Rollplaying XP.

[Metal_ash]

It have been sometime since i last played here active but after my return i have noticed much good stuff and fun stuff, met new characters and players...all this great Now to the topic though....

First i want to point out that this topic is not meant as negative but more a question to them that knows better then me.
I know the rollplaying XP was capped some time ago and a new system added...
now i have tried it out for some time and have a few questions upon it.

Nicrod one of my characters that be level 14 was RPing and talking and plotting for about 2-3 hours of constant RP. When it was done i went to a resting place and rested. The resting messedge i got was that it had not been exactly stressfull but not either entirely idle. Now that means i have not got any good XP from that time of RP. Nicrod have no caps what so ever and actually screams for more adventure.
Same rest messedge on my level 6 character to after about 2 hours of RP and he to have no caps of any kind.

My question is that should the RP XP really be capped this much? Is it still under testing?

Reason i ask this is because this is a RP server first before anything else. I not say RP xp should bring more then dungeoning but maybe at least a bit more?
Maybe it be just me that ain't used with the new system yet but i always thought it nice before that you actually got a reward in XP from rollplaying and not just the reward of the RP it self.
Anyways...thanks and cheers!

And people do not turn this topic in to an argue or a negative topic cause that is not what i want here, IF it turns up that way i just hope DMs close it.

[Darktide18]

Welcome back man!   

I've noticed this myself while rp'ing and then resting but I'm not sure about the mechanics of the new system.

[kvanio]

Hey man, so I heard that XP was decided OVER the time you rest.. so 400 xp just after you rest and then resting would be like Proud. But if you rest, get 400 and then wait 2 hours, it would be entirely idle, so basically you're getting 400 RP xp but since it took 2 hours to get it, the message isn't Satisfied or Proud but rather entirely idle.

[kvanio]

Hey man, so I heard that XP was decided OVER the time you rest.. so 400 xp just after you rest and then resting would be like Proud. But if you rest, get 400 and then wait 2 hours, it would be entirely idle, so basically you're getting 400 RP xp but since it took 2 hours to get it, the message isn't Satisfied or Proud but rather entirely idle.

Nevermind, i'm seeing this also, RP is just lower xp than dungeoning.

[The Prophet of Misinformation]

Nevermind, i'm seeing this also, RP is just lower xp than dungeoning.

Converse yourself into completely mastery of the arcane!

[Thoraion]

Hey man, so I heard that XP was decided OVER the time you rest.. so 400 xp just after you rest and then resting would be like Proud. But if you rest, get 400 and then wait 2 hours, it would be entirely idle, so basically you're getting 400 RP xp but since it took 2 hours to get it, the message isn't Satisfied or Proud but rather entirely idle.

Nevermind, i'm seeing this also, RP is just lower xp than dungeoning.

Absolutely logical for a server where it is emphasized at every occassion that it is a roleplaying server on which dungeoneering is just the second-best alternative.

[Soren / Zarathustra217]

Nevermind, i'm seeing this also, RP is just lower xp than dungeoning.

Converse yourself into completely mastery of the arcane!

Exactly. It should remain logical IC, and more like portraying the gradual process still achieved through life-experience. In combat ability, however - which levels effectively are mainly about - it shouldn't not be able to completely substitute actual combat experience.

Hey man, so I heard that XP was decided OVER the time you rest.. so 400 xp just after you rest and then resting would be like Proud. But if you rest, get 400 and then wait 2 hours, it would be entirely idle, so basically you're getting 400 RP xp but since it took 2 hours to get it, the message isn't Satisfied or Proud but rather entirely idle.

Nevermind, i'm seeing this also, RP is just lower xp than dungeoning.

Absolutely logical for a server where it is emphasized at every occassion that it is a roleplaying server on which dungeoneering is just the second-best alternative.

Why such a great mood? Such overwhelming positivity? It's too flattering, I can't bear it - we are having too great a time! 

[Thoraion]

Absolutely logical for a server where it is emphasized at every occassion that it is a roleplaying server on which dungeoneering is just the second-best alternative.

Why such a great mood? Such overwhelming positivity? It's too flattering, I can't bear it - we are having too great a time! 

I appreciate the humorous reaction. I could tell now that i would appreciate a statement on the topic even more, but i read a posting from you on this very topic in another thread minutes ago, and that's reasonable 
So in short: Progress in terms of levels is interpreted as improvement in combat skills and therefore comes primarily from combat experience - so maybe i should be happy that i get XPs for role playing at all. ok.

But 7 months without a level up (and messages telling me that i finally made half the way to the next level... Yay ) make me a bit bitter - especially when someone who leveled two times in that period tells me that i should stop complaining about XPs and enjoy the game instead - and makes me look like a purely-level-oriented powergamer. That about my great mood.

[dutchy]

7 months and how long and how much you play per week and day.  7 months none stop or minimum ?

[jugnaut]

RP XP is a lot lower than it used to be.  Spawn XP seems fine, but RP is extremely low compared to what it used to be.  It discourages RP and encourages Grinding.

[Soren / Zarathustra217]

I don't think you could say that it discourage roleplay. XP isn't meant as a reward either - principally, roleplay is it's own reward. XP is progression, and while you progress some through meeting and interacting with other people, it does not make you a combat master.

[dutchy]

yes xp is its own reward.

but they somehwat have a point, the server is an rp oriented server with dungeons and tons of systems (some i agree with some i think you thought off while smoking to much pot) if the rp xp is indeed to low then you will enforce grinding its DnD but this is also just still a game and in games people hit things for a certain amount of reward and if the reward for smacking things is way higher then talking about somthing then poeple will decide to smack more as we PLAY and game in that concept the people would grind over rp xp.

everyone likes a few lvls thats a gaming mentality and nwn isnt sitting in some basement sipping soda's while mom yells down that the snacks are ready.

so i see where those who say rp xp is to low are comming from

[Aduial]

We are all here to play a game and have fun, to see your character progessing is part of the fun and everyone like to see it growing, i guess there are no doubts about that.

I personally like slow progressions, but the reward for Rping is now really very low, and in the past it was quite the opposite,for example i remember that  there was a player that did from level 7 to level 10 just with Rp without having  a single combat in just one month and without spending too much time online, try to do that now.

So the other way to get XP is dungeoning and it is common knowledge that with a right place to go and a good party  it pays very well.
This lead to an overfarming of the various dungeons and places, how many times the mage will need to experiment his spells on the werewolves? how many times the warrior would like to see the battle stances of the invidians? ten? twenty?
I dont think this is really logical, but XP are always granted even if you defeat them 100 times, and how this help the MAIN aspect of the server? that is to say Roleplay.....,  i dont think i have a clue.

[k_moustakas]

I prefer the new system. Under the old system, Gus had leveled from 16 to 20 with 90% coming from rp in just a few months. I would stand in the outskirts, blah blah myself for a couple of hours and get a proud.

[Thoraion]

7 months and how long and how much you play per week and day.  7 months none stop or minimum ?

in half the weeks not at all, and in the weeks in which can play it is about 2-3 days with sessions of about 3 hours. More on holiday ;-)

but they somehwat have a point, the server is an rp oriented server with dungeons and tons of systems (some i agree with some i think you thought off while smoking to much pot) if the rp xp is indeed to low then you will enforce grinding its DnD but this is also just still a game and in games people hit things for a certain amount of reward and if the reward for smacking things is way higher then talking about somthing then poeple will decide to smack more as we PLAY and game in that concept the people would grind over rp xp.

everyone likes a few lvls thats a gaming mentality and nwn isnt sitting in some basement sipping soda's while mom yells down that the snacks are ready.

so i see where those who say rp xp is to low are comming from

I could not agree more.

[The Prophet of Misinformation]

I don't think you could say that it discourage roleplay. XP isn't meant as a reward either - principally, roleplay is it's own reward. XP is progression, and while you progress some through meeting and interacting with other people, it does not make you a combat master.

It is inherently a matter of the expenditure of energies -

Conversing and mundane action, which entails the majority of roleplaying, requires such limited effort to accomplish that in the majority of circumstances it logically cannot validate any substantial measure of progress.

Dungeoneering conversely propels one into ceaselessly hostile predicaments that expend biological and tangible resources. I suppose that it may generally insinuate that one is apt to learn more quickly experience and a bit less from the studying of theory.

Roleplaying should be done for the principle of enjoying it and not some meagre tangible reward.

[Aahz]

The way I see it, people in a RPG will instinctively gravitate to those actions that will give them XP so their character will progress. (ie. sense of achievement and accomplishment being rewarding to the player)

It all depends on what behavior you want to encourage. If you want more RP then have a slightly greater XP for RP, if you want more adventuring then give out more XP for that. It may not be realistic in a In character sense, however, you are taking about motivations of the players and not their character here.

However promoting the server as an RP server, then making XP for RP less then adventuring, then upping the time and difficulty to actually do adventuring so as to "encourage" more RP seems to me to be on the schizophrenic side.

[Bluebomber4evr]

The way I see it, people in a RPG will instinctively gravitate to those actions that will give them XP so their character will progress. (ie. sense of achievement and accomplishment being rewarding to the player)

It all depends on what behavior you want to encourage. If you want more RP then have a slightly greater XP for RP, if you want more adventuring then give out more XP for that. It may not be realistic in a In character sense, however, you are taking about motivations of the players and not their character here.

However promoting the server as an RP server, then making XP for RP less then adventuring, then upping the time and difficulty to actually do adventuring so as to "encourage" more RP seems to me to be on the schizophrenic side.

What the hell are you talking about? It is entirely possible to roleplay while dungeoning (in fact, that's what everyone should be doing). "RP" isn't just about sitting around and talking. It's serving a role and staying in character, which is not mutually exclusive from adventuring. Stop complaining for complaining's sake already. DT may be a tad on the verbose side, but he's entirely correct. Roleplay because it's fun, not because you're looking for a handout.

[Thoraion]

What the hell are you talking about? It is entirely possible to roleplay while dungeoning (in fact, that's what everyone should be doing). "RP" isn't just about sitting around and talking. It's serving a role and staying in character, which is not mutually exclusive from adventuring. Stop complaining for complaining's sake already. DT may be a tad on the verbose side, but he's entirely correct. Roleplay because it's fun, not because you're looking for a handout.

do you see your role more as a moderator or do you rather like to escalate a discussion until it needs to be locked again? Because that's what you are provoking here - you might notice the significant difference in DTs and your posting there.

And DT is not RIGHT, as you write - it is just that you share his opinion, but that does not make it any better than Aahz perceptions. There is a large difference, especially if it is about an opinion on how players should act or what they should prefer.

Besides that - i fully understand Aahz point - and it is a valid one. It may not be what you envision, but it is how most players minds work.
Yes, to some degree you can dungeoneer and roleplay at the same time - but it is just not the point. In fact, from MY experience, a rather pure rp session is much different in depth and quality from a combat session and a hybrid. You may prefer the hybrid, but that does not mean that many others do so as well. Besides that, it is not always the own decision if a dungeon crawl is accompanied by a desirable degree of role play.

[Illy-Dan]

What the hell are you talking about? It is entirely possible to roleplay while dungeoning (in fact, that's what everyone should be doing). "RP" isn't just about sitting around and talking. It's serving a role and staying in character, which is not mutually exclusive from adventuring. Stop complaining for complaining's sake already. DT may be a tad on the verbose side, but he's entirely correct. Roleplay because it's fun, not because you're looking for a handout.

do you see your role more as a moderator or do you rather like to escalate a discussion until it needs to be locked again? Because that's what you are provoking here - you might notice the significant difference in DTs and your posting there.

Sorry, Blue, but he kinda is right there.

If you want more RP then have a slightly greater XP for RP, if you want more adventuring then give out more XP for that.

How is RP XP generated?  Time based, under the assumption that you're RPing your whole time online, or message based?

By reducing Dungeon Gained xp (or increasing rp xp), one possible outcome would be to devalue Dungeoneering as a XP Gaining machine.  This should encourage RP as the XP Earner.  However, this would increase the view of Dungeoneering as a Cash Flow, further encouraging Grinding, this time not for XP, but for loot.

Opinions?

[Threefold]

Whether it's harsh or not though, I can't find fault in his point. Going to a dungeon dosen't mean you aren't RPing. For some people it's an intrinsic part of RP. If dungeoning wasn't wanted on the server, we'd not have the many dungeons set out for us.

Opinions?

I am of the opinion that a guy who spends his days risking his life fighting off werewolves and reclaiming their lost goodies should become a more skilled, richer man faster than someone who sits in the pub flapping their chin.

[Heretic]

-Roleplay is its own reward as per the designers server philosophy - anyone not agreeing or accepting this server culture, will have a hard time fitting in and finding fulfillment out of a gaming session.
-Dungeoning & roleplay are not mutually exclusive - we see roleplay while dungeoning all the time, they are part of the role characters play in the world - the design of dungeons is made to promote and encourage this.
-The values of XP gain have been adjusted over time, these changes have also been made by listening to player feedback, this is what player community councillors do at times, to report player feedback on things like this - one of the ideas behind the gains is that someone that lounges in front of the Ladies Rest should not be progressing, honing skills, gaining combat experience as much as the dungeon crawler that trains and perfects his art. Of course, this varies depending the classes, one might argue that a wizard could only gain XP by talking & studying or counterspelling, but a decision and compromise must be made with systems or it would be an endless cycle of exceptions which would tire our limited scripters.

[HellsPanda]

I would say the wizard learns more by practical application of that magic.

[Glade]

[/quote]What the hell are you talking about? It is entirely possible to roleplay while dungeoning (in fact, that's what everyone should be doing). "RP" isn't just about sitting around and talking. It's serving a role and staying in character, which is not mutually exclusive from adventuring. Stop complaining for complaining's sake already. DT may be a tad on the verbose side, but he's entirely correct. Roleplay because it's fun, not because you're looking for a handout.
[/quote] This I agree with. I've been wanting to get it out there for sometime.

[Threefold]

I would say the wizard learns more by practical application of that magic.

Also that it's generally going to be hard to tell if a Wizard is discussing magical theorem and practising in comparison to just bantering about fish.