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Also this thread is about Listen, not Spot.
Whether it's feats&skills, gear or buffs, Detectors have the advantage.
Great now I have to go to the moon to be sure I’m not being spied on. I don’t hate this idea, but given that listen and spot aren’t class skills for reasons I will never understand for most of us, I would really love to see absolutely massive spot bonuses to anyone within 5’; especially if it’s light in the room. Stealthers get bonuses for cloudy days, massive amounts of gear and their only existing foil is cross class for most everyone. I hate that stealthers can and do simply walk through any doorway or area with absolutely no place to hide WHILE I am actively watching it... even in a open area without a single object to hide behind and I will -never- under any circumstance hear or spot them. Even if my friend spots them; he can’t point them out to me. It’s bad enough never knuowing who is standing 1” from me, but now I can’t even run to a locked door without someone listening in from 20’ away? If there were other ways to drag people out of stealth such as a small AoE spell if you happen to guess where they are hiding; I’d feel a bit better about giving stealth even more advantages.
What are you on about? Detectors have all the advantages when it comes to stealth/detect. If you arent willing to put the points into detection then you can hardly get cranky over the stealthers that put everything into both hide and move silently. Whether it's feats&skills, gear or buffs, Detectors have the advantage. You cant expect ot be able to just avoid being spied on unless you prepare yourself with the necessary precautions.
Great now I have to go to the moon to be sure I’m not being spied on. I don’t hate this idea, but given that listen and spot aren’t class skills for reasons I will never understand for most of us, I would really love to see absolutely massive spot bonuses to anyone within 5’; especially if it’s light in the room. Stealthers get bonuses for cloudy days, massive amounts of gear and their only existing foil is cross class for most everyone. I hate that stealthers can and do simply walk through any doorway or area with absolutely no place to hide WHILE I am actively watching it... even in a open area without a single object to hide behind and I will -never- under any circumstance hear or spot them. Even if my friend spots them; he can’t point them out to me. It’s bad enough never knuowing who is standing 1” from me, but now I can’t even run to a locked door without someone listening in from 20’ away? If there were other ways to drag people out of stealth such as a small AoE spell if you happen to guess where they are hiding; I’d feel a bit better about giving stealth even more advantages.
There are ways by following 3.5 (ie: spell components for wizards/sorcerers, spellbooks that can drop for wizards meaning they lose all their spells, stricter control of clerics actively worshiping their deity, etc.), question is if and how to best implement them.
I can respect that, but good luck re-balancing the other classes out of the 3.5 caster power creep. I think the thread has been answered in one way or another.
Right, but once again the time spent developing this can better be spent developing classes that aren't top tier classes (as druids, clerics and arcane casters are).
Once again, the stance is pretty clear at this point; if or when casters are brought down to a more manageable level, then we can look at side upgrades. You can agree that there are plenty of classes that need more attention than pure casters.
