolo anywhere, making their leveling speed extremely slow.

Apart from that:
If you like it then you shoulda put a trap on it. Rogues are the skill monkeys with their high skill points they can pass nearly every DC check thrown at them.
Not only can they pick locks they can disarm traps, if any one can open a lock Whack a massive trap on the chest making rogue's more needed.
And that would be super funny as a rogue, to watch another class walk up all cocky with their tools and gear, open the chest and then blow their legs through their face.

But in the end this is a role play server. Instead of getting all the best gear so that you can solo everything.
Show the rogues some love and take another player out, meet someone outside your friendship circle. Or at least outside the "oldest characters on the sever" club.

[Mrjunkie]

[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4F4qzPbcFiA[/youtube]

Rogues are the hardest class to play in Ravenloft because:
1. Most of the monsters are undead and cant be sneak attacked or crit'd
2. In a straight up fight rogues dont have the AB or HP to stand a chance and half the time they dont have the AC.
3. RP wise rogues are generally thieves, merchants or killers. Which makes them considered untrustworthy right off the bat.
4. Rogues HAVE to go out with a party they cant solo yolo anywhere, making their leveling speed extremely slow.

Apart from that:
If you like it then you shoulda put a trap on it. Rogues are the skill monkeys with their high skill points they can pass nearly every DC check thrown at them.
Not only can they pick locks they can disarm traps, if any one can open a lock Whack a massive trap on the chest making rogue's more needed.
And that would be super funny as a rogue, to watch another class walk up all cocky with their tools and gear, open the chest and then blow their legs through their face.

But in the end this is a role play server. Instead of getting all the best gear so that you can solo everything.
Show the rogues some love and take another player out, meet someone outside your friendship circle. Or at least outside the "oldest characters on the server" club.

I would say more traps varied across the server would make it so that Rogue's would have more use in dungeons. But this is a openlock thread.
Would that a wizard didnt have the rings, shapechange/polymorph, knock, empowerd dexterity would cover that..much the same with other class's

I would say +5 is over the top, +3 is more than sufficient, still highly value'd, and would atleast be found on 'occasion', rather than having a select few who just had the fortune to loot these bad boys before they got nerfed, as has happend with many other loot types in the past.

As for rogue's being no use in a dungeon, veering off topic for a slight.
They can hit the highest ac baring a cleric, they can dish more dmg than any other class, they can stealth, they can handle traps and ofcourse locks....not usefull? Never taken out to dungeons? Never had this problem.

[APorg]

Hearing that just anyone with the gear can pop a DC 50 isnt right. Locks are ment for rogues.

This is nonsense, but don't let that get in the way of you turning this thread into your rant box.

[-narwhal-]

[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4F4qzPbcFiA[/youtube]

Rogues are the hardest class to play in Ravenloft because:
1. Most of the monsters are undead and cant be sneak attacked or crit'd
2. In a straight up fight rogues dont have the AB or HP to stand a chance and half the time they dont have the AC.
3. RP wise rogues are generally thieves, merchants or killers. Which makes them considered untrustworthy right off the bat.
4. Rogues HAVE to go out with a party they cant solo yolo anywhere, making their leveling speed extremely slow.

Apart from that:
If you like it then you shoulda put a trap on it. Rogues are the skill monkeys with their high skill points they can pass nearly every DC check thrown at them.
Not only can they pick locks they can disarm traps, if any one can open a lock Whack a massive trap on the chest making rogue's more needed.
And that would be super funny as a rogue, to watch another class walk up all cocky with their tools and gear, open the chest and then blow their legs through their face.

But in the end this is a role play server. Instead of getting all the best gear so that you can solo everything.
Show the rogues some love and take another player out, meet someone outside your friendship circle. Or at least outside the "oldest characters on the server" club.

I would say more traps varied across the server would make it so that Rogue's would have more use in dungeons. But this is a openlock thread.
Would that a wizard didnt have the rings, shapechange/polymorph, knock, empowerd dexterity would cover that..much the same with other class's

I would say +5 is over the top, +3 is more than sufficient, still highly value'd, and would atleast be found on 'occasion', rather than having a select few who just had the fortune to loot these bad boys before they got nerfed, as has happend with many other loot types in the past.

As for rogue's being no use in a dungeon, veering off topic for a slight.
They can hit the highest ac baring a cleric, they can dish more dmg than any other class, they can stealth, they can handle traps and ofcourse locks....not usefull? Never taken out to dungeons? Never had this problem.

at low lvls they suck hard.

[Mrjunkie]

All class's suck at low level, each class comes into their own from level 12 and beyond.

Anyways, back to ranting about overpowerd lock rings wich have already been said to be ultra rare from henceforth!

[dutchy]

narwhal, low lvls have it easy yeah most chests can be opend if the apropiate gear is present, there is also the use of a crowbar that uses str.


as for juice i think you said everyone should be able to pick locks, ever played a rogue or had a rogue build and seen your main meatshield walk up and do the lock while you stand there going uhm...nvm  you got it.

thats pretty shitty for a rogue, it does always amuse me when the trap goes blammo in their faces.

nothing wrong with the gear, the abuse of the gear thats where the problem lies.

if only crowbars where more usefull.

[Juice]

I would say more traps varied across the server would make it so that Rogue's would have more use in dungeons. But this is a openlock thread.
Would that a wizard didnt have the rings, shapechange/polymorph, knock, empowerd dexterity would cover that..much the same with other class's

I would say +5 is over the top, +3 is more than sufficient, still highly value'd, and would atleast be found on 'occasion', rather than having a select few who just had the fortune to loot these bad boys before they got nerfed, as has happend with many other loot types in the past.

As for rogue's being no use in a dungeon, veering off topic for a slight.
They can hit the highest ac baring a cleric, they can dish more dmg than any other class, they can stealth, they can handle traps and ofcourse locks....not usefull? Never taken out to dungeons? Never had this problem.

Thread says "Rogues & Open Lock" [shrug]
Yeap i agree +3 would be better, +5 is over the top.
Rogues can hit highest AC. (Sure when you get up to that level)
They can dish out more damage than any other class. (Only if its not undead.)
They can stealth, they can handle traps and ofcourse locks....not usefull?. (Amen rogues are the "skill monkeys" as i put it.)
Never taken out to dungeons? Never had this problem. (Diago has been around for how long? Brumbat is possibly the most well known name out there, im not surprised youve been taken out alot)

[Lucadia]

Never had a problem with a party taking out my rogue, just claim your a professional in acquisitions and ..offer to do the looting.

[Dumas]

Home server I was from implemented chests to be open by rogues and you needed to have certain amount rogue levels to even do that past a certain dc. dc 40 required least one rogue level .

Actually, this idea seems kinda cool to me, Luc. I think it would have some merit...

[MadJKevlar]

narwhal, low lvls have it easy yeah most chests can be opend if the apropiate gear is present, there is also the use of a crowbar that uses str.


as for juice i think you said everyone should be able to pick locks, ever played a rogue or had a rogue build and seen your main meatshield walk up and do the lock while you stand there going uhm...nvm  you got it.

thats pretty shitty for a rogue, it does always amuse me when the trap goes blammo in their faces.

nothing wrong with the gear, the abuse of the gear thats where the problem lies.

if only crowbars where more usefull.

Well damn! why dident the rouge just distract him or stealth ahead while the brute was fighting using his OTHER rogue skills, open the lock get first dibs and full fill a much more whole some portion of his charecter sheet? or get this one... know your meat shield will try get the lock stealth ahead and put a realy nasty trap on it in anticipation. why should any one trust the bloody rogue to do it any way they are thieves!

[Juice]

Hearing that just anyone with the gear can pop a DC 50 isnt right. Locks are ment for rogues.

This is nonsense, but don't let that get in the way of you turning this thread into your rant box.

So open lock should be for all classes not just bard and rogue?
Really?

So you have the Magic classes Wizard and Sorcerer: Ha yea like i could see them moonlighting as a locksmith they must have all the time in the world between their study of magic.
Holy classes? Clerics, paladins learning how to commit breaking and entering after their morning prayer?
Woodland Classes? Ranger, Druid sure because there are so many locked trees and deer running around.
Monks? Because opening a lock is all about bettering ones self in body and mind.
Barbarians? Huck him a crowbar go nuts mate.
Fighters? Hey why not because nothing says "this is my rifle this is my gun" like fiddling with a lock on a door.

[Juice]

Home server I was from implemented chests to be open by rogues and you needed to have certain amount rogue levels to even do that past a certain dc. dc 40 required least one rogue level .

Actually, this idea seems kinda cool to me, Luc. I think it would have some merit...

+1

[-narwhal-]

All class's suck at low level, each class comes into their own from level 12 and beyond.

Anyways, back to ranting about overpowerd lock rings wich have already been said to be ultra rare from henceforth!

My fighter could do alone really really well (atleast in dungeons) from lvl3 : D my rogue is almost five and cannot do what my lvl3 fighter could : P
Seriously fighter does very well even at low lvls.. so i dont think every class sucks hard at low lvls.
(My fighter currently lvl8 and soloed a lot.. and died only once (to 3 alpha deep forest wolf) because i was not carefully..
and very very rarely needed to use healing potions. So i dont think you are right

Home server I was from implemented chests to be open by rogues and you needed to have certain amount rogue levels to even do that past a certain dc. dc 40 required least one rogue level .

Actually, this idea seems kinda cool to me, Luc. I think it would have some merit...

+1

this would be awesome.

[dutchy]

Hearing that just anyone with the gear can pop a DC 50 isnt right. Locks are ment for rogues.

This is nonsense, but don't let that get in the way of you turning this thread into your rant box.

So open lock should be for all classes not just bard and rogue?
Really?

So you have the Magic classes Wizard and Sorcerer: Ha yea like i could see them moonlighting as a locksmith they must have all the time in the world between their study of magic.
Holy classes? Clerics, paladins learning how to commit breaking and entering after their morning prayer?
Woodland Classes? Ranger, Druid sure because there are so many locked trees and deer running around.
Monks? Because opening a lock is all about bettering ones self in body and mind.
Barbarians? Huck him a crowbar go nuts mate.
Fighters? Hey why not because nothing says "this is my rifle this is my gun" like fiddling with a lock on a door.

this is my rifle this is my gun

these are my lockpicks an being rogue is no fun.

[MadJKevlar]

Hearing that just anyone with the gear can pop a DC 50 isnt right. Locks are ment for rogues.

This is nonsense, but don't let that get in the way of you turning this thread into your rant box.

So open lock should be for all classes not just bard and rogue?
Really?

So you have the Magic classes Wizard and Sorcerer: Ha yea like i could see them moonlighting as a locksmith they must have all the time in the world between their study of magic.
Holy classes? Clerics, paladins learning how to commit breaking and entering after their morning prayer?
Woodland Classes? Ranger, Druid sure because there are so many locked trees and deer running around.
Monks? Because opening a lock is all about bettering ones self in body and mind.
Barbarians? Huck him a crowbar go nuts mate.
Fighters? Hey why not because nothing says "this is my rifle this is my gun" like fiddling with a lock on a door.

That is all very black and white.

[Legion XXI]

Why do people keep mentioning bards?  Open lock is NOT a class skill for bards.  If anything it should be made Rogue/Assassin.  Bards get umd, which would make it work for them anyways.  

[Juice]

My rant thread?
You guys are blasting these rings and i was proving why they arent so bad.

But hey when youve got the i can do anything mage's and cross classes running around its nice to keep rogues usefull these rings provide them the change to open locks no one else can

[Juice]

That is all very black and white.

If other classes where ment to have lock pick as a skill, they would.

[APorg]

That is all very black and white.

If other classes where ment to have lock pick as a skill, they would.

You're wrong.

If other classes weren't meant to have Open Lock, they wouldn't be allowed to purchase it Cross Class.

Like other classes aren't allowed to purchase UMD, even Cross Class.

Other classes are MEANT to be able to Open Locks; the Rogue's ADVANTAGE is the ability to buy it as a Class Skill.