fine fine, this was a mistake apparently
im not frowning anyone and i hope others aint either
this was just my opinion that there are far too many casters around. no need to discuss this more
First off don't let people side track you. You have an exceptionally valid point and coming from a member of the community that has played through as many different versions, and many of the different factions as you have, your opinion, should be heard.
Regardless of the "Just let sleeping Dogs Lie" saying, Sometimes, You need to kick the fleabag in the ribs, and dump it into the Flea bath.
There are to many Casters. The Setting is supposed to be Low Magic. States that, in every Venue it floats around in. However we know this to be an erroneous Saying anyway. The Form of Low Magic that we have is basically a Curtailing of Magic ITEMS, of a certain type and Scope. This is fine, because in Low Magic, there are not supposed to be Sword Marts on every street corner, selling +4 Swords Dancing Defenders to Adventurers with enough Coin. However, that niche was filled incorrectly. By Ineffective Items that though they read well, you can NOT use them effectively to get around, the developed structure of the setting.
In short, this means, Fighters, and Barbarians, are screwed. They at best, get a +1 AB weapon, which, after 9th level or so really isn't all that helpful to their XP gathering. While the Casters can charge screaming into a dungeon, Acid Sheathed and Troll Formed and hasted, the Fighter, well, he can't go. The Casters Like the Solo Hero spotlight to, 90% of them, don't take along anyone but other Casters. Why bother to bring a Fighter, since you need Magic to "win" anyway there is no point. Barbarians have a minor advantage now that with the new feat stuff they can match the "old" fighter in terms of details, and out perform him in terms of kicking down doors and such.
So we know that our version of Low Magic, is a bit skewed. Low Magic Item of CONSEQUENCE, is the way I like to put it, unless you are one of the privileged VERY few. Sometimes you have to call a Spade a Spade.
What is missing from OUR Low Magic, is by definition of the term, from a Literary Bible point of scope, is that we replaced Magic ITEMS, with Magic PEOPLE. Who needs a sword +2 when you can just make a Cleric, who now has feats approaching a fighters range, take martial weapons and later when you get GMW, you win, fighter loses. Class Warfare, No. Truth. Yes.
If you were to Reduce all these Items, from Full magic +'s, to AB +'s, (and even then mostly against specific things), remove stat adders (But replace that with PILES of skill adders that give sneaks the stealth ability of a GOD for example), Generally make +2 impossible unless you have connections, +3 UNHEAD OF. Why are the magic People, not submitted, to the same Reduction of Ability? The Fighter type as they level up, get Better, and Better GEAR. It's standardized into the game itself when you go to make, well, PnP NPC's and Heroes. Level X, has Item Package X, Modified by setting. So what we have now, is an allergic reaction to Vanilla. If you are a Fighter for the most part you are forced to Multiclass, into Rogue (for UMD), or something that gives you, Magic Spells so you can get around the fear and the DR everything has. So, not a lot of Pure Fighters. And before the Old Guard sounds off, DP riddled, Old Gear that no one else can get anymore PC's, need not respond. Not meant to be harsh, but that's a separate balance issue that belongs in a different thread.
Some people as I have stated. Stick to their Guns. They don't Grab levels of Caster or Sneak, without Insanely developed Reason. Hell, if some of them want to Pick Locks with their Fighter, they spend the skill points. Are they noted for this, acknowledged? No. Folks call them Stupid (While immediately going on the defensive if even a stiff breeze blows against them), talk down to them, make fun of them. But then, THOSE people, shrug it off. Because they are PLAYING the setting. Not trying to beat it. They get basically no recognition for it, unless they speak up in threads like this then they become ground zero for the Hater bomb. But they know the others like them got their back, so they weather the slings and arrows and continue to play on.
The Skewed Structure is further reflected in the fact that while Fighters and their spin offs (Even the Semi Casters like Rangers and Paladins) get fubared by the Gear issue, and the standards of practice of Not putting what gear remains into the game, the CASTERS (beyond a few nerfs that really have NO IMPACT beyond having to recast light a few times), were left alone Scott free. Low Magic, also means, LOW MAGIC USERS. Magic, is simple NOT COMMON. That also includes, people that use it. Of those people, there are Restrictions upon the Magic. Like, dare I say, Components, environmental requirements/restrictions, special teachers, pacts, the works. We don't have that here. Casters were allowed to charge into a Low Magic Setting, en'masse, at Full Power for the Most part, and because of that power, the development of the land was further skewed to require even MORE magic to "win", producing more multi classes and more casters. Multi-Classes got so prevalent, FEATS were adjusted to encourage single classes. Single Class Casters that no longer had to sacrifice a level to pick up those few pesky additional feats. Something meant to curtail the rash of Multiclassing, simply ended up making Casters even MORE powerful.
Fighter does get a couple of slots he can spend on spell saves now. Not much of a trade off but sometimes it's handy.
There are, as I said, FAR to many Casters in the game. Log on with 20 people, 18 of them are Casters, Ones a rogue, that next week will rebuild into an assassin making them a semi caster. Sure, people like to play Casters. I understand that. People like to play VAMPIRES to, yet they are regulated. Same with any other Monster PC, 90% of the Races, and All of the prestige Classes. Many folks may not think it's an issue, hell if Rex sounds off about it, it's guaranteed a certain group of people will immediately start the jihad (durka durka, durka Jihad Durka), but when a player like Englefire brings up something, folks throw rocks at him for expressing an opinion. Hmmph. That alone shows that his concerns, are based in fact.
As for that Excuse of "Well Make something and Handle it IC!". I'm sure that gets followed up in another thread, pertaining to how someones Caster / Monster was meta Gamed by a Witch Hunter. Or witch goes and get's their 20th level friends they suddenly have to keyhole you into a small box somewhere forever. Doesn't work.
Some simple changes such as implementing components, fix a lot of the Caster Issues. Application Process fixes another Part, DM's get the rest. Problem solved, time to get back to Playing the Game, instead of trying to WIN the Game.
In finalization, if anyones feelings were hurt, can't really do much about it. If I post I like the Green Bay Packers, some one will fire off on how as a Bear fan they are highly Insulted. Can't please everyone, so take this as an across the table discussion. Want what I really think with out the PG13 editing, well, send me a PM. Otherwise I have considerably more I can add to this one as well.
~Rex
