Ravenloft: Prisoners of the Mist

Suggestions, Feedback & Bug Reports (OOC) => Module Feedback and Suggestions => Topic started by: EO on November 28, 2007, 03:23:28 AM

Title: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on November 28, 2007, 03:23:28 AM
Hello everyone, in the past few days, I've been working on behalf of the development team on implementing most subraces from the various settings of DnD. I've done researches and all and am now wondering if I missed any, so I figured I'd bring it up to you for review. Consider that some races were intentionally ommited because they didn't work right in NwN or because they looked too foreign and aliens. Also keep in mind that only the standard races can serve as templates and that DM's won't alter appearances since most other appearances are static. So, when bringing a 'race'/'subrace' up, keep those things in mind. What might be implemented later on: various genasi, gully dwarf, giths (both types). So, without further ado, here's our current list of subraces by setting/race:

Quote
Dark Sun:

Humans:
Athasian Human

Elves:
Athasian Elf

Half-Elves:
Athasian Half-elf

Halflings:
Athasian Halfling
Rhul-Thaun

Dwarves:
Athasian Dwarf

Half-Orcs:
Mul (Half-dwarf)

Birthright:

Humans:
Anuieran
Brecht
Khinasi
Rjurik
Vos

Elves:
Sidhelien

Half-Elves:
Half-Sidhelien

Halflings:
Cerilian Halfling

Dwarves:
Karamhul

Eberron:

Humans:
Human
Aasimar
Tiefling
Xeph

Elves:
Aerenal Elf
Khorvaire Elf
Valenar Elf
Drow

Half-Elves:
Half-Elf

Halflings:
Talenta Halfling
Khorvaire Halfling
Tundra Haflling

Dwarves:
Dwarf
Toldun Nordorthak (Glacier Dwarf)
Grey Dwarf (Duergar)
Dream Dwarf

Gnomes:
Gnome
Deep Gnome
Chaos Gnome
Whisper Gnome

Half-Orcs:
Half-Orc

Forgotten Realms:

Humans:
Human
Aasimar
Tiefling

Elves:
Moon Elf
Sun Elf
Wild Elf
Wood Elf
Drow
Star Elf

Half-Elves:
Half-Elf
Half-Drow

Halflings:
Lightfoot Halfling
Little Folk (Maztican Halfling)

Dwarves:
Shield Dwarf
Duergar
Gold Dwarf
Korobokuru
Arctic Dwarf
Desert Dwarf
Wild Dwarf

Gnomes:
Rock Gnome
Deep Gnome
Forest Gnome

Half-Orcs:
Half-Orc
Tanarukk

Gothic Earth:

Humans:
Human

Dragonlance:

Humans:
Human

Elves:
Kagonesti
Qualinesti
Silvanesti

Half-Elves:
Half-Elf


Gnomes:
Tinker Gnome
Mad Gnome

Halflings:
Kender

Dwarves:
Hill Dwarf
Mountain Dwarf
Dark Dwarf

Ravenloft:

Barovia:
Barovian: half-Elves/Humans/Halflings
Gundarakite: human

Sithicus:
Silvanesti (Grey Elf)

Kalidnay:
Dark Sun races (except rhul-thaun)

The Nightmare Lands:
Abber Nomads (Humans/Half-Elves)

Vorostokov:
Vos (see Birthright)

Other domains: anything else

Mystara:

Humans:
Human
Traldar (maybe)

Elves:
Ilsundal Elf
Belcadiz Elf
Wood Elf
Shadow Elf (Schattenalfen)
Shiye Elf

Half-Elves:
Half-elf

Gnomes:
Rock Gnome

Halflings:
Halfling

Half-Orcs
Half-orc

Dwarves:
Rockborn Dwarf
Moulder Dwarf
Kogolor Dwarf

Greyhawk

Humans:
Human
Lerara

Elves:
High Elf
Grey Elf
Wild Elf (Grugash)
Valley Elf
Wood Elf (Sylvan Elf)
Drow

Half-Elves:
Half-Elf

Gnomes:
Rock Gnome
Deep Gnome
Forest Gnome

Halflings:
Hairfoot Halfling (Lightfoot)
Tallfellow
Stout (Deep Halfling)

Half-Orcs
Half-orc

Dwarves:
Hill Dwarf
Mountain Dwarf
Deep Dwarf
Duergar
Derro

Planescape

Humans:
Human
Aasimar
Tiefling

Zenythri

Elves:
Planar Elf

Half-Elves:
Planar Half-Elf

Gnomes:
Planar Gnome

Halflings:
Planar Halfling

Half-Orcs
Planar Half-orc
Tanarukk

Dwarves:
Planar Dwarf

Spelljammer

Humans:
Wildspace Human
Aperusa

Elves:
Wildspace Elf
Wildspace Drow

Half-Elves:
Wildspace Half-Elf

Gnomes:
Wildspace Gnome

Halflings:
Wildspace Halfling
Furchin (Polar Halfling)

Half-Orcs
Wildspace Half-orc
Scro

Dwarves:
Wildspace Dwarf
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: DM Macabre on November 28, 2007, 04:01:59 AM
Quote
Dark Sun:
Half-Orcs:
Half-Giant (perhaps a subrace for Half-Orcs?)

Thri-Kreen (also a playable race in Darksun)
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Ellana Twiggy on November 28, 2007, 06:17:48 AM
How about avriel elves? Forgotten realms setting, they are rare but do still exist.  Heh, would probably have a higher outcast rating due to wings however.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Nightmare on November 28, 2007, 06:41:10 AM
OR would go through the roof *cough*
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Corvus on November 28, 2007, 07:44:46 AM
Lets hope we still have mostly normal humans around or it will turn into a freakshow... a freakshow that will get burned after a while.  :twisted:
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on November 28, 2007, 11:50:42 AM
Dark Sun:
Half-Orcs:
Half-Giant (perhaps a subrace for Half-Orcs?)

Thri-Kreen (also a playable race in Darksun)

Pretty sure those were left out purposefully as EO mentioned "Consider that some races were intentionally ommited because they didn't work right in NwN or because they looked too foreign and aliens."
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Catacomb on November 28, 2007, 03:11:48 PM
How about avriel elves? Forgotten realms setting, they are rare but do still exist.  Heh, would probably have a higher outcast rating due to wings however.

Avariels are fun but nwn flight is.... limited to say the least.  Also, I get the feeling that most Avariels wouldn't last more than a couple minutes.

Avariel - Greetings.  I don't suppose any of you could tell me where I am? I'm a bit lost. *flutters wings lightly*

Barovians - ......    *light up torches*
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on November 28, 2007, 03:13:32 PM
No sea elves or avariels because the bulk of their abilities can't work in NwN. Same with the subraces that can pass through solid rock like it's thin air, can't work.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Bluebomber4evr on November 28, 2007, 04:32:04 PM
Thri-kreen aren't gonna happen, ever. Same goes for Giff, Xixchil, Hadozee, Dracon, Half-Giants, Minotaurs, Centuars, Shifters, Warforged, Changelings, Hurwaeti, Rastipedes, Avariel, Ghostwise Halflings, Trolls, Orcs, Fremlins, Aranea, Rakasta, Lupin, Tortles, Saurials, Pteramen, Lizard Men, and so on.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: hi-di-ho on November 28, 2007, 04:41:40 PM
I gonna go out on a leg to say, some of the subraces aren't needed unless there is something different about them or they are mainstream.

Some of the subraces on the list are kind've the same, such as the types of Eberronian halflings and elves (except the drow), they are all the same except have different mindsets (though I dunno about Kalashtar, it would be...its kinda like saying "lets have a ghostwise halfling in game"). As well as way out there, like what the heck is a dream dwarf or a Xeph in the Eberron setting, and those things such as Fey'ri and star elves in FR? If I can't find any mention of it in the campaign book, it'll probably be a waste of effort except if people can actually find some information on it.

other than that I can see this might make the outlanders much more...interesting, though I hope it doesn't come to having the entire place being run over by a spread of freaks

EDIT: ...and yes I do know what the Fey'ri and star elves are and where they come from, though I doubt Fey'ri would be put into play, it would feel kinda silly if it did. :|
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on November 28, 2007, 05:14:16 PM
Fey'ri will go in without the shapechange ability nor flight obviously.

I removed Kalashtar though since their major ability is to have a form of telepathic link with others.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Heretic on November 28, 2007, 05:16:35 PM
Workin' on info stuff for these subraces, I welcome Pm's or posts here for sourcebooks sources, and all the RP info stuff.

You may win a permanent recognition of your name on my spammaferic threads!!111!111



Cheers. :)
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Nightmare on November 28, 2007, 07:21:27 PM
Workin' on info stuff for these subraces, I welcome Pm's or posts here for sourcebooks sources, and all the RP info stuff.

You may win a permanent recognition of your name on my spammaferic threads!!111!111



Cheers. :)

Or we might just ban you too when we decide to finally shut Eraldur up! :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ThAnswr on November 28, 2007, 07:47:23 PM
That's a boatload of sub-races.  These actually going to be implemented or just dreamed about?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Nefensis on November 28, 2007, 07:50:52 PM
The ones in the first post are the ones you CAN play, they dont get any special ability or if they do, they are applied.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on November 28, 2007, 07:53:22 PM
They're all playable subraces; most of them are different from the original ones and a few will require applications.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ThAnswr on November 28, 2007, 07:53:36 PM
The ones in the first post are the ones you CAN play, they dont get any special ability or if they do, they are applied.

That's still a boatload of sub-races.  
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: DM Macabre on November 28, 2007, 08:04:06 PM
Dark Sun:
Half-Orcs:
Half-Giant (perhaps a subrace for Half-Orcs?)

Thri-Kreen (also a playable race in Darksun)

Pretty sure those were left out purposefully as EO mentioned "Consider that some races were intentionally ommited because they didn't work right in NwN or because they looked too foreign and aliens."
The Athas-NWN server had Thri-Kreen and Half-Giants as playable races. Though I'd think Thri-Kreen etc. would be really freakish. (see Corvus  :onfire:)
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on November 28, 2007, 09:00:12 PM
Granted, they are possible, but won't be compatible with our Ravenloft server. The half-giants, for instance, would be far larger than caliban, who are already ostracized for much, including their greater size. I've seen servers with minotaur, ogres, wemic, etc, as PC's, but often they don't always function completely (minotaurs didn't display the off-hand weapon, armor never was shown, etc.) and they really, really don't fit with Ravenloft's vision.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Nefensis on November 28, 2007, 09:01:49 PM
they wouldnt fit in the sewers either.. tho if they wanna have a caliban that look like a cow.. more power to them :P
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Fungal Artillery on November 28, 2007, 11:38:37 PM
I think there is enough freakish characters as it is with the calibans and undead. One time when I was online, I noticed that more than a half of the players online at that moment (and there was alot) were disliked to me and thus "monstrous" PCs.  I'd personally like to see more "normal" characters around than monstrous.  :_Nod__by_Xrodias:

just my two cents
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Strife on November 29, 2007, 08:57:36 AM
Quote
I'd personally like to see more "normal" characters around than monstrous

 Monstrous PC's are part of the setting and enhance the atmosphere. Instead of AI controlled Were's and such you actually have a real person to deal with that can think independently.
 As for the new list of sub-races I'm happy to see them implemented and personally I wouldn't worry too much about a "freak-show" or "circus". The local population will ensure that there numbers never peak.
 If examples are required search the forums about the previous drow house and that group of gnomes that came through the mists a while ago. Zenophobic takes on a whole new meaning in Barovia.

Strife
 
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: shadymerchant on November 29, 2007, 07:59:38 PM
I'd love to play a half giant myself. Of course, its OR on a whole nother' level, and you'd basically be an animal living in the woods or a cave. The last server I was on that allowed giants also gave them an ecl so high it was nigh unplayable, but it kept the numbers down.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on November 29, 2007, 10:10:29 PM
Heh, you'd essentially become that 'random encounter monster'.  :lol:

How many of these new subraces actually differ from the original model that they are based on?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Blubie on November 30, 2007, 07:04:59 AM
Eh... No Strongheart or Ghostwise Halflings?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Heretic on November 30, 2007, 07:07:00 AM
Eh... No Strongheart or Ghostwise Halflings?

Ghostwise are not playable, as their telepathic abilities are cheese. I:E, means that they cannot be reproduced with the nwn engine.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on November 30, 2007, 08:10:53 AM
Eh... No Strongheart or Ghostwise Halflings?

Yeah, since their one major ability wasn,t feasible in NwN, I scratched them. Similar reason for the Strongheart, who, with the current system ended up with just a penalty and no boons, making it a rather useless choice.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Bluebomber4evr on November 30, 2007, 03:54:37 PM
Heh, you'd essentially become that 'random encounter monster'.  :lol:

How many of these new subraces actually differ from the original model that they are based on?
they'd use existing character models. They're subraces.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on November 30, 2007, 03:58:14 PM
Ok, I guess I phrased it wrong. How many of the subraces differ statistically, from the basic race. I don't need a printout of the specific changes, just curious how many actually have different stats and are therefore different more in the crunch than the flavor/fluff.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Heretic on November 30, 2007, 04:56:28 PM
Ok, I guess I phrased it wrong. How many of the subraces differ statistically, from the basic race. I don't need a printout of the specific changes, just curious how many actually have different stats and are therefore different more in the crunch than the flavor/fluff.

Working on this, will have all info on Rp thread about different subraces we got; just kinda caught up with work + essays and finals atm, but its coming.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on November 30, 2007, 05:11:03 PM
Ok, I guess I phrased it wrong. How many of the subraces differ statistically, from the basic race. I don't need a printout of the specific changes, just curious how many actually have different stats and are therefore different more in the crunch than the flavor/fluff.

Most.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Ravenous on November 30, 2007, 06:21:45 PM
Fey'ri will go in without the shapechange ability nor flight obviously.

I removed Kalashtar though since their major ability is to have a form of telepathic link with others.

So Fey´ri is gonna have to run around with their wings and stuff visible?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on November 30, 2007, 06:28:02 PM
Yeah, short-lived race in Ravenloft.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Heretic on November 30, 2007, 06:30:47 PM
Fey'ri will go in without the shapechange ability nor flight obviously.

I removed Kalashtar though since their major ability is to have a form of telepathic link with others.

So Fey´ri is gonna have to run around with their wings and stuff visible?


...Which can be "lamed" with a Cloak........... :evil:

Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Ravenous on November 30, 2007, 06:38:52 PM
Yeah, short-lived race in Ravenloft.

Yeh.. But their most basic ability is to change themselves to look like a Sun Elf.. I mean every Fey´ri possess that ability..

In any case, if it aint already done wouldnt now be the time to change each subrace to match PnP, ie +1 for tiefling etc?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on November 30, 2007, 06:39:43 PM
Making them +2 ECL wasn't a mistake then and it's still not one now, so no, we won't change them to 1 ECL.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Ravenous on November 30, 2007, 06:48:30 PM
Making them +2 ECL wasn't a mistake then and it's still not one now, so no, we won't change them to 1 ECL.

Why not? There is a biiiiiiiiig difference between wererat and tiefling, yet only 1 ECL apart.. See that is why I hate the ECL system from the ground up in DnD, its there and its unbalanced as hell.. Half-Dragon has the same ECL as Deep Gnome, Half-Fiend the same as Lich..
So to me, having a fully functional ECL system yet not applying it as in PnP despite the subraces having less advantages here than in PnP, makes little sense.. Of course i´m not a Dev so the info I have is severely limited..
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Negnar on December 03, 2007, 01:10:47 PM
In my opinion we need to focus more on incntives and reason for people to play characters that fit in well with the setting. Too many subraces can just move it all away from the setting and make it look like most other FR servers where everyone is somthing speical, becuase who wants to be a basic human/elf/dwarf/caliban when you have all these other options?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on December 03, 2007, 01:13:35 PM
becuase who wants to be a basic human/elf/dwarf/caliban when you have all these other options?

If you look at the server population as is, 80% of the people are vanilla humans anyway, with elves coming in a distant second. I just hope some/most of these subraces are ECL because that halforc monstrousity is one heck of a beast. :twisted:
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Rex on December 18, 2007, 10:35:11 PM
becuase who wants to be a basic human/elf/dwarf/caliban when you have all these other options?

If you look at the server population as is, 80% of the people are vanilla humans anyway, with elves coming in a distant second. I just hope some/most of these subraces are ECL because that halforc monstrousity is one heck of a beast. :twisted:

Most are some sort of ECL but the ones I've seen so far, sure seem to be plying the XP ladder with no real issues what so ever......as for 80 percent Human?  heh, it hurts to laugh.

~Rex
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on December 18, 2007, 11:30:59 PM
Up till recently, with the spurt of dwarves and elves, yes, it was mostly humans (and maybe half-elves). *shrugs*

There was a changelog a few back that stated something about fixing the XP system to take ECL into consideration. Not sure if the system was broken before then for ECL races/monsters.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Rex on December 19, 2007, 11:34:07 AM
Up till recently, with the spurt of dwarves and elves, yes, it was mostly humans (and maybe half-elves). *shrugs*

There was a changelog a few back that stated something about fixing the XP system to take ECL into consideration. Not sure if the system was broken before then for ECL races/monsters.

I looked the list over ........

Not sure I like a lot of those being available, though I would rather see Giff, then Scros.  Still though it's content and I rather like Content. 

~Rex
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Helaman on December 20, 2007, 09:59:22 AM
Dwarves and Elves are a recent thing - it will die away in time but ethnic groups are fun to play.

I'm waiting for the human mobs of NPCs to go apeshit on a random elf or dwarf... we've been throwing our wieght around lately and even had two dwarves dueling to the death in the outskirts as well as later baiting each other in front of a guard.

Slapdown cannot be too far away.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Rex on December 20, 2007, 02:13:30 PM
Dwarves and Elves are a recent thing - it will die away in time but ethnic groups are fun to play.

I'm waiting for the human mobs of NPCs to go apeshit on a random elf or dwarf... we've been throwing our wieght around lately and even had two dwarves dueling to the death in the outskirts as well as later baiting each other in front of a guard.

Slapdown cannot be too far away.

True but slapdown from yet another Radu Class Battleship, is rather boring.  My gripe with all the subraces now is you have even MORE cases of people paling around with things they should not be paling around with.  Then when they DO decide to initiate slapdown, it's just OOC hypocrisy.  Besides it's allready to prevalent for my tastes the never ending parade of wierdos that you can't tell are wierdos because they have a piece of cloth over the top of their head, or they have some Helm or some such crafted up to look like a face.

~Rex

~Rex
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Knas on January 14, 2008, 03:00:21 AM
The list needs to be updated with stats + link to eraldurs thread! I'd do it but I'm too noob to figure how you link into the middle of a page -__-
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Struwelpeter on January 14, 2008, 09:08:43 AM
Errrr.... Speaking of sub-races..... Don't wanna sound annoying but.....
When will someone fix the athasian elf's ability to go "expeditious retreat"?

S.p.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: kenpen on January 14, 2008, 10:03:58 AM
Is there a place where the modifications and additional stats are all together for these? Or, do you just type in the subrace in the section, and build from there...?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Ellana Twiggy on June 30, 2008, 06:08:37 PM
How about dragon? some one that rp's up learning their heritage until they can fully embrace their blood line?  I only forsee the bonus being an item that polymorph's the char into a dragon so many times per day. Feasible?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: penny on June 30, 2008, 06:51:12 PM
That isn't possible, in any source material I've read.

Make a mage and use the polymorph spell.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Negnar on July 01, 2008, 01:32:30 AM
How about dragon? some one that rp's up learning their heritage until they can fully embrace their blood line?  I only forsee the bonus being an item that polymorph's the char into a dragon so many times per day. Feasible?

:roflmao:

...... I mean.... i'd bet anything on the answer of "no chance"

If you want a character with a Dragon Heritage play an RDD
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: DM Shadowspawn on July 01, 2008, 02:09:02 AM
If you want a character with a Dragon Heritage play an RDD

I'm pretty sure this players PC is a RDD. ;)
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Ellana Twiggy on July 01, 2008, 03:42:19 AM
it is. heh.  Slowly working her way to become more and more familiar with her heritage. But, she will never be able to polymorph into a dragon saddly.  :cry:

Well, not unless she can one day figure out enchanting and have some one better with spells help her make something.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Negnar on July 01, 2008, 04:25:41 AM
Well I figure that the only way someone could then turn into a dragon would be to be a full dragon and we don't allow that here, a lv 10 RDD will already have wings and scales (and be hostile to basically all NPC's) so that should be enough.

S'the same reason we don't have full celestial and demons walking about looking all angel/demon like (although I'm sure a DM would give a Tiefling/Aasimar a tail/wings if it was suited, so long as that PC realised that wings are not easy to hide and if see will have ya hunted)
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: boompowclash on July 01, 2008, 04:40:35 AM
quick question: Cambions/Fey'ri/tieflings... and Reality Wrinkle.   :?:

Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Tarth on September 20, 2008, 01:26:47 PM
kinda courious are genasi's going to be added? like earth fire, water, air?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: boompowclash on February 19, 2009, 06:49:49 AM
Fey'ri will go in without the shapechange ability nor flight obviously.

I removed Kalashtar though since their major ability is to have a form of telepathic link with others.

Re: Fey'ri Alter self, is this being considered any longer?  It makes up the bulk of their +3 ECL... I know the Fey'ri population isn't noteworthy but I wanted to inquire nonetheless.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: hugolino on August 06, 2010, 04:40:30 AM
Re: Fey'ri Alter self, is this being considered any longer?

Heh.... that struck me as funny because I recently read an article where the writer used the euphemism "alter" to refer to sterilizing cats. That puts an "Alter Self" ability in a whole different perspective.  ;)
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Ellana Twiggy on November 16, 2010, 08:47:05 AM
I was considering something which might be feasable, how about a wraith race, say a vengeful pc returning from the dead after thier corpse has been burned and/or decimated? Ghosts can attack pc's as monsters, so why couldn't a pc become a wraith or some such if they died? Just a query.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Psyche on November 16, 2010, 09:11:02 AM
I've suggested this as a new MPC template. Along with Alchemical Golems.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: BrightLights on November 30, 2010, 05:37:32 PM
Made a half-elf the other day, intended to be a half-drow. Half-Drow was not a selectable subrace. :I

Is this a mistake, or on purpose?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Telkar on December 01, 2010, 07:40:42 AM
I think half-drow are one of those subraces you need to send an application to the CC for.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Sewerprince on December 01, 2010, 07:59:27 AM
When I made my half-drow I didn't have to put in an application, this might be due to the fact you don't really get any bonuses as a half-drow XD

But they might've changed it since then
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: HellsPanda on December 01, 2010, 08:06:45 AM
did you use a subrace? the primary difference is the fact a Half drow gets a high OCR
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: BrightLights on December 01, 2010, 11:44:37 AM
I ended up making her from the Birthright campaign (Half-Sidhelien) and used it as a way to learn about another setting. =P I was really just confused about how it happened, because when I made my older character (who was a half drow), it was available at creation.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Sewerprince on December 01, 2010, 05:16:00 PM
did you use a subrace? the primary difference is the fact a Half drow gets a high OCR

Yeah, I meant as in stats/abilities wise =)
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Zedrik on December 02, 2010, 12:30:29 PM
Half-Drow don't require an application last I knew.
They don't really get much in the way of bonuses and have no ECL.
I'd have to look, but their primary defining trait is their darkvision and they start with a OCR of 17.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Grim on July 06, 2011, 03:31:37 PM
Dark Sun:
Half-Orcs:
Half-Giant (perhaps a subrace for Half-Orcs?)

Thri-Kreen (also a playable race in Darksun)

Pretty sure those were left out purposefully as EO mentioned "Consider that some races were intentionally ommited because they didn't work right in NwN or because they looked too foreign and aliens."

Thri keen is understandable, since we have no way to introduce things like "multiweapon" fighting for races that can wield more then 2 weapons at a time.  However Half giants could fit into the caliban camp pretty easy.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: HellsPanda on July 06, 2011, 03:35:26 PM
not really, the Half Giant would need a model the size of an ogre
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Grim on July 06, 2011, 09:02:58 PM
not really, the Half Giant would need a model the size of an ogre

They could just enlarge the half orc or human model, maybe give it a different head.  Just a thought.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on July 06, 2011, 09:04:23 PM
I don't believe it's that easy. I asked about more variants of the current phenotypes and was told this.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Grim on July 11, 2011, 08:46:03 PM
I don't believe it's that easy. I asked about more variants of the current phenotypes and was told this.

maybe not, just throwing that out there because that's how i've seen some other places do it, scaling models up or down for different things (like the cave near the starting mist camp that has the itsy bitsy wererats with green hands in it)
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on July 12, 2011, 12:07:49 PM
I've tried bribing Soren or any other Dev with beer without any success. Here's the other thread (http://www.nwnravenloft.com/forum/index.php?topic=24113.0), where you can see what Soren said.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Draxiss on July 24, 2011, 09:46:56 PM
Hmm . . . it occurs to me . . . a lot of those races that you won't use because of they dynamic model issue . . . such a lizardfolk (to make those lizard-feminists happy), draconians, lupins, etc. could use a dynamic model with a helm for a head. I know calibans are allowed to play as having a helm for their heads, and things like tails and wings could be added on by DM request . . .
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on July 25, 2011, 12:52:33 AM
I believe the stranger races were left out because they didn't fit in with our setting. Heck, even dwarves, elves, and other standard races are distrusted strongly by the native Barovians.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: TotalRandomness on July 25, 2011, 01:38:17 AM
Agreed. It's best not to get TOO crazy when making characters. When a caliban looks twice at some hulking beastie with reptilian features and wings with no real hint of humanity about them, then I think there's a line that's been crossed.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on April 14, 2019, 10:56:33 PM
As of next update, many subraces will be slightly adjusted; in some cases, the changes will be more major (Athasian Elf, Athasian Dwarf, Athasian Halfling will now have ECL and different statistics overall). In most cases though, the adjustments will be minor and may not even be noticeable.

Since we first implemented subraces (about 10 years ago), we've added new feats and NwNx support, which allow us to better represent these subraces as they would be in PnP.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: qwertyuioppp on April 14, 2019, 11:02:55 PM
Will any of these new ECL races be unlocked by application only?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on April 15, 2019, 06:28:11 AM
Will any of these new ECL races be unlocked by application only?

For now no, since they weren’t before.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: BahamutZ3RO on April 15, 2019, 02:19:42 PM
Time to put Fey'ri back in, right? How's about some Genasi?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: ethinos on April 16, 2019, 04:42:00 PM
As of next update, many subraces will be slightly adjusted; in some cases, the changes will be more major (Athasian Elf, Athasian Dwarf, Athasian Halfling will now have ECL and different statistics overall). In most cases though, the adjustments will be minor and may not even be noticeable.

Since we first implemented subraces (about 10 years ago) and now, we've added new feats and NwNx support, which allow us to better represent these subraces as they would be in PnP.

I haven't tried the new EE version yet. Do the subrace modifiers show up at character creation now or only after you log into the game?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on April 17, 2019, 07:38:56 PM
I haven't tried the new EE version yet. Do the subrace modifiers show up at character creation now or only after you log into the game?

Still after you log into the game. It'd be technically possible to add a few of them as their own subraces and possibly something we will consider eventually for some (ie: Half Vistani, Aasimar, Tiefling and other planetouched races) but it's not a priority.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Phantasia on April 17, 2019, 07:41:04 PM
Are we going to get a comprehensive subrace list with all mechanical changes?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: TheFury on April 26, 2019, 06:23:13 PM
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/172189000881274880/571458190877655050/unknown.png)

So I realize (and as is implemented in the game right now), that star elves don't get Elven weapon proficiency. That being said, so far as I can tell Otherworldly Touch hasn't been implemented on the server, meaning they get nothing to make up for it. It's only four weapon proficiencies, hardly unbalancing, but having it taken away without rebuild or getting something in return could cripple a character that relies on having it rather than martial for at least a level if not more. If not, could they either get Otherworldly Touch or some rough equivalent (like blind fight, which isn't as good as Otherworldly Touch but useful in more situations) in exchange? If this isn't the place for this post, I'll create another topic.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Iridni Ren on April 26, 2019, 07:26:25 PM
Although I'm not aware yet of this affecting me significantly, I'm perplexed by the timing of the race change immediately after players just re-leveled their PCs for the hak (and while bugs from that are still being ironed out).

EO mentioned that the subraces have been this way for 10 years. If changing them couldn't be done simultaneously with the recent hak, why not wait until the next--particularly if the changes will cause some PCs to have to yet again adjust their builds and re-level?
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: Arawn on April 26, 2019, 07:31:38 PM
Although I'm not aware yet of this affecting me significantly, I'm perplexed by the timing of the race change immediately after players just re-leveled their PCs for the hak (and while bugs from that are still being ironed out).

EO mentioned that the subraces have been this way for 10 years. If changing them couldn't be done simultaneously with the recent hak, why not wait until the next--particularly if the changes will cause some PCs to have to yet again adjust their builds and re-level?

Because developers work when they have inspiration and time, not based on a corporate production schedule. EO had the idea because of other new content and changes we're not quite ready to reveal yet, and decided to take the initiative to put them in while he had time in real life. That's how this works and, I'm afraid, and with a team of volunteers is the only way it realistically can and will work.

Additionally, if we don't integrate new content as we make it, we run the risk of having to substantially re-integrate that content later, which would be fine, again, if we were a corporation, but we aren't, so it isn't. We believe that the benefits of players having new content outside of a hak update outweighs the minor inconvenience of having to relevel a few characters who are affected by it. You are free to disagree, but that's why we do it how we do it.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on July 28, 2019, 01:19:40 PM
Going to add the following subraces in my next update:

Half-Drow (added to Eberron) Source: Eberron's Player Guide
Snow Elf (Greyhawk) Source: Dragon 155(AD&D)/Player's Guide to Greyhawk (AD&D)/Frostburn
Celadrin (Forgotten Realms) - ECL 1 / requires application Source: Dragon 350
Wild Gnome (Dragonlance) Source: Races of Ansalon
Poscadar Elf (Forgotten Realms, specifically Maztica) Source: City of Gold
Umbragen (Eberron) - ECL 2 / requires application Source: Dragon 330
Fire Gnome (The Multiverse) - ECL 1 / requires application Source: Planar Handbook
Frost Dwarf (The Multiverse) - ECL 1 / requires application Source: Planar Handbook
Cansin (The Multiverse) - ECL 2 / requires application Source: Dragon 297
Axani (The Multiverse) - ECL 2 / requires application Source: Dragon 297

We'll also remove the option to play a Zenythri, but existing ones will not be affected. Axani will cover the role of Zenythri.
Title: Re: Subraces - List for Review
Post by: EO on July 29, 2019, 09:58:43 PM
These changes should now be implemented.