Author Topic: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes  (Read 5191 times)

ethinos

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Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« on: June 01, 2011, 01:49:37 PM »
Any chance of us ever being able to modify our phenotypes? I'm sure the 6'6" humans would like to look tall, and gaunt folks would like to look really skinny. More variety for calibans would be kinda nice too, with options other than runt/half-orc sizes. It's mildly annoying right now knowing that one human is two feet taller than the next but is the same size phenotype in-game.

I've seen things in the Vault like Issig's Tall Phenotypes, Issig's Slight Phenotypes, and Tall Human People, for example.
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Zarathustra217

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2011, 03:08:29 PM »
The issue with such phenotypes are, I believe, that it wouldn't work for CEP item appearances.

ethinos

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2011, 03:19:55 PM »
Hmm. The Issig ones, at least, are supposed to be compatible with CEP:
Quote
I have made it compatible with the CEP
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R.Tucker

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2011, 03:34:09 PM »
Thumps up to this! Would be awesome with this kind of diversity :)

Zarathustra217

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2011, 04:14:20 PM »
Hmm. The Issig ones, at least, are supposed to be compatible with CEP:
Quote
I have made it compatible with the CEP

One version of the CEP perhaps, but it would have to be updated every time the CEP updates. And since it was last updated about a year ago, it unfortunately seems it's no longer updated.

Bad_Bud

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2011, 04:16:06 PM »
Plus every character would probably just be the largest phenotype, so everyone would still look the same.  :P

Every time I have seen a human character's height mentioned in a bio, it's like 6'8".

Bio: He's SO TALL you WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!  This man TOWERS over you.


Kenkaku

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2011, 04:18:20 PM »
Plus every character would probably just be the largest phenotype, so everyone would still look the same.  :P

Every time I have seen a human character's height mentioned in a bio, it's like 6'8".

Bio: He's SO TALL you WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!  This man TOWERS over you.


*plays a 5'9'' Feat-monkey* I guess Boyo be midget?  :lol:
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Miuo

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2011, 04:25:17 PM »
Would love it, Miuos supposed to be 4 foot and lithe, atm she appears the same size as others who play elves who are much bigger then her XD

ethinos

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2011, 04:45:15 PM »
One version of the CEP perhaps, but it would have to be updated every time the CEP updates. And since it was last updated about a year ago, it unfortunately seems it's no longer updated.

I was using these haks as a reference. Maybe there is another way of achieving the effect? New versions of the CEP don't come out very often.

Plus every character would probably just be the largest phenotype, so everyone would still look the same.  :P

Every time I have seen a human character's height mentioned in a bio, it's like 6'8".

Bio: He's SO TALL you WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!  This man TOWERS over you.

Every warrior type does seem that way doesn't it? Apparently, if you are under 6 foot, you can't be a warrior. However, I like options.
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Miuo

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2011, 05:13:27 PM »
The variety would make it much more realistic ^-^, lawls now that you mention it. . .i don't think iv ever seen a male human fighter who was 5'5" or under.

Glade

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2011, 06:14:32 PM »
Thumbs up from me. :wink:

Emomina

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2011, 07:42:47 PM »
Reiko would be elf sized. 5 foot or so. So not /everyone/ would be bigger.

Jay

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2011, 08:53:27 AM »
Plus every character would probably just be the largest phenotype, so everyone would still look the same.  :P

Every time I have seen a human character's height mentioned in a bio, it's like 6'8".

Bio: He's SO TALL you WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!  This man TOWERS over you.

I'd just like to point out that people growing taller then 6 foot is -very- modern thing thanks to our improved lifestyle of the modern era, children being fed often enough to avoid starvation, inoculated etc has meant that there growth is no longer stunted as it was.
In the 19th century the average male was about 5' 5"
In the 15th century there was a man recorded as a "Giant" for being 6 foot tall.

I'm not saying "Ur doin it wrong!" but please remember (Especially if you're a native) that unless you had access to very good healing and food whenever you wanted it it's highly unlikely your character would simply have had the nutrition/lifestile to be over 6 foot tall.

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #13 on: June 02, 2011, 09:43:29 AM »
One version of the CEP perhaps, but it would have to be updated every time the CEP updates. And since it was last updated about a year ago, it unfortunately seems it's no longer updated.
I was using these haks as a reference. Maybe there is another way of achieving the effect? New versions of the CEP don't come out very often.

It entails resizing every itempart model for every new phenotype for every playable race. It's not rocket science, but it's a big load of repetitive work. Even if you automated it somehow, it would take that you wrote the program to do that, and add to that a good bit of tweaking, debugging and packaging. It would take a developer dedicating him or herself for the task for a good while, at least the first time around.

Kagetora

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #14 on: June 02, 2011, 07:51:50 PM »
Plus every character would probably just be the largest phenotype, so everyone would still look the same.  :P

Every time I have seen a human character's height mentioned in a bio, it's like 6'8".

Bio: He's SO TALL you WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!  This man TOWERS over you.

I'd just like to point out that people growing taller then 6 foot is -very- modern thing thanks to our improved lifestyle of the modern era, children being fed often enough to avoid starvation, inoculated etc has meant that there growth is no longer stunted as it was.
In the 19th century the average male was about 5' 5"
In the 15th century there was a man recorded as a "Giant" for being 6 foot tall.

I'm not saying "Ur doin it wrong!" but please remember (Especially if you're a native) that unless you had access to very good healing and food whenever you wanted it it's highly unlikely your character would simply have had the nutrition/lifestile to be over 6 foot tall.

While this is true in a very generic sense, bear in mind that many populations of the world did not fit this "European peasantry" mode.  As a second point, bear in mind that, to have an average of 5'5" or 5'6", you have to have a significant portion of the population above that average (as well as one below it).  If 50% of the people were that height, 25% would be taller, 25% shorter, and you'd get your average.  Thirdly, this is a game of heroic fantasy.  Heroes are, by definition, not average.

So, the fact that all the people running around are tall, or beautiful, or hideous, or extra-smart, or whatever is, IMO, exactly right.  PC's and "heroes" (or villians) are supposed to be exceptional individuals.  One in many thousands.  Thats the point.

ethinos

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #15 on: June 02, 2011, 07:56:17 PM »
One version of the CEP perhaps, but it would have to be updated every time the CEP updates. And since it was last updated about a year ago, it unfortunately seems it's no longer updated.
I was using these haks as a reference. Maybe there is another way of achieving the effect? New versions of the CEP don't come out very often.

It entails resizing every itempart model for every new phenotype for every playable race. It's not rocket science, but it's a big load of repetitive work. Even if you automated it somehow, it would take that you wrote the program to do that, and add to that a good bit of tweaking, debugging and packaging. It would take a developer dedicating him or herself for the task for a good while, at least the first time around.

I'm always willing to bribe a developer with a case of beer! (Or do it myself, though I have little previous experience coding anything besides webpages.)
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Jay

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #16 on: June 02, 2011, 08:01:53 PM »
Plus every character would probably just be the largest phenotype, so everyone would still look the same.  :P

Every time I have seen a human character's height mentioned in a bio, it's like 6'8".

Bio: He's SO TALL you WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!  This man TOWERS over you.

I'd just like to point out that people growing taller then 6 foot is -very- modern thing thanks to our improved lifestyle of the modern era, children being fed often enough to avoid starvation, inoculated etc has meant that there growth is no longer stunted as it was.
In the 19th century the average male was about 5' 5"
In the 15th century there was a man recorded as a "Giant" for being 6 foot tall.

I'm not saying "Ur doin it wrong!" but please remember (Especially if you're a native) that unless you had access to very good healing and food whenever you wanted it it's highly unlikely your character would simply have had the nutrition/lifestile to be over 6 foot tall.

While this is true in a very generic sense, bear in mind that many populations of the world did not fit this "European peasantry" mode.  As a second point, bear in mind that, to have an average of 5'5" or 5'6", you have to have a significant portion of the population above that average (as well as one below it).  If 50% of the people were that height, 25% would be taller, 25% shorter, and you'd get your average.  Thirdly, this is a game of heroic fantasy.  Heroes are, by definition, not average.

So, the fact that all the people running around are tall, or beautiful, or hideous, or extra-smart, or whatever is, IMO, exactly right.  PC's and "heroes" (or villians) are supposed to be exceptional individuals.  One in many thousands.  Thats the point.

If you say so. But if i see anyone over 7 foot tall again i'm running them down the sewer with the rest of the caliban. :D

ethinos

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #17 on: June 02, 2011, 08:07:08 PM »
If someone was unnaturally tall, I can see folks whispering about being fey-touched, possessing giant blood, or the like. After all, not being normal was viewed with suspicion in unenlightened societies like Barovia.
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tzaeru

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #18 on: June 02, 2011, 10:12:08 PM »
Plus every character would probably just be the largest phenotype, so everyone would still look the same.  :P

Every time I have seen a human character's height mentioned in a bio, it's like 6'8".

Bio: He's SO TALL you WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!  This man TOWERS over you.

But but.. My heroic paladin is only 5"9 feet..  :o
« Last Edit: June 02, 2011, 10:14:01 PM by tzaeru »
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Axra

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #19 on: June 02, 2011, 11:12:50 PM »
One version of the CEP perhaps, but it would have to be updated every time the CEP updates. And since it was last updated about a year ago, it unfortunately seems it's no longer updated.
I was using these haks as a reference. Maybe there is another way of achieving the effect? New versions of the CEP don't come out very often.

It entails resizing every itempart model for every new phenotype for every playable race. It's not rocket science, but it's a big load of repetitive work. Even if you automated it somehow, it would take that you wrote the program to do that, and add to that a good bit of tweaking, debugging and packaging. It would take a developer dedicating him or herself for the task for a good while, at least the first time around.

But how bloody awesome would it be!

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2011, 07:08:59 AM »
Heroes are, by definition, not average.

So, the fact that all the people running around are tall, or beautiful, or hideous, or extra-smart, or whatever is, IMO, exactly right.  PC's and "heroes" (or villians) are supposed to be exceptional individuals.  One in many thousands.  Thats the point.

This reasoning is fine in PnP, but falls apart in a NWN server with a regular playerbase of more than a hundred.

Why can ten or more of these utterly unique, exceptional individuals be found gathering in the ML church / pub on a daily basis? Why do they outnumber the number of 'normal' priests there?

Some kind of intent to be within the bell curve of normality isn't a bad thing. Too many special unique snowflakes just become a featureless mass of snow.



Incidentally, I once saw a dwarf whose bio mentioned him being 35 ft tall and eating pine trees for breakfast.

I lol'd.

Kagetora

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #21 on: June 03, 2011, 09:41:02 AM »
Judging everything by the standards of Dark/Middle Age Europe is a very narrow point of view to take in a game that includes elves, dwarves, tieflings, "wombfreaks," half-orcs, etc.

The reason ten or more of these "exceptional individuals," i.e. abnormally-sized humans, can be found gathered in the outskirts on a daily basis is simply that the Mists chose those "more than a hundred" people based on the fact that they WERE exceptional, and they now live and congregate amongst the tens of thousands of Core residents, who ALSO have their own exceptional individuals to add to the mix.  The fact that they only have a few "safe" places to gather means that they will gravitate to those areas and be found there en masse.

In fact the reasoning does NOT fall apart on a NWN server...it becomes more valid.

Besides....you are all overstating the problem.  I look at individuals' descriptions on a near-constant basis (usually while waiting for people to get done typing in RP), and I would say 50% of them say nothing except "Uninjured/Neutral," and of the remaining 50% that I see less than 20% of those actually list a height.  Most are just simple physical descriptions, some are page-long narrative histories.  Yes, a lot of the people who put heights in their descriptions would be considered "abnormal," but the rest of the people WITHOUT a description or a height could easily be considered to fall within the average, yes?

Little Lotte

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #22 on: June 03, 2011, 09:54:51 AM »
Plus every character would probably just be the largest phenotype, so everyone would still look the same.  :P

Every time I have seen a human character's height mentioned in a bio, it's like 6'8".

Bio: He's SO TALL you WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!  This man TOWERS over you.

I'd just like to point out that people growing taller then 6 foot is -very- modern thing thanks to our improved lifestyle of the modern era, children being fed often enough to avoid starvation, inoculated etc has meant that there growth is no longer stunted as it was.
In the 19th century the average male was about 5' 5"
In the 15th century there was a man recorded as a "Giant" for being 6 foot tall.

I'm not saying "Ur doin it wrong!" but please remember (Especially if you're a native) that unless you had access to very good healing and food whenever you wanted it it's highly unlikely your character would simply have had the nutrition/lifestile to be over 6 foot tall.

I agree. My native is only 5'3" and rather skinny lol

Zarathustra217

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #23 on: June 03, 2011, 09:58:27 AM »
I'm always willing to bribe a developer with a case of beer! (Or do it myself, though I have little previous experience coding anything besides webpages.)

Hah, beer is good, but I think you'd need quite a few. There's thousands of models that would need scaling, so it's really only feasible to do if you come up with some smart batch script and an algorithm that'll work universally. Perhaps that Issig guy has one.

Raidon

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Re: Adjusting the shape/size of PC phenotypes
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2011, 12:38:29 PM »
My avatar is 12 inches long !!!! way longer then the average !!! Wait ... what size are we talking about ???