Yeah, I really wish we could see some of the more fun/interesting summons. :( I really think the team needs to sit down and rethink their approach toward summons in general, particularly given that now you can brew potions for nearly every buff. It's skewing things in one direction quite badly.
Going off of the conventions of other servers without questioning the viability of following their examples, other servers make use of dialogue systems usually initiated through books or items that allow the player to change the types of summoned creatures brought forth by specific spells; things like setting your Planar Binding/Gate spells to exclusively summon Yugoloths, Tanar'ri, etc or the Summon I-IX series to only summon various types of animals or even other kinds of undead.
In addition, weaker summons such as regular Shadows or zombies I have seen implemented as a 'swarm' type summon where multiple instances of the creature are brought forth, taking advantage of how they are a weaker creature but useful in mobs for their drain effects or disease afflictions etc. However given the repeated statement that the design viewpoint of the server is that summons have not and will not be made a viable choice to prevent soloing, despite multiple other classes and builds having that as a possibility through niche designs, will continue to prevent such an overhaul of the summon system.
*Thematic Thread Necromancy*
^-^ I wanted to bump this again for a consideration in a change to the final creature of the Pale Master ability, Summon Greater Undead.
As mentioned above, I believe the intended final creature is the Greater Bodak. While it has a reasonable number of HP, this creature is pretty unusable. The main feature of this summon is the Death Gaze. Since undead are immune to this and the remaining level-appropriate enemies are mostly guaranteed to succeed on a DC: 15 save, it leaves the Bodak to fight melee. Even with several of the new undead augmentation feats, it doesn't stand a chance in combat unless you're fighting something far below your level. It only has a base of 1 attack per round, no weapon, and a +8 AB.
I think the 'Vampire' from the Create Greater Undead cleric spell, would be a much more fitting summon to replace the Greater Bodak. I've placed the base stats for several creatures below, including these two creatures - along with some other summons that are accessible through spells and abilities around level 14/15, for comparison.
Greater BodakSpoiler: show
VampireSpoiler: show
Summon Creature VII - Water ElementalSpoiler: show
Mordenkainen's Sword - Helmed HorrorSpoiler: show
As it stands, the other summons that you can gain at a similar level outclass the Greater Bodak in about every category. They also have similar immunities from being elementals or constructs. You can also further enhance the elementals through feats, as you can undead. Given that this is the most powerful summoning ability for a Pale Master - I'm hoping we can bump it up to something that stands a little better chance against the mid-level challenges on the server. I wouldn't expect this to replace a warrior or to go mowing down Pit Fiends, but something that has reasonable survivability and poses a bit more threat would be a fantastic boost!
The only trouble I see with this is taking it in singularity compared to everything else a palemaster gets. Treating it as a base caster class of Wizard for example, the popular choice. I may need correction on this, but currently, pale master has the benefits over a wizard of the following -
-More HP per level, from d4 to d6, increasing by a further 3hp per level post level 5.
-Increased AC, by +6
-Permanent +4 strength bonus
-Immunity to paralysis, stun, critical hit
-Darkvision
-Deadly touch attack.
Yes, it gets summons on top of that, and yes, they are weaker than the equivalent level summons. They are also however free. They don't cost a spell slot. They are also in conjunction with the *massive* bonuses listed above, with continued spell progression per level. Doesn't making those free summons that don't cost a spell slot as powerful as a slotted spell on top of all the other bonuses feel a bit... much? Especially with all the undead summon feats to make those free summons even stronger again?
The only trouble I see with this is taking it in singularity compared to everything else a palemaster gets. Treating it as a base caster class of Wizard for example, the popular choice. I may need correction on this, but currently, pale master has the benefits over a wizard of the following -
-More HP per level, from d4 to d6, increasing by a further 3hp per level post level 5.
-Increased AC, by +6
-Permanent +4 strength bonus
-Immunity to paralysis, stun, critical hit
-Darkvision
-Deadly touch attack.
Yes, it gets summons on top of that, and yes, they are weaker than the equivalent level summons. They are also however free. They don't cost a spell slot. They are also in conjunction with the *massive* bonuses listed above, with continued spell progression per level. Doesn't making those free summons that don't cost a spell slot as powerful as a slotted spell on top of all the other bonuses feel a bit... much? Especially with all the undead summon feats to make those free summons even stronger again?
Just a reminder this thread is three years old.It IS a necromancy thread.