Ravenloft: Prisoners of the Mist

Suggestions, Feedback & Bug Reports (OOC) => Module Feedback and Suggestions => Topic started by: Iluvatar / Madness on February 08, 2017, 09:30:05 AM

Title: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Iluvatar / Madness on February 08, 2017, 09:30:05 AM
Feedback for Dementlieu goes here! Old thread was way over the page limit!

Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on February 09, 2017, 02:11:29 PM
Quote
Bouillabaisse Item Description: Bouillabaisse is a traditional fish stew made by boiling several species of fish with herbs and vegetables. The broth is then served as a soup poured over bread seasoned with rouille (a spicy mayonnaise) with the fish and vegetables served separately.

Sole Meunière Item Description: A fillet of sole dredged in flour, pan fried in butter and served with the resulting brown butter sauce, parsley and lemon.

Fairly belated but will add those. If you have more suggestions for food items for Dementlieu, please post descriptions with item appearances here and a possible cost for them.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Bells And Whistles on February 12, 2017, 11:17:53 PM
Emmanuelle's Fashion

Can we please give this store a much-needed overhaul? There's nothing wrong with the appearance of the clothing items, or the selection offered, just some details that don't make a lot of sense to me. For example, You pay hundreds of coins for these 'noble gowns/suits' and the description's do nothing to indicate such. Could we please add even just a generic description of 'This is a well tailored gown of silk, something, blah blah blah' and set the quality to excellent or some such, or indicate the material as silk. Heck, maybe even a small influence boost.

Instead of what we have now  -

(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/204761912674746368/280552417689337856/unknown.png)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Philos on February 14, 2017, 03:48:39 AM
Could some consideration be given to adding more NPC's to the Marchand? There's quite a few sailors on Widows Walk and two gendarme but other than that the area feels rather empty. The ouvier, publique and savant all are pretty well fleshed out with life but the marchand is a bit lacking imo.

Some suggestions:

A pair of pistolers out side of Gearlings.
A few commoners along the upper streets.
Some outdoor vendors with stalls next to the tanner. Baked goods, fresh fish.
Some shady looking men in the concealed alcove behind the broken spire.
A beggar or two spread out.
A drunk in front of the mutinied Sailor.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Socha on February 14, 2017, 04:41:07 AM
Could some consideration be given to adding more NPC's to the Marchand? There's quite a few sailors on Widows Walk and two gendarme but other than that the area feels rather empty. The ouvier, publique and savant all are pretty well fleshed out with life but the marchand is a bit lacking imo.

Some suggestions:

A pair of pistolers out side of Gearlings.
A few commoners along the upper streets.
Some outdoor vendors with stalls next to the tanner. Baked goods, fresh fish.
Some shady looking men in the concealed alcove behind the broken spire.
A beggar or two spread out.
A drunk in front of the mutinied Sailor.

A pair of armed guards outside of Gearlings would make sense. They could be scripted to head inside and guard the store after dark.
Outdoor vendors are also a good idea to give the area a more mercantile type of ambiance. Maybe show off the imported products that Dementlieu is known for.
Rest are cool as well, maybe conversation lines with the beggars or the shady looking men to direct players toward XYZ locations. i.e. pay a shady man X amount of coin to get direction to the black market
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Song of Danta on March 26, 2017, 11:42:27 AM
Park benches around the usual terrace-lurking spots in Quartier Publique would be nice.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Socha on March 26, 2017, 10:46:27 PM
What about turning the terrace into an outdoors café?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Bells And Whistles on April 04, 2017, 06:30:33 PM
When I renew my hotel room, the second key possessed by another PC does not also renew.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on April 04, 2017, 06:38:02 PM
When I renew my hotel room, the second key possessed by another PC does not also renew.

It has to be in your inventory when you renew.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Bells And Whistles on April 04, 2017, 07:32:11 PM
When I renew my hotel room, the second key possessed by another PC does not also renew.

It has to be in your inventory when you renew.

thanks!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: cunning.weasel on April 07, 2017, 08:04:40 AM
A vicious ruffian has gone around Quartier Publique knocking signs askew. These are the ones I noticed:

Spoiler: show
(http://i.imgur.com/FDB7CYM.png)

(http://i.imgur.com/vWpBKKc.png)

(http://i.imgur.com/77m7CpA.png)

(http://i.imgur.com/lSXo35I.png)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on April 25, 2017, 07:31:09 AM
FYI: I've rebalanced the Old Sewers dungeon under Dementlieu; I replaced the much loved oozes with Shaobath's and tweaked the power level of the Thralls.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: cunning.weasel on April 26, 2017, 04:04:31 AM
A suggestion for the bank in Port-a-Lucine:

It always strikes me as odd that the bankers announce your funds for all to hear, particularly since the Dementlieuse consider discussing money openly to be in bad taste. Could the banker conversation be set to private?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Philos on April 26, 2017, 05:32:51 AM
A suggestion for the bank in Port-a-Lucine:

It always strikes me as odd that the bankers announce your funds for all to hear, particularly since the Dementlieuse consider discussing money openly to be in bad taste. Could the banker conversation be set to private?

Seconding this. Either have it be a private conversation window or an option to write your balance down on a slip of paper. Broadcasting your characters wealth like that is a bit annoying and unrealistic for a banker.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Dumas on June 13, 2017, 08:20:09 PM
I've been giving this a lot of thought lately, and I believe it would be of great benefit to expand some more of Dementlieu's areas outside of Port-a-Lucine, particularly around the Avenue du Progress.

 As now, it's mostly a straight shot route between Port and Edrigan, and while built very prettily, there's no branching areas off the main road. I think the addition of some side areas branching off the main road, would be of great benefit. They could be as simple as forest clearings, empty caves, secluded ponds, or even abandoned homesteads in the woods, but such would add a lot more interest to the countryside areas of Dementlieu, and would certainly expand the possibilities for RP outside Port-a-Lucine.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Dumas on December 22, 2017, 07:50:21 PM
Just wanted to say that the Dock Office interior in the Marchand looks very well done since the updates! Nice attention to details!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on August 12, 2018, 09:19:29 PM
A suggestion for the bank in Port-a-Lucine:

It always strikes me as odd that the bankers announce your funds for all to hear, particularly since the Dementlieuse consider discussing money openly to be in bad taste. Could the banker conversation be set to private?

Somewhat late but this will be implemented for all bank NPCs.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on February 20, 2019, 08:27:55 PM
I noticed that the Gendarme's interior doors get unlocked on resets some times. I presume that should not be the case?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on February 20, 2019, 11:10:28 PM
I noticed that the Gendarme's interior doors get unlocked on resets some times. I presume that should not be the case?

That's one of those things that they said they were going to fix a while (6-7 months) ago, but I don't think it ever got fixed. Can't hurt to bump it.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on March 08, 2019, 02:09:18 PM
Could some consideration be given to adding more NPC's to the Marchand? There's quite a few sailors on Widows Walk and two gendarme but other than that the area feels rather empty. The ouvier, publique and savant all are pretty well fleshed out with life but the marchand is a bit lacking imo.

Some suggestions:

A pair of pistolers out side of Gearlings.
A few commoners along the upper streets.
Some outdoor vendors with stalls next to the tanner. Baked goods, fresh fish.
Some shady looking men in the concealed alcove behind the broken spire.
A beggar or two spread out.
A drunk in front of the mutinied Sailor.

This would be good to show that the city is more lively. So I like it and hope the Devs take notice. :)


I've been giving this a lot of thought lately, and I believe it would be of great benefit to expand some more of Dementlieu's areas outside of Port-a-Lucine, particularly around the Avenue du Progress.

 As now, it's mostly a straight shot route between Port and Edrigan, and while built very prettily, there's no branching areas off the main road. I think the addition of some side areas branching off the main road, would be of great benefit. They could be as simple as forest clearings, empty caves, secluded ponds, or even abandoned homesteads in the woods, but such would add a lot more interest to the countryside areas of Dementlieu, and would certainly expand the possibilities for RP outside Port-a-Lucine.

Yea, it would be great to have more areas branching off the Avenue du Progress so I really like this idea :)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on March 24, 2019, 04:29:15 PM
I wonder if there could be the Asylum of Port-a-Lucine? I think Dementlieu would be the perfect place for that sort of rp. :)


Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: zDark Shadowz on March 24, 2019, 04:37:34 PM
It isn't present currently? Poor Dr. Zuvich.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on March 24, 2019, 04:49:30 PM
It isn't present currently? Poor Dr. Zuvich.

As far as I am aware, nope its not in the module.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on March 24, 2019, 07:33:07 PM
It isn't present currently? Poor Dr. Zuvich.

As far as I am aware, nope its not in the module.

If we're talking about the Asylum in Chateaufaux, they'd have to add a second City to the module, which presents it's own issues down the road, I feel. Anyone who is actually committed to the Asylum (which requires a DM present for, anyways) can still be involved in the RP. But it's much more like a horrifying prison than it is anything truly useful in common RP.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on March 24, 2019, 07:41:02 PM
If we're talking about the Asylum in Chateaufaux, they'd have to add a second City to the module, which presents it's own issues down the road, I feel. Anyone who is actually committed to the Asylum (which requires a DM present for, anyways) can still be involved in the RP. But it's much more like a horrifying prison than it is anything truly useful in common RP.

Different Asylum. The Asylum in Port-a-Lucine is describe below. That said we had people work at the Zaracroft Asylum, so I figure one could exist in Dementlieu where people could do the rp. :)

Quote
The Asylum of Port-a-Lucine is directed by the alienist Dr. Zuvich, a sceptic who does not believe in the Legions of the Night. Among the patients at the asylum is an individual who was abroad the Martha's Pride out of Martira Bay when the vessel was set upon by the undead crew of the Illsong under the leadership of Audun Beck. The unfortunate fellow is now being treated for his 'delusions' of having encountered the 'living dead'.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on April 06, 2019, 09:31:28 AM
While it'd be nice, it'd be redundant to add another asylum. Our time can be better spent elsewhere, unless a developer feels like adding one, which isn't the case at the moment.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on April 06, 2019, 09:54:56 AM
While it'd be nice, it'd be redundant to add another asylum. Our time can be better spent elsewhere, unless a developer feels like adding one, which isn't the case at the moment.

That is understandable.

What are your thoughts on the other suggestions mentioned in this thread? Such as having more NPCs in the Marchand and having more areas going out from the Avenue du Progress? :)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on April 06, 2019, 09:57:23 AM
While it'd be nice, it'd be redundant to add another asylum. Our time can be better spent elsewhere, unless a developer feels like adding one, which isn't the case at the moment.

That is understandable.

What are your thoughts on the other suggestions mentioned in this thread? Such as having more NPCs in the Marchand and having more areas going out from the Avenue du Progress? :)

Refer to my previous point. None of these are bad suggestions but they need someone to implement them, so someone with the time and desire to do so.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on April 10, 2019, 02:23:51 PM
Can Emanulle's fashion shop also have leather and metal dyes for outfits :)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: APorg on April 10, 2019, 04:48:06 PM
Can Emanulle's fashion shop also have leather and metal dyes for outfits :)

There's metal dyes available at the dwarf smith in the Marchand.

But yeah, adding leather dyes would be nice, one assumes a fashion shop would deal in leather!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: zDark Shadowz on April 10, 2019, 05:16:46 PM
The bazaar does sell all 3 in anycase.

Some more connections between the west and east grassland to go around Port-A-Lucine might be nice to give it more of an enlarged feel.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: FellowMan on April 20, 2019, 05:59:17 PM
It feels like the disease procs in the sewer (the black market specifically) stack the odds against anyone setting up in Port's underworld scene.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Iridni Ren on April 20, 2019, 10:40:20 PM
The color of the ballroom floor can make seeing the chat box difficult. Because the floor is so large, from some positions it's difficult to zoom out far enough to get the chat box on some other color.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on April 20, 2019, 10:43:38 PM
The color of the ballroom floor can make seeing the chat box difficult. Because the floor is so large, from some positions it's difficult to zoom out far enough to get the chat box on some other color.

yea, very bright white that can be kind of blinding.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on April 25, 2019, 07:39:26 AM
The color of the ballroom floor can make seeing the chat box difficult. Because the floor is so large, from some positions it's difficult to zoom out far enough to get the chat box on some other color.

yea, very bright white that can be kind of blinding.

I concur. That junk is almost so bright I’d rather hold my events anywhere else that doesn’t burn my retinas like a freshly opened google chrome window at 3 AM.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on April 25, 2019, 08:18:14 AM
Try disabling some of the EE shaders, some of them brighten things too much. For the time being there are no plans to change the tiles since this is mostly due to individual players’ settings.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Iridni Ren on April 25, 2019, 09:03:12 AM
To be clear, my feedback is not about aesthetics but accessibility. I've never tinkered with the shaders, so I don't know whether adjusting the white on my end would also adjust the chat color (meaning it would not achieve the contrast necessary to make text more legible). I do know that other areas of the module (e.g. Krofburg) are already so dark that even for a PC with darkvision navigating is an exercise in frustration. Consequently, I'm unlikely to want to optimize globally based on an area that I have spent almost no time playing in and would not expect to do so except for the occasional event.

I think the ballroom *looks* fine. Quite a lot of Dementlieu--as I remarked to Dread about the lift in the theatre only two nights ago--is imaginative and visually pleasing. But the combination of color and area size for the dance floor as a practical matter (for my eyes at least) is problematic.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Quartermaster on April 25, 2019, 09:09:11 AM
If you haven't downloaded this and put it in your override folder you might want to: https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwnee/other/nwnee-shader-prototypes-advanced-content
I had the game is too dark to play thing, and this fixed most of the to dark issues.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Iridni Ren on April 25, 2019, 09:24:07 AM
If you haven't downloaded this and put it in your override folder you might want to: https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwnee/other/nwnee-shader-prototypes-advanced-content
I had the game is too dark to play thing, and this fixed most of the to dark issues.

Thanks for the suggestion; "too dark" is a much more common experience for me than "too bright" :)

I may give it a try, but I generally try to keep my game as vanilla as possible so that whatever issues I have are likely to be server- and module-based and therefore similar to other users, rather than my own customizations.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Hypatia on April 25, 2019, 11:37:06 AM
Maybe this should go into bug fixes, but in the little outdoor cafe, I noticed the black tea and esspresso drinks aren’t consumable.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Quartermaster on April 25, 2019, 11:54:49 AM
If you haven't downloaded this and put it in your override folder you might want to: https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwnee/other/nwnee-shader-prototypes-advanced-content
I had the game is too dark to play thing, and this fixed most of the to dark issues.

Thanks for the suggestion; "too dark" is a much more common experience for me than "too bright" :)

I may give it a try, but I generally try to keep my game as vanilla as possible so that whatever issues I have are likely to be server- and module-based and therefore similar to other users, rather than my own customizations.

By the way, this over-ride was made by Soren...
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Iridni Ren on April 25, 2019, 12:21:26 PM
Spoiler: show
quote author=Iridni Ren link=topic=45347.msg622582#msg622582 date=1556198647]
If you haven't downloaded this and put it in your override folder you might want to: https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwnee/other/nwnee-shader-prototypes-advanced-content
I had the game is too dark to play thing, and this fixed most of the to dark issues.

Thanks for the suggestion; "too dark" is a much more common experience for me than "too bright" :)

I may give it a try, but I generally try to keep my game as vanilla as possible so that whatever issues I have are likely to be server- and module-based and therefore similar to other users, rather than my own customizations.
[/quote]


By the way, this over-ride was made by Soren...

Soren? Who dat?

Ok...you convinced me :D

Will give it a whirl.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on April 25, 2019, 04:37:42 PM
Try disabling some of the EE shaders, some of them brighten things too much. For the time being there are no plans to change the tiles since this is mostly due to individual players’ settings.

I don't actually have anything enabled except for Sharpen, but the excessive white of the Governor's Hotel Ballroom floor has always been a thing. I just never bothered to mention it until someone else did. I can see that they are ICly going for this porcelain-marbled floor look, to be grand and ostentatious, but it's a little rough on the eyes from an OOC standpoint.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on May 03, 2019, 09:56:58 PM
I wonder if it is possible for a single templar to be in the Cathedral? Considering the importance of the Stained Glass to the faith, it feels odd that there isn't a single templar in the church.  :)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: RickDeckard on May 04, 2019, 12:08:45 AM
I wonder if it is possible for a single templar to be in the Cathedral? Considering the importance of the Stained Glass to the faith, it feels odd that there isn't a single templar in the church.  :)

Seconded, some Templars would be lovely and a confession booth is sorely needed in the Cathedral!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on May 04, 2019, 10:17:18 PM
I wonder if it is possible for a single templar to be in the Cathedral? Considering the importance of the Stained Glass to the faith, it feels odd that there isn't a single templar in the church.  :)

Seconded, some Templars would be lovely and a confession booth is sorely needed in the Cathedral!

I would like to also suggest that Templars be added outside the two main doors in the isolated Marchand/Savant transitions. Ste. Mere-des-Larmes is the seat of power for the Third Sect, you'd imagine there to be a similar setup to Raduta Keep in Barovia, given it is a major landmark.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Arawn on May 04, 2019, 10:57:21 PM
I wonder if it is possible for a single templar to be in the Cathedral? Considering the importance of the Stained Glass to the faith, it feels odd that there isn't a single templar in the church.  :)

Seconded, some Templars would be lovely and a confession booth is sorely needed in the Cathedral!

I would like to also suggest that Templars be added outside the two main doors in the isolated Marchand/Savant transitions. Ste. Mere-des-Larmes is the seat of power for the Third Sect, you'd imagine there to be a similar setup to Raduta Keep in Barovia, given it is a major landmark.

The lack of Templars is intentional; it's in keeping with the scholarly, reclusive mission of the Third Sect; we have no plans to add them.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on May 04, 2019, 11:09:04 PM
I wonder if it is possible for a single templar to be in the Cathedral? Considering the importance of the Stained Glass to the faith, it feels odd that there isn't a single templar in the church.  :)

Seconded, some Templars would be lovely and a confession booth is sorely needed in the Cathedral!

I would like to also suggest that Templars be added outside the two main doors in the isolated Marchand/Savant transitions. Ste. Mere-des-Larmes is the seat of power for the Third Sect, you'd imagine there to be a similar setup to Raduta Keep in Barovia, given it is a major landmark.

The lack of Templars is intentional; it's in keeping with the scholarly, reclusive mission of the Third Sect; we have no plans to add them.

Not even in the temple near the stained glass? I figure a single templar watching over it(and the anchrotites chamber) would be good. I know they are mostly scholars I just figured the importance of the Stained Glass would warrant at least a single templar to help watch over it.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Bastard Son on May 05, 2019, 03:06:01 AM
Perhaps instead of the traditional Raduta style templars, some stripped down, be-robed warriors that would fit the aesthetic of the temple more, while still making sense to have the protection such a significant place would warrant.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: RickDeckard on May 05, 2019, 06:23:19 AM
Perhaps instead of the traditional Raduta style templars, some stripped down, be-robed warriors that would fit the aesthetic of the temple more, while still making sense to have the protection such a significant place would warrant.
Seconded...and a confessional booth like what the Refuge in Vallaki has.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Arawn on May 05, 2019, 08:21:05 AM
We’ll add a minimal Templar presence and a confession booth.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: RickDeckard on May 05, 2019, 08:24:14 AM
Awesome! Thank you!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on May 05, 2019, 06:23:59 PM
Perhaps instead of the traditional Raduta style templars, some stripped down, be-robed warriors that would fit the aesthetic of the temple more, while still making sense to have the protection such a significant place would warrant.

Even that would make sense. I mean, there's practically one NPC in the entire building accessible to players, and nobody is guarding the Archives. Even the Refuge of the Fifth Light has at least six Templars chilling by the interior doors of their chapel, and then an entire Rectory right beside it. Does nobody guard the special books?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Hypatia on June 01, 2019, 12:39:05 PM
What about a “beauty salon” in Port-A-Lucian where you can change your skin tone?

I’d love to see this in-game where we don’t need a DM, for both our sakes. I changed mine recently, but the lighting is so dramatic in that DM area that you don’t know what it looks like really until you get out and I wound up hating what I picked. I like to take my time to get it right, and I really can’t because the DM has to wait and I know they have better things to do than watch me spend an hour getting the tone I want. Maybe a place like a salon where you can do it without a DM would be easier for both sides.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Arawn on June 01, 2019, 01:06:30 PM
What about a “beauty salon” in Port-A-Lucian where you can change your skin tone?

I’d love to see this in-game where we don’t need a DM, for both our sakes. I changed mine recently, but the lighting is so dramatic in that DM area that you don’t know what it looks like really until you get out and I wound up hating what I picked. I like to take my time to get it right, and I really can’t because the DM has to wait and I know they have better things to do than watch me spend an hour getting the tone I want. Maybe a place like a salon where you can do it without a DM would be easier for both sides.

Changing your skin tone is not an intended feature. Your skin tone was changed temporarily as part of a DM plot. We have no plans to make this available outside of DM intervention.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on June 08, 2019, 11:55:08 PM
Since the Bellgrade Trading Consortium is a Dementlieuse company, from what I was told, should there not be an office for the BTC in Port-a-Lucine in the Marchand?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on December 31, 2019, 03:44:20 PM
So there was some discussion on Discord last night for ways to improve Dementlieu and these were some of the ideas discussed also some of the ideas of my own that I was thinking of.


Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Iridni Ren on December 31, 2019, 04:59:03 PM
  • More Dungeons: Currently the dungeons are mainly the sewers and the smuggle. Since Dementlieu is meant to be mid-high level zone, it was thought that some more dungeons might encourage people to come to Dementlieu. Some ideas for dungeons I had were haunted estates, cultists, falkovnian raiders

How about this (http://www.themistway.com/juste.html)? :D

I don't know how feasible it would be to create a Mistway that only sometimes occurs (perhaps located in Port's Opera House?) that allows entrance to this Domain, which would really only be a dungeon, rather than a new, full-blown domain.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 06, 2020, 09:29:20 PM
  • More Dungeons: Currently the dungeons are mainly the sewers and the smuggle. Since Dementlieu is meant to be mid-high level zone, it was thought that some more dungeons might encourage people to come to Dementlieu. Some ideas for dungeons I had were haunted estates, cultists, falkovnian raiders

How about this (http://www.themistway.com/juste.html)? :D

I don't know how feasible it would be to create a Mistway that only sometimes occurs (perhaps located in Port's Opera House?) that allows entrance to this Domain, which would really only be a dungeon, rather than a new, full-blown domain.

Scania is a fun domain but not sure it suits as a dungeon domain. Though having islands off the coast of Dementlieu in the Sea of Sorrows that have dungeons that require going to the docks. That could work. :)

Some other ideas that came to me today.

 :arrow: The University Museum would be great, perhaps tie it into the deliveries mentioned above.

 :arrow: Wig Maker: so in Gaz 1 it mentions that powder wigs are popular though that fashion doesn't look to be in currently. However a wigmaker could be used to help with the disguise system or the theater by allowing people to change colors for the head and the head itself.

 :arrow: new exhibits for the Wax Museum. The Wax Museum is great and a great way to show off characters from the setting. Though I am thinking there should be new ones. What about Malkin or Azalin or Malocchio and so on?

 :arrow: Showing game history in game. Dementlieu on our server has had quite a lot of events and upheavels. Several revolutions, successions of Lord-Governor, Foquelaine's attempted coup, and more. However more could be shown IG we do have some past Lord Governor's in the Palais and some museum exhibits.. More stuff like this could be done. Statues of the player councilor of Brilliance, more statues that tell of what happened, squares named after the characters or events.

 :arrow: Rentable stores and buildings throughout the city, mainly in the Savant, Ouriver and Marchand. This way if people want to have their own store or location for a player faction they could do so.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on February 26, 2020, 08:21:35 PM
A second Hotel in the Publique or Savant would be nice especially when the port becomes busy a lot of the rooms become taken.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on March 16, 2020, 07:41:23 PM
Could the Tenement building sign indicate that it is the tenements?


Also could we get street signs IG. :)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on April 12, 2020, 10:32:16 PM
On the road going from the western gates to the Domaines de la Vie Eclairee, could their be lanterns between the trees probably the rustic variety?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 05, 2021, 11:18:40 AM
Some suggestions:

 :arrow: An additional one or two rentable properties in the Marchand
 :arrow: An additional one or two rentable properties in the Savant
 :arrow: An additional one or two rentable properties in the Ouvrie; I believe atm there are none here, so having one for lower class rp would be great IMO.
 :arrow: A Poster board near the terraces for all the posters that people keep putting up
 :arrow: IG Street Signs within the city, so that you can tell which street your business is on

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: HouseOfLament on January 05, 2021, 01:31:15 PM
There is a rental with a lot of units in the Ouvier, I've never had problems renting.  It does appear w/ a pinpoint on the map.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: firelord111 on January 06, 2021, 05:04:39 AM
A road to go from east to west of city without having to go through the city would be great.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: HM01 on January 06, 2021, 08:02:58 AM
A road to go from east to west of city without having to go through the city would be great.

I like the premise of this idea alot. +1
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 06, 2021, 09:42:18 AM
There is a rental with a lot of units in the Ouvier, I've never had problems renting.  It does appear w/ a pinpoint on the map.
I think you are referring to the Tenement houses. I am referring to the various Warehouses in the Marchand and the Shops in the Savant. I would like to see one of them, for the Ouvrie.

A road to go from east to west of city without having to go through the city would be great.
I do like the idea of more country side.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: JustMonika on January 06, 2021, 12:06:26 PM
A road to go from east to west of city without having to go through the city would be great.

I like the premise of this idea alot. +1

-1 I do not like encouraging people to not pass through the city. I think that substantially cuts down on prospective oppertunities for RP at no real gain.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Kleomenes on January 06, 2021, 12:23:56 PM
Count me as a plus 1, along with a plus 1 for stuff that would make it easier for a Port a Lucine underworld to move around. Although it should be more inconvenient to encourage regular traffic through the city.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Alan Hunter on January 06, 2021, 12:26:11 PM
A road to go from east to west of city without having to go through the city would be great.

I like the premise of this idea alot. +1

-1 I do not like encouraging people to not pass through the city. I think that substantially cuts down on prospective oppertunities for RP at no real gain.

-1 I think a thruway in the city would be interesting. An Avenue of Modernization if you will. Its building could promote roleplay and if many used it would equally have as much encounter for roleplay as walking by. Think the nobles wouldnt mind a private city road tp pass the Ouvrie lol. And give Gendermie a direct payrol route to keep peasants and foriegners off the street.  It has rp poyential.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Legacy of Dreams on January 06, 2021, 12:37:49 PM
I would like to be able to travel around the city for the purpose of herb collection. More herbs in Dementlieu in general would be nice...  :)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: HM01 on January 06, 2021, 09:23:15 PM
A road to go from east to west of city without having to go through the city would be great.

I like the premise of this idea alot. +1

-1 I do not like encouraging people to not pass through the city. I think that substantially cuts down on prospective oppertunities for RP at no real gain.

There are game mechanics that force people into a very niche part of the server that they would never otherwise ever visit. An unobtrusive pathway to mitigate seems fine in my book, and would not diminish quality of play in the slightest.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BlackEmperor on January 06, 2021, 09:28:48 PM
-1 Being forced into uncomfortable society is the point of Dementlieu. Keep the funnel, keep the RP
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on January 06, 2021, 09:30:43 PM
We've discussed adding a road or a forest path around Dementlieu and are in favor but for the time being no one has volunteered to do it.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Khornite on January 06, 2021, 09:57:19 PM
-1 Being forced into uncomfortable society is the point of Dementlieu. Keep the funnel, keep the RP

A road around the city would be a great quality of life addition for crafters. I dunno about you guys, but sometimes crafters are running around with nearly full inventories and playing inventory tetris to put on your fancy clothes for a 30 second walk through the city is a massive headache when you're constantly in danger of dropping your enchanted items on the floor.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Profezzor_Darke on January 06, 2021, 10:47:52 PM
I actually have an idea for a road around the city.

Every large city has outskirts. I mean, Vallaki has.
And every large city should have an open Marketplace.
So adding some Outskirts, a couple of farms and houses right next to the city walls, (One could add more Halflings outside of the city, they could add more diversity to Dementlieu RP) and an open place for trade, where you don't have the feeling that some nobles sneer at your business all the time looking down on you from the terraces. To give higher level characters a place to peddle their wares, that does not feel obtrusive, or crowded.

Points to further support trading outside the City:

Traders are usually not High Society, and trade in the Publique feels off, the Savant offers no space and the other two quartiers are overrun with very deadly thugs at night. One could still make cut-throats spawn in the outskirts of port at night, walking in the alleys further from the "marketplace" perhaps.

And realistically speaking do few characters want to dwell in the Mist Camp, so having a Trading Hub there certainly wouldn't be wrong.

If we would have more crafting ressources added nearer to Port this would support that idea even more, given that Dementlieu is known not only for it's scholars but also it's artisans. And having an abandoned iron mine somewhere is already a dungeon idea. (Or if we're lazy and underline it is a city of commerce, then there could be ore-traders selling for Gold)

There even could very well be a "Gentlemens Club" that is more of a burlesque theatre and resembles another very Parisian cliché. Adding it to the Outskirts of Lucine would underline that Prostitution is very much frowned upon and not wanted inside the City Walls.

By making the southern City Gate in the Savant, people would still travel past the Terraces and as such facilliate RP there, given that they would still need to travel to the crafting halls and perhaps their more permanent housing options.

It would also allow Characters that are not fond of Nobility to do City RP while being able to evade them *somewhat*

That would also be a good place to add offices for things like the Bellegarde and other companies that mostly deal with material acquisition, given that the products of the Mines have to be refined somwhere and having a large smeltery inside the city would just put a cloak of smoke above the city of lights. Having it south of the city the winds coming from the sea would blow it away from it, so it's even realistic that the industry is out there.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Philos on January 06, 2021, 11:32:49 PM
We will be adding the ability to walk around the city. It's a mid term goal for me but I've a few updates inside the city I've been prioritizing. Stay tuned.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 06, 2021, 11:35:29 PM
We will be adding the ability to walk around the city. It's a mid term goal for me but I've a few updates inside the city I've been prioritizing. Stay tuned.
Any teasers or hints?  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Alan Hunter on January 07, 2021, 11:28:59 AM
A question that has come to mind recently is how did we come with a teaching body in the University? I ask on some feedback as recently we have players now hosting as professors holding class and such. For the longest I could remember I have tried to become a Doctor in Port with little to no success. I have inquired both as a character and player for some lengthy time only to give up the pursuit and make the achievement in Barovia because the attempt and answers in Port were fruitless.

Originally, was told to wait for DM Hosted classes but in the years prior this was really rare and not with out reason. Try as I might I was even told to speak with the Council to get a license but this of course led back to being a credited through the  University.

Given in game events things led me back to Port after a year so I attempeted to try again with little feedback. Now these past few weeks theres been a boom of activity i. The University with some idd changes
 So I'm curious how does a player become faculty? Is this a faction? Do you require a CC? Can anyone join? How is this maintained? Is there way for foreigners to attend outside of enrollments? Is the University the only way to be acreddited for job titles? Must you interact with the faculty to achive the goals of an acadamia graduate? What qualifies another player to grade another player? Is this DM Moderated? Can anyone be a head Master? Can anyone be part of the faculty?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Marcus Weyland on January 07, 2021, 12:21:52 PM
So I'm curious how does a player become faculty? Is this a faction? Do you require a CC? Can anyone join? How is this maintained? Is there way for foreigners to attend outside of enrollments? Is the University the only way to be acreddited for job titles? Must you interact with the faculty to achive the goals of an acadamia graduate? What qualifies another player to grade another player? Is this DM Moderated? Can anyone be a head Master? Can anyone be part of the faculty?
-A player becomes faculty by playing a character who meets criteria to become faculty. The recent player faculty characters (there are two de facto University professors being played right now) did so by becoming accredited and then interacting with DMPCs who could hire faculty.

-There are no lectures right now besides the ones that PC faculty members OR PC guest lecturers provide. You can tell if a foreign character would be welcome at these lectures by referring to the advertisements for the lecture; so far all have said "open to the public" meaning anyone can sit in.

-It's not an actual "faction" since there are no University faction "ranks", but a member of the Uni's faculty has obligations and expectations like any other group a PC can join.

-The university is the only way to obtain Dementlieuse academic accreditation, but idk what "job titles" you mean. You don't have to have a doctorate to roleplay in Dementlieu.

-You will have to interact with the faculty at some point to graduate. So far only the DMs' characters have hosted exams and given out grades. PC faculty haven't yet been asked or expected to give out assignments or grades.

-It is DM moderated but the point of having PC professors is to lower the DMs' workload and saving them from having to actually churn out ongoing curricula. At a certain point, a DM character decides who gets into the faculty, and probably will decide who graduates.

-A player can't be the University's president at the moment, because the current (NPC) president has the job.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Alan Hunter on January 07, 2021, 03:06:34 PM
Your awesome Marcus thank you!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 14, 2021, 10:42:37 AM
I am wondering what if there can be more rentable places throughout Port-a-lucine? I am specifically referring to the rentable warehouses and shops.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 18, 2021, 10:24:13 AM
I am wondering what if there can be more rentable places throughout Port-a-lucine? I am specifically referring to the rentable warehouses and shops.
Lots of people lately want to have bussiness, clubs, and the like in the port with buildings. So can we get more rentables? I think a total of 5 in the savant and marchand would be good, ie an additional two.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 24, 2021, 02:43:15 PM
Could Ste. Mere des Larmes candelabras be on by default during the night?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: emptyanima on January 24, 2021, 03:35:51 PM
Could Ste. Mere des Larmes candelabras be on by default during the night?

I believe lighting issues might be tied to Beamdog at the moment - there was a recent Arelith update commenting on how a lot of areas were darker than intended because lighting hadn't been working. I can't recall if it's been fixed by Beamdog yet or is due to be soon. Your question might be tied to that.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Kiyosa on January 24, 2021, 05:13:57 PM
Walking around Port, I came to realize that the plaza in front of the Governor's Hotel could possible be complemented by some benches. This would provide a much more realistic setting for people to linger/spend their spare time at and would lead to them mingling in a more natural manner, something the terraces don't necessarily or entirely manage. There's something rather awkward about people gathering at a location like the terraces, when it offers little besides high traffic, which in turn becomes glaringly obvious as an OOC convenience rather than an IC one.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on January 24, 2021, 09:33:17 PM
Walking around Port, I came to realize that the plaza in front of the Governor's Hotel could possible be complemented by some benches. This would provide a much more realistic setting for people to linger/spend their spare time at and would lead to them mingling in a more natural manner, something the terraces don't necessarily or entirely manage. There's something rather awkward about people gathering at a location like the terraces, when it offers little besides high traffic, which in turn becomes glaringly obvious as an OOC convenience rather than an IC one.

The Terraces are also overlooking the IC major road through Dementlieu. More NPCs linger throughout that district than anywhere else as we're supposed to be seeing groups of nobles engaging in politics, and dining, deals, etc. If the Savant was where Nobles went to rest and recline, the Publique is where they go to work.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: of clover and thistle on January 24, 2021, 09:49:51 PM
things i think would just be swell,

->black gendarme boots

->paper/quill merchant inside the universitie for characters who want to take real paper notes on lectures etc

->it rains too much. All the time. It's hard to justify being outside all the time or being in an open air restaurant like chez leon when it's raining all the time. Rain is also poopy for fps. Less rain please.

->black gendarme boots

->a notice board for all the notices that clutter the lamp post next to the bank. i don't know man. Some kind of notice-board system so they can get organized.

->more rentals. Maybe a hotel that isn't as fancy as the Governor, but isn't dangerous to get to, like the ones in Marchand and Ouvrier. Maybe in Savant or another one in Publique.

->black gendarme boots.

->Generally speaking, add more lighting fixture options, like candelabras, lanterns, lamp posts, etc to the carpentry menu so we don't need to ask DMs as much to decorate our cribs

->To the same effect, more couches too please.

->B L A CK  G E N D A R M E  B O O T S.

->more bounties. for pcs that are restrained to port only, they end up being the only way for some PCs to make any kind of money. It's hard being a noble and having to pay retainers or parties or w/e but you gotta fight smelly tourists for your pay check.

->IDK maybe some kind of system that pays nobles out with some starting GP and also drops them in Port instead of Barovia?

->Lowbie Port dungeons? Midbie Port Dungeons? We don't need as many as Barovia, but maybe a few to offer selections for people who want a Port-Start but also don't want to get steam rolled the first encounter they run into.

-> BLACK. GENDARME. BOOTS.

 thank you for considering my thoughts.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: JustMonika on January 24, 2021, 09:52:29 PM

->a notice board for all the notices that clutter the lamp post next to the bank. i don't know man. Some kind of notice-board system so they can get organized.

->B L A CK  G E N D A R M E  B O O T S.


 thank you for considering my thoughts.

There is a notice board inside the Theater in which you can just put notices and then open the noticeboard to examine them. Could something like that be replicated on the corner with a minimal of effort?

There was something else I was going to comment on, but I don't think Clover mentioned it enough times.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 24, 2021, 09:54:10 PM
I really want to have street signs and street names throughout the city. So that way you can properly give directions to places.  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: of clover and thistle on January 24, 2021, 10:02:56 PM

->a notice board for all the notices that clutter the lamp post next to the bank. i don't know man. Some kind of notice-board system so they can get organized.

->B L A CK  G E N D A R M E  B O O T S.


 thank you for considering my thoughts.

There is a notice board inside the Theater in which you can just put notices and then open the noticeboard to examine them. Could something like that be replicated on the corner with a minimal of effort?

There was something else I was going to comment on, but I don't think Clover mentioned it enough times.

Give. US. THE. BOOTS.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BahamutZ3RO on January 24, 2021, 10:37:39 PM
The Gendarme outfit in general could probably get fancier since it was designed before some models were inserted into the game.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Khornite on January 24, 2021, 10:42:36 PM
->black gendarme boots

->black gendarme boots

->black gendarme boots.

->B L A CK  G E N D A R M E  B O O T S.

-> BLACK. GENDARME. BOOTS.

 thank you for considering my thoughts.

I sense a plot hook. Of all the would-be fashion people in Port, is it time for the Gendarme to put out a fashion contest? Winner decides the new uniforms?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: PrimetheGrime on January 24, 2021, 10:43:16 PM

->a notice board for all the notices that clutter the lamp post next to the bank. i don't know man. Some kind of notice-board system so they can get organized.

->B L A CK  G E N D A R M E  B O O T S.


 thank you for considering my thoughts.

There is a notice board inside the Theater in which you can just put notices and then open the noticeboard to examine them. Could something like that be replicated on the corner with a minimal of effort?

There was something else I was going to comment on, but I don't think Clover mentioned it enough times.

Give. US. THE. BOOTS.

Whichever government official ok'd feldgrau was either colourblind or didn't know colour theory.  I beg you, gendarmes deserve to be fancy too
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 24, 2021, 10:51:07 PM
The Gendarme outfit in general could probably get fancier since it was designed before some models were inserted into the game.
I would not mind fancier gendarme outfits!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on January 24, 2021, 10:52:01 PM
Well. Someone would have to decide to change up the Gendarme uniforms against Arawn's wishes, he's pretty explicitly stated that he likes the uniforms how they are, with.. All of their flaws or otherwise. They're ICly the most fashionable uniforms, I'm told. OOC, if I hadn't been able to dye my boots black, I would've dipped on Alix within the first year. They honestly have glaring inconsistencies between models, and more than any other faction's attire, the Gendarmes seem to be a subject of discontent. In a nation where fashion is a centerpiece of the roleplay, ensuring the enforcers of the highest office of the land stand up to par with noble retainers in dashing attire might be worth a gander. Someone could sit down with the toolset for ten minutes and fix these, but after offering to do so in the past, I was denied, and it doesn't seem to be a particularly pressing issue to the Team. Lol
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: of clover and thistle on January 24, 2021, 11:05:49 PM
If a faction uniform is ugly enough that people refuse to join the faction because its ugly, (especially when it was never intended to be ugly to begin with!) it becomes a bug, not a feature.

BLACK BOOTS, s'il vous plait.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on January 24, 2021, 11:08:08 PM
If a faction uniform is ugly enough that people refuse to join the faction because its ugly, (especially when it was never intended to be ugly to begin with!) it becomes a bug, not a feature.

BLACK BOOTS, s'il vous plait.

I'd advise you to refrain from that tone when speaking about someone's work. Ultimately you may disagree with the person's choices but to blatantly insult it is rather poor form and ultimately will just make it less likely for your request to happen.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Revenant on January 24, 2021, 11:15:39 PM
Almost every time it gets brought up, the sentiment that the boots make the outfit look worse is aired, with few if any objecting to said sentiment.

I don't think clover's post was intended as an insult, but rather a summation of that often repeated sentiment. This is a good example of how tone is easy to get lost on the internet, however, and of how we should each consider the most delicate way to deliver our views.

Regardless, I do not think that the received tone of the post warrants discarding the suggestion, particularly as it has been received from multiple players. I personally agree that the feldgrau is a strange and garish choice - the color does not reflect real life military greens, and in-engine has a singularly peculiar appearance. It is, in the end, a trivial problem - but it also has a relatively trivial solution.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: of clover and thistle on January 24, 2021, 11:44:44 PM
If a faction uniform is ugly enough that people refuse to join the faction because its ugly, (especially when it was never intended to be ugly to begin with!) it becomes a bug, not a feature.

BLACK BOOTS, s'il vous plait.

I'd advise you to refrain from that tone when speaking about someone's work. Ultimately you may disagree with the person's choices but to blatantly insult it is rather poor form and ultimately will just make it less likely for your request to happen.

I apologize for insult, and realize my tongue-in-cheek tongue was not well communicated.

I do stand by my intended sentiment that the outfit as is has been decidedly out of date with the current standards of player fashion with what the module allows to-date, to the point where it has been ICly and OOCly a deal breaker for joining the faction. I apologize for not delivering that feedback in a kinder and more tactful way, I understand receiving negative feedback on hard artistic work is already difficult without meme framing.

Honest to god, I had thought that because this issue had never been addressed despite this opinion being prevalent, the team had already decided long ago they were not considering it, and that it was a funny haha to even ask about it anymore. Thats on me for not reading the room.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on January 24, 2021, 11:50:11 PM
If a faction uniform is ugly enough that people refuse to join the faction because its ugly, (especially when it was never intended to be ugly to begin with!) it becomes a bug, not a feature.

BLACK BOOTS, s'il vous plait.

I'd advise you to refrain from that tone when speaking about someone's work. Ultimately you may disagree with the person's choices but to blatantly insult it is rather poor form and ultimately will just make it less likely for your request to happen.

I apologize for insult, and realize my tongue-in-cheek tongue was not well communicated.

I do stand by my intended sentiment that the outfit as is has been decidedly out of date with the current standards of player fashion with what the module allows to-date, to the point where it has been ICly and OOCly a deal breaker for joining the faction. I apologize for not delivering that feedback in a kinder and more tactful way, I understand receiving negative feedback on hard artistic work is already difficult without meme framing.

Honest to god, I had thought that because this issue had never been addressed despite this opinion being prevalent, the team had already decided long ago they were not considering it, and that it was a funny haha to even ask about it anymore. Thats on me for not reading the room.

This has been an issue for years, honestly. Nobody likes it, and when it's brought up IC, it's even considered to be an OOC complaint because they're supposed to be fashionable IC. It's very weird.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: slash on January 25, 2021, 12:17:03 AM
If a faction uniform is ugly enough that people refuse to join the faction because its ugly, (especially when it was never intended to be ugly to begin with!) it becomes a bug, not a feature.

BLACK BOOTS, s'il vous plait.

I'd advise you to refrain from that tone when speaking about someone's work. Ultimately you may disagree with the person's choices but to blatantly insult it is rather poor form and ultimately will just make it less likely for your request to happen.

I apologize for insult, and realize my tongue-in-cheek tongue was not well communicated.

I do stand by my intended sentiment that the outfit as is has been decidedly out of date with the current standards of player fashion with what the module allows to-date, to the point where it has been ICly and OOCly a deal breaker for joining the faction. I apologize for not delivering that feedback in a kinder and more tactful way, I understand receiving negative feedback on hard artistic work is already difficult without meme framing.

Honest to god, I had thought that because this issue had never been addressed despite this opinion being prevalent, the team had already decided long ago they were not considering it, and that it was a funny haha to even ask about it anymore. Thats on me for not reading the room.

This is probably the most common complaint I've seen about a faction uniform. From what I can tell, the consensus is that a redesign in order, but (and I recognize I am in the minority in this opinion) I personally prefer the feldgrau boots, myself. The color has history in military uniforms, and black might be a bit too contrasting with the white pantaloons. The rapier being feldgrau is something I like too :)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: PrimetheGrime on January 25, 2021, 01:13:14 AM
If a faction uniform is ugly enough that people refuse to join the faction because its ugly, (especially when it was never intended to be ugly to begin with!) it becomes a bug, not a feature.

BLACK BOOTS, s'il vous plait.

I'd advise you to refrain from that tone when speaking about someone's work. Ultimately you may disagree with the person's choices but to blatantly insult it is rather poor form and ultimately will just make it less likely for your request to happen.

I apologize for insult, and realize my tongue-in-cheek tongue was not well communicated.

I do stand by my intended sentiment that the outfit as is has been decidedly out of date with the current standards of player fashion with what the module allows to-date, to the point where it has been ICly and OOCly a deal breaker for joining the faction. I apologize for not delivering that feedback in a kinder and more tactful way, I understand receiving negative feedback on hard artistic work is already difficult without meme framing.

Honest to god, I had thought that because this issue had never been addressed despite this opinion being prevalent, the team had already decided long ago they were not considering it, and that it was a funny haha to even ask about it anymore. Thats on me for not reading the room.

This is probably the most common complaint I've seen about a faction uniform. From what I can tell, the consensus is that a redesign in order, but (and I recognize I am in the minority in this opinion) I personally prefer the feldgrau boots, myself. The color has history in military uniforms, and black might be a bit too contrasting with the white pantaloons. The rapier being feldgrau is something I like too :)

I would argue a dark grey would do more wonders than any feldgrau green. It may be steeped in Military history, but as we often hear mentioned, dementlieu isn't france verbatim. And the feldgrau when it's on other parts of the armour, not just the boots just looks awful, respectfully, it's time for a change to black or dark grey. With how often a gendarme shines their shoes, it ought to be a black laquer
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Sovereign Citoyen on January 25, 2021, 01:26:57 AM
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JOIN THE QUARTIER WATCH!

The Quartier Watch is a group of responsible, well armed citizens dedicated to improving the safety and well being of all in the Serene République.

Successful Applicants will possess:

Martial Aptitude
Ability to wield a Flintlock and Musket,
Strong Sense of Duty and Morals,
Unwavering desire to not be bent over a table by THE MAN.

Benefits include:

Weekly Wages
Boot color of YOUR choice!
Alix Martineau NOT being your commanding officer!
50% less useless Cheval building exercises!

Join Today!
[/quote]
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: PrimetheGrime on January 25, 2021, 01:32:10 AM
Shameless plug:

Spoiler: show
Quote
Do you want to serve your country and not feel like a CUCKOLD?

JOIN THE QUARTIER WATCH!

The Quartier Watch is a group of responsible, well armed citizens dedicated to improving the safety and well being of all in the Serene République.

Successful Applicants will possess:

Martial Aptitude
Ability to wield a Flintlock and Musket,
Strong Sense of Duty and Morals,
Unwavering desire to not be bent over a table by THE MAN.

Benefits include:

Weekly Wages
Boot color of YOUR choice!
Alix Martineau NOT being your commanding officer!
50% less useless Cheval building exercises!

Join Today!
[/quote]


Well hot damn! Sign me up!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Khornite on January 25, 2021, 07:59:49 AM
If a faction uniform is ugly enough that people refuse to join the faction because its ugly, (especially when it was never intended to be ugly to begin with!) it becomes a bug, not a feature.

BLACK BOOTS, s'il vous plait.

I'd advise you to refrain from that tone when speaking about someone's work. Ultimately you may disagree with the person's choices but to blatantly insult it is rather poor form and ultimately will just make it less likely for your request to happen.

I apologize for insult, and realize my tongue-in-cheek tongue was not well communicated.

I do stand by my intended sentiment that the outfit as is has been decidedly out of date with the current standards of player fashion with what the module allows to-date, to the point where it has been ICly and OOCly a deal breaker for joining the faction. I apologize for not delivering that feedback in a kinder and more tactful way, I understand receiving negative feedback on hard artistic work is already difficult without meme framing.

Honest to god, I had thought that because this issue had never been addressed despite this opinion being prevalent, the team had already decided long ago they were not considering it, and that it was a funny haha to even ask about it anymore. Thats on me for not reading the room.

This has been an issue for years, honestly. Nobody likes it, and when it's brought up IC, it's even considered to be an OOC complaint because they're supposed to be fashionable IC. It's very weird.

Something else to consider is that NWN and graphics cards have updated quite a bit since the original uniforms were created. 10 NWN versions and 3 video card drivers ago, the boots on the Gendarme looked black for me and I've even asked Gendarme players "Hey, were your boots always green". With the current updates to NWN the boots look a sickly pus green. It isn't really criticizing someone's design choice, but a consequence of the game's shaders and graphical updates not meshing with older design decisions. Garda uniforms also looks SUPER polished, especially out in the Village of Barovia.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Marcus Weyland on January 25, 2021, 12:34:36 PM
I think the Gendarmerie uniform looks good for what it's supposed to be. Renaissance France (analogue) fashion does not often resemble contemporary fashion. I think the green boots are a little off-putting, and after noticing them it's very hard to stop noticing them, and solid black boots would probably look better but I'm not a fashion man.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 25, 2021, 01:04:15 PM
->paper/quill merchant inside the universitie for characters who want to take real paper notes on lectures etc
This would be good. While there is the printing presses, that is in the marchand and it is several zones away.

->it rains too much. All the time. It's hard to justify being outside all the time or being in an open air restaurant like chez leon when it's raining all the time. Rain is also poopy for fps. Less rain please.

Gaz III does mention that it rains fairly frequently in the spring and autumn That said I do agree with you, it feels like it rains all the time.

->a notice board for all the notices that clutter the lamp post next to the bank. i don't know man. Some kind of notice-board system so they can get organized.
I agree here. Perhaps something like the Theater's notice board, where you could place notices. or at least place items on the ground.

->more rentals. Maybe a hotel that isn't as fancy as the Governor, but isn't dangerous to get to, like the ones in Marchand and Ouvrier. Maybe in Savant or another one in Publique.

While I have advocated for warehouses and shops, and I still agree here. A smaller hotel/townhouse for the savant I think would be good. This way every quartier has a place to stay.

->Generally speaking, add more lighting fixture options, like candelabras, lanterns, lamp posts, etc to the carpentry menu so we don't need to ask DMs as much to decorate our cribs

->To the same effect, more couches too please.

More crafting options are good.

->more bounties. for pcs that are restrained to port only, they end up being the only way for some PCs to make any kind of money. It's hard being a noble and having to pay retainers or parties or w/e but you gotta fight smelly tourists for your pay check.

->IDK maybe some kind of system that pays nobles out with some starting GP and also drops them in Port instead of Barovia?

You can ask for a port by a DM, and it is possible to get a 'noble job' by the DMs which will give you money by going to the Palais.

->Lowbie Port dungeons? Midbie Port Dungeons? We don't need as many as Barovia, but maybe a few to offer selections for people who want a Port-Start but also don't want to get steam rolled the first encounter they run into.

There is a lowbie dungeon! sort of. The dock office has a basement filled with rats, sometimes dire rats. One can fight them at low levels. But another small lowbie dungeon would be nice. Though Dementlieu is meant for mid to high levels.


I will also once again reiterate my request for signs of all the streets, with actual street names as well.

Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: SardineTheAncestor on January 25, 2021, 02:05:02 PM
I'm not sure I'm keen on seeing more bounties added to Port. They are by far the quickest and most rewarding bounties to complete.

Lots of passive income options exist there, and one stands to gain much more from passive income here than in Barovia. Besides that, very few characters are "restrained" to the city. Even the highest ranking nobles currently are allowed to go and adventure, ninjaloot, and sell rare items at auction markup just like anyone else.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on January 29, 2021, 12:23:57 PM
Two asylum suggestions.

1.) could we get the Asylum of Port-a-Lucine in the game for people to use for alienism and other insanity things, also as a potential place to send certain criminals.

2.) A dungeon inspired by the Shalebridge Cradle from Thief the deadly shadows. The Cradle was an orphanage that later got expanded to be an insane Asylum, while still being an orphange. Then a fire happened and the place got burned, and by the time the mission in Thief happens it is basically a haunted ruin. Which I think sounds delightfully creepy for a dementlieuse dungeon.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: DaloLorn on January 30, 2021, 09:03:25 AM
2.) A dungeon inspired by the Shalebridge Cradle from Thief the dark project. The Cradle was an orphanage that later got expanded to be an insane Asylum, while still being an orphange. Then a fire happened and the place got burned, and by the time the mission in Thief happens it is basically a haunted ruin. Which I think sounds delightfully creepy for a dementlieuse dungeon.

Minor nitpick: The Cradle was actually in Deadly Shadows.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: mooner on February 01, 2021, 01:11:27 PM
Some stray animals, at least in the Ouvrier, for me to abduct would undeniably be a MAJOR QoL addition. I know there are some in Edrigan and I don't mind travelling there, but it would be nice to have some a bit closer to Port.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on February 14, 2021, 03:24:29 PM
Some stray animals, at least in the Ouvrier, for me to abduct would undeniably be a MAJOR QoL addition. I know there are some in Edrigan and I don't mind travelling there, but it would be nice to have some a bit closer to Port.
Related I would like to see some NPCs in the Marchand aside from the dock workers, and I would like to see noble children NPCs in the Savant and Publique; not just poor people have kids :P

Also the thread about crafting mentioned Gargoyles. Gargoyles feel like a fitting monster that could perhaps be found in Dementlieu around the Cathedral.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Khornite on February 14, 2021, 04:47:13 PM
The leather worker is the only crafting location in Port that closes down at night; both smiths, the alchemist, the carpenter and the tailor are all open 24/7. There is a single NPC that stays there during the night but they do not sell the crafting components. Would be be possible to add the leather working components to the night shift worker at the leathering station?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Kiyosa on February 14, 2021, 06:04:13 PM
The Terraces are also overlooking the IC major road through Dementlieu. More NPCs linger throughout that district than anywhere else as we're supposed to be seeing groups of nobles engaging in politics, and dining, deals, etc. If the Savant was where Nobles went to rest and recline, the Publique is where they go to work.
No one would be forced to sit there, if they didn't want to. I just find a plaza rather awkward without any benches.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on February 16, 2021, 07:49:03 PM
While this isn't to come up often, but when their are trials, there seems to be an issue with the witness chairs. Namely to sit in them you have to do @findseat, as you can't click on them. I wonder if it is possible to get them adjusted to make it easier to seat there?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on March 01, 2021, 02:28:52 PM
Two NPC gendarme suggestions:

 :arrow: Can the NPC gendarme moved just a hair or two aware from the terrace edges? Often there are a number of people there and they just bump into PCs as they patrol there. Would be nice to stop needing to commnad the NPCs to go stand by the tree.

 :arrow: as there are female Gendarme PCs, can some of the random NPC gendarmes be female.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: while you were out there on March 02, 2021, 05:47:44 PM
Any chance of getting a few rentals in/near the black market, akin to those in the Drain?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: SardineTheAncestor on March 02, 2021, 05:49:27 PM
Any chance of getting a few rentals in/near the black market, akin to those in the Drain?
I'm posting in support of this and it has nothing to do with me getting my grimetrekker application together.

Dementlieu's underworld could do with the expansion!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BahamutZ3RO on March 02, 2021, 05:52:13 PM
Any chance of getting a few rentals in/near the black market, akin to those in the Drain?

This would be amazing but I'm not sure where they could go, given that the black market is so boxed in. Maybe a complete rework, but that's a big ask (I'd love it though).
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on March 04, 2021, 09:32:56 AM
Having some rentables in the Ouvrie would be good IMO as well. :)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on March 12, 2021, 07:13:41 PM
Can the NPC in Le Croissant Bleu please stop opening doors of the private rooms.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Glass Cannon on March 12, 2021, 07:15:34 PM
Can the NPC in Le Croissant Bleu please stop opening doors of the private rooms.

+1.  This is a nice area, but ruined for plotting because the NPCs constantly open doors.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on March 13, 2021, 12:04:10 PM
Can the NPC in Le Croissant Bleu please stop opening doors of the private rooms.

I'll fix that.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: ChrisRanHimselfOver on March 19, 2021, 11:25:12 PM
I'm not sure if this has been brought up before but considering that Port-a-Lucine gets plenty of low level traffic, it'd be nice if there were delivery quests available between the city and perhaps Edrigan.

It would definitely help those native characters that start their lives in Dementlieu since most opportunities to make money are combat oriented with some job system opportunities that really only give a trickle of coin.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on March 20, 2021, 11:36:18 AM
I'm not sure if this has been brought up before but considering that Port-a-Lucine gets plenty of low level traffic, it'd be nice if there were delivery quests available between the city and perhaps Edrigan.

It would definitely help those native characters that start their lives in Dementlieu since most opportunities to make money are combat oriented with some job system opportunities that really only give a trickle of coin.

It's been on the to-do list for years but so far no one has completed it.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on May 14, 2021, 11:26:13 AM
two suggestions.

 :arrow: Countryside areas so one could get from the University to the vistani without going through the city or under the sewers.

 :arrow: As Port-a-Lucine is well a port on the sea of Sorrows is it possible to get more sea food dishes in the restaurants?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on May 26, 2021, 01:34:52 PM
A number of different suggestions in no particular order, mostly of places to add.

 :arrow: Some more outdoor Cafes

 :arrow: Seafood Restaurants

 :arrow: Restaurants that focus on Mordentish, Borcan, Richemuloise, Lamordian, or Darkonese cuisine, maybe some from Sri Raji and Sourgane?

 :arrow: Aquarium - 5e mentions there is an aquarium

 :arrow: Hospital - this would be a mundane doctor place focusing on well medicine. It could also offer another place to get healed(though not raised), healing supplies and hospital rp

 :arrow: Auberge de la Premere - This is a canon inn not in the city. It offers no food but does offer good Quality rooms. could be similar to either the manor retreat or novaks

 :arrow: street signs with names

 :arrow: more Ouvrie places for commoner rp. Perhaps one that honors past poor people and with the uniforms of the People's National Army on the wall.

 :arrow: For the Rue de Soliel to be like it is described in the Gazetteer going from the cathedral to the Palais

 :arrow: The Navigator's Bliss - an observatory used by the Celestines

 :arrow: The ambassador buildings
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Wilkins1952 on May 26, 2021, 02:20:44 PM
I think all of these are great ideas but if I had to choose three to focus on it would be the observatory, The countryside area for around the city and the Ambassador buildings for the interesting RP they might create.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Dagoth on May 27, 2021, 11:53:54 AM
i wanna talk about bounty hunt there. Why axe caliban in sewers costs 3100  ?  it's easy to kill him, he respawn too fast. wouldn't it be better make 3100 reward for Worker's lodge bounty ? and lower axe caliban reward for 2300 ?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Glass Cannon on May 27, 2021, 12:13:05 PM
i wanna talk about bounty hunt there. Why axe caliban in sewers costs 3100  ?  it's easy to kill him, he respawn too fast. wouldn't it be better make 3100 reward for Worker's lodge bounty ? and lower axe caliban reward for 2300 ?

I kinda agree -- although  the Worker's Lodge has chests and stuff.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on June 05, 2021, 12:19:18 PM
I would like to see more of the university, in particular the Military Science building would be be one that I would like to see.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on June 05, 2021, 12:37:09 PM
i wanna talk about bounty hunt there. Why axe caliban in sewers costs 3100  ?  it's easy to kill him, he respawn too fast. wouldn't it be better make 3100 reward for Worker's lodge bounty ? and lower axe caliban reward for 2300 ?

I kinda agree -- although  the Worker's Lodge has chests and stuff.

Worker's Lodge is longer, but it's better if you can loot the place and sell off the goods at a merchant. With the right perks, and a decent spawn, the Worker's Lodging can provide 20-30k worth of junk loot to the enterprising merchant in addition to the bounty's head. The Caliban is short, sweet, and with paltry loot in his room. The Smuggler's Den out in the Avenue du Progres is also worth a fair chunk of change if you successfully loot all of it.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Avocadorable on June 05, 2021, 06:03:20 PM
It's a small thing, and I'm not sure if any other long term rentals have this issue. Can we please get a bell for the first locked door inside the Sailor? With ingame activity bringing an abundance of activity to the basement area, we get a lot of knocking and foot traffic. It's awkward to emote knocks for people, and since you're not knocking directly on the transition door, using the knock feature doesnt work either. Please and thanks!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: PlatointheCave on June 05, 2021, 06:08:54 PM
i wanna talk about bounty hunt there. Why axe caliban in sewers costs 3100  ?  it's easy to kill him, he respawn too fast. wouldn't it be better make 3100 reward for Worker's lodge bounty ? and lower axe caliban reward for 2300 ?

this man speaks the truth

for too long the french have gotten rich on the blood of fat head

Seriously, the payout for that guy is enormous and killing him is trivially easy.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Vissy on June 05, 2021, 06:30:23 PM
It's probably easy if you are familiar with the game, but without stoneskin killing those guys can be really dangerous.

Personally I'd like more smaller money / exp methods added to Dementlieu for low levels. The low level experience is bad from a QoL and difficulty standpoint all around the server but that doesn't mean it could be improved on (Barovia got such improvements in form of low level dungeons like the burned farmhouse). The deliveries are a godsend currently, more stuff like that would be a big noticeable improvement.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: SardineTheAncestor on June 05, 2021, 09:24:22 PM
I don't disagree with Dementlieu having more options for having low levels, but I'd assume the reason nobody raises the point is because if you put your character in Dementlieu from a low level, you can just sit on passive income while enjoying a purely text roleplay experience and potentially even carries & free gear from high levels who have been around for a very long time. The passive income from levels 2-10 is enough to buy you adamantine gear, even more if your only source of XP is roleplaying.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Phantasia on June 05, 2021, 09:28:57 PM
It's fine the way it is, there's no need to make it more difficult for new characters to integrate into the setting if they have sound tactics at their disposal. There is always the risk you mess up as well, and you probably will be fully looted if you do. Had it happen to me enough times when I tried on past characters, have it happen to me recently and also people I know.

Adding deliveries would be a great send to those that do not want to take those risks, but leave it for those that do.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on June 06, 2021, 07:02:24 PM
Can there be a notice board near the bank as that is where a lot of posters get put up.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Kiyosa on June 15, 2021, 07:40:04 PM
Walking around Port, I came to realize that the plaza in front of the Governor's Hotel could possible be complemented by some benches. This would provide a much more realistic setting for people to linger/spend their spare time at and would lead to them mingling in a more natural manner, something the terraces don't necessarily or entirely manage. There's something rather awkward about people gathering at a location like the terraces, when it offers little besides high traffic, which in turn becomes glaringly obvious as an OOC convenience rather than an IC one.

The Terraces are also overlooking the IC major road through Dementlieu. More NPCs linger throughout that district than anywhere else as we're supposed to be seeing groups of nobles engaging in politics, and dining, deals, etc. If the Savant was where Nobles went to rest and recline, the Publique is where they go to work.
I'm necro'ing this in light of this
(https://i.gyazo.com/f3abc3684f61091f8f93ddd82f03e68c.png)
and several other seating around the terraces. It feels weirder than ever now.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on June 15, 2021, 07:45:09 PM
Walking around Port, I came to realize that the plaza in front of the Governor's Hotel could possible be complemented by some benches. This would provide a much more realistic setting for people to linger/spend their spare time at and would lead to them mingling in a more natural manner, something the terraces don't necessarily or entirely manage. There's something rather awkward about people gathering at a location like the terraces, when it offers little besides high traffic, which in turn becomes glaringly obvious as an OOC convenience rather than an IC one.

The Terraces are also overlooking the IC major road through Dementlieu. More NPCs linger throughout that district than anywhere else as we're supposed to be seeing groups of nobles engaging in politics, and dining, deals, etc. If the Savant was where Nobles went to rest and recline, the Publique is where they go to work.
I'm necro'ing this in light of this
(https://i.gyazo.com/f3abc3684f61091f8f93ddd82f03e68c.png)
and several other seating around the terraces. It feels weirder than ever now.

To be fair that is what a player has made. Though I do agree that making something like permanent would be a good idea.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Kiyosa on June 15, 2021, 07:47:02 PM
To be fair that is what a player has made. Though I do agree that making something like permanent would be a good idea.
That's my point, along with placing those in the plaza, rather than in front of a bank.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on June 21, 2021, 01:37:38 PM
So to rent property you need a class A license that requires a one time fee of 50k to the Gendarmerie. Could the NPC clerk specify that you have to pay that fee to the Gendarmerie players to let them know about the license? or at least let them know that they need to speak with the Gendarmerie about getting a Class A license without mentioning the amount, if the gendarmes want to be corrupt.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: zDark Shadowz on June 21, 2021, 07:05:56 PM
So to rent property you need a class A license that requires a one time fee of 50k to the Gendarmerie. Could the NPC clerk specify that you have to pay that fee to the Gendarmerie players to let them know about the license? or at least let them know that they need to speak with the Gendarmerie about getting a Class A license without mentioning the amount, if the gendarmes want to be corrupt.

Sounds like a fake licence already
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on June 22, 2021, 05:13:31 PM
So to rent property you need a class A license that requires a one time fee of 50k to the Gendarmerie. Could the NPC clerk specify that you have to pay that fee to the Gendarmerie players to let them know about the license? or at least let them know that they need to speak with the Gendarmerie about getting a Class A license without mentioning the amount, if the gendarmes want to be corrupt.

Sounds like a fake licence already

That's only if you're going to operate a trading business out of the property. You don't actually need a Class-A License unless you're selling things there. So clubs and other non-business related faction housing should be fine. The prohibitively expensive taxes are the Nobility's way of keeping cash poor scrub losers on their toes, naturally.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on July 06, 2021, 03:41:01 PM
The practice room in the university mentions only second circle spells and below however, the NPC students are using flame arrow which is third circle spell breaking the rules! should the sign be updated or should their be a different spell being used?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on July 14, 2021, 04:10:00 PM
another legal issue the bullet seller in the marchand sells poison bullets which are illegal. should he not sell them so openly?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Hathor on July 14, 2021, 04:32:07 PM
another legal issue the bullet seller in the marchand sells poison bullets which are illegal. should he not sell them so openly?

I believe this guy is hiding in a back alley, which seems appropriate. It seems disconnected from the setting for there to be no laws being broken in Dloo.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on July 15, 2021, 07:44:31 PM
another legal issue the bullet seller in the marchand sells poison bullets which are illegal. should he not sell them so openly?

I believe this guy is hiding in a back alley, which seems appropriate. It seems disconnected from the setting for there to be no laws being broken in Dloo.

There are canon reasons that guy is left unmolested in what he does, but revealing them would be a spoiler. You can always try to pursue it IC in a Gendarmerie report. I thought it was an oversight as well, until I did some digging into the source lore behind him.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: NacreCicatrix on July 28, 2021, 08:58:45 PM
It would be neat if the rooms in the tenements were changed from the pre-fabricated tile to a blank one with just a bed. Allows for tenants to furnish their room (or supplies RP-work to characters who might offer this service). Always struck me as odd that there was a giant book-case in slum lodgings...
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on August 12, 2021, 05:00:09 PM
Suggestion: Could the Governor's hotel rooms be redesigned a bit. I have noticed that Novak Rental rooms tend to be bigger and with more ability to customize them, while the Hotel seems to be much smaller with the exception of the guest rooms and the Penthouse. Would be nice if the Governor's hotel's rooms were bigger and nicer than other places to reflect it being the publique.

Or if not that could there be another rentable place in either the publique or savant for the upper class to use?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on August 15, 2021, 02:50:54 AM
Suggestion: Could the Governor's hotel rooms be redesigned a bit. I have noticed that Novak Rental rooms tend to be bigger and with more ability to customize them, while the Hotel seems to be much smaller with the exception of the guest rooms and the Penthouse. Would be nice if the Governor's hotel's rooms were bigger and nicer than other places to reflect it being the publique.

Or if not that could there be another rentable place in either the publique or savant for the upper class to use?

I believe the difference between Novak's Rentals, and the Governor's Hotel, is that the Governor's Hotel is a Hotel, and Hotels come furnished. Novak's Rentals is an apartment complex, which is why the rentals there are 30-day rentals like the Tenements, instead of the Governor's Hotel which is week-to-week.

The trouble you'll ultimately run into is that an upper-class person wouldn't have a rental complex. They'd own buildings/home/leases on locations within the Savant that have staterooms inside of them. However, I doubt they want to continue implementing new areas that cannot be shared to promote player housing. Though I could be wrong.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: NacreCicatrix on August 23, 2021, 01:42:50 AM
The Government Food Providers should probably lock at night. They're unmanned after 18:00, so anyone could theoretically walk in and take all the food.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on September 02, 2021, 03:42:01 PM
Question: Low Mordentish is the language of the commoners, and is repersented with Anglo-Saxon but all the commoners including revolutionaries speak in aristocratic High Mordentish which is repersented with french. Could we see the NPCs and signs in the Ouverie use proper Low Mordentish, as in Anglo-saxon? Ie when speaking about Equality should they not be saying efenlicnes instead of égalité? Shouldn't the black market be filled with anglo-Saxon?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Devil's Moon on September 02, 2021, 04:19:07 PM
With the addition of new facilities to represent the Underworld in Dementlieu, I thought I would make some suggestions regarding the in-game representation of the severe poverty and decay of the Quartier Ouvrier.

The Quartier Ouvrier is the notorious skeleton in Port-à-Lucine's closet. It's the one thing that acts as evidence regarding how horrible the living conditions are for the lower classes in the city. There are about half a dozen shacks with a slew of beggars. Crime is rampant at night. There's even a Berlin-esque wall between the Savant and Ouvrier, which further suggests the Ouvrier is just one big ghetto.

One mild issue though is that myself, and I'm pretty sure others, have noticed that it's still a bit easy to forget that it's a cesspool altogether. While it may fall to the players to support the setting and atmosphere, I think it would go a long way if the area of the Quartier Ouvrier and the area beyond the Savant wall could be revised and spruced up a little, for purely decorative and immersion-enhancing purposes.

Stuff like adding a corpse cart or two, maybe bringing the beggars closer to the front where people walk rather than the very back wall. Maybe some filth and downtrodden NPCs taking shelter in the shadow of the Savant Gate. Maybe even an official checkpoint around it to give it the look of a no man's land. Dunno, just some ideas.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on September 02, 2021, 05:10:22 PM
Question: Low Mordentish is the language of the commoners, and is repersented with Anglo-Saxon but all the commoners including revolutionaries speak in aristocratic High Mordentish which is repersented with french. Could we see the NPCs and signs in the Ouverie use proper Low Mordentish, as in Anglo-saxon? Ie when speaking about Equality should they not be saying efenlicnes instead of égalité? Shouldn't the black market be filled with anglo-Saxon?

Because, as per canon, "in Dementlieu, the High dialect is predominantly in common usage. Virtually all of the commoners also speak High Mordentish, particularly if they work in or near any of the areas frequented by nobles. In their homes, however, they are more likely to revert to Low Mordentish." And you don't interact with them in their home with their family usually, and if you would, chances are they'd switch to High Mordentish since they'd be speaking with someone who isn't from their household.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Dardonas on September 05, 2021, 05:16:05 PM
From the system wishlists thread which ended up getting moved to version 3 right after my post - I'll post it here too.

The tanner in Port-a-Lucine leaves the shop at night.  Not even Barovian tanners leave the shop at night.  It makes it hard to do tanning in Port if it isn't daytime.  Also, the tanner in Port-a-Lucine moves around the shop sporadically instead of in one fixed location.  Though this doesn't bug out the merchant's shop closing out, its a pain to find him at times.  In addition to this, he won't speak to you with a weapon out.  Normally crafters leave their curing knives equipped so I have to unequip it first.  I know these are minor nitpicky things, but they add up to make it a nuisance to do leatherworking related activities in Port-a-Lucine.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Fight Club on September 05, 2021, 05:19:37 PM
Is it possible to allow a small space in front of the new Ouvrier rental to have something like a sign that'll persist through resets?  Similar to the Vallaki warehouses/shops that allow for a minor persistent area out in front of the buildings.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on September 05, 2021, 05:40:00 PM
Is it possible to allow a small space in front of the new Ouvrier rental to have something like a sign that'll persist through resets?  Similar to the Vallaki warehouses/shops that allow for a minor persistent area out in front of the buildings.

Sure.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: MAB77 on September 06, 2021, 07:02:11 AM
From the system wishlists thread which ended up getting moved to version 3 right after my post - I'll post it here too. [...]

Just so you know, the fact the v3 thread was opened does not mean your suggestion was ignored. The old thread is still there to be consulted. It is simply the standard process, once a thread reaches 20 pages, to lock it and continue the discussion in a new thread. The forum experiences serious performance issues when threads grow too large and this measure is meant to avoid those.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on September 11, 2021, 01:10:56 PM
Is it possible to allow a small space in front of the new Ouvrier rental to have something like a sign that'll persist through resets?  Similar to the Vallaki warehouses/shops that allow for a minor persistent area out in front of the buildings.

You can now store some placeables in front of the door to the room.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: HM01 on September 12, 2021, 09:36:57 AM
It would be cool to have a business card template available at the Presses Du Savior. Something writable that only takes up 1x1 inventory slot.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BraveSirRobin on September 12, 2021, 02:48:50 PM
It would be cool to have a business card template available at the Presses Du Savior. Something writable that only takes up 1x1 inventory slot.

Business cards are an anachronism, as people don't use wallets or cards, but I'd be down for handbills, pamphlets, or otherwise. Trade cards and visiting cards were used intermittently as well, depending on purpose.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Laur on September 12, 2021, 03:07:09 PM
It would be cool to have a business card template available at the Presses Du Savior. Something writable that only takes up 1x1 inventory slot.

Business cards are an anachronism, as people don't use wallets or cards, but I'd be down for handbills, pamphlets, or otherwise. Trade cards and visiting cards were used intermittently as well, depending on purpose.

As early as the early 1600s the French were using address (une carte d'adresse) and visiting cards, having a template at the presses that could take up a 1x1 inventory slot like that would be very cool!

Some images
Spoiler: show
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/aa/fa/d3/aafad3ce18c4f183ad1683f38b684fd7.jpg)

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a0/VisitingCardJohannVanBeethoven.jpg)
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: HM01 on September 12, 2021, 03:40:57 PM

Business cards are an anachronism, as people don't use wallets or cards, but I'd be down for handbills, pamphlets, or otherwise. Trade cards and visiting cards were used intermittently as well, depending on purpose.

Whatever way you would like to rationalize a small pocket-sized piece of stationary paper is fine.  I believe they would deliver a unique utility that isn't currently provided, I'd also advocate for character limits on them if they were to exist.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Freydaelyn on September 25, 2021, 08:48:26 AM
Should the Vipers be spawning in Dementlieu during the winter months? It seems a bit odd with the snow and they do not spawn in Barovia around the same times. Also the delivery weights seem odd, in particular the cloth rolls. The similar rolls from Krofburg to Vallaki weight about 10.5 pounds where as the Dementlieu varient weighs .5 pounds though that admittedly I am not sure is by design
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on October 18, 2021, 11:38:24 PM
Minor thing but if you click on the statues of: Captaine Jardine, Lord-Govenor Chambon, or Verinne Van Haute, they have text that pops up. Verinne's mentions seeing Madame Keja.

Perhaps they should be made silent in case one does click upon them?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on October 19, 2021, 08:59:20 AM
Minor thing but if you click on the statues of: Captaine Jardine, Lord-Govenor Chambon, or Verinne Van Haute, they have text that pops up. Verinne's mentions seeing Madame Keja.

Perhaps they should be made silent in case one does click upon them?

This is a bug. I'll fix this.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Devil's Moon on October 23, 2021, 12:37:51 AM
With the addition of new facilities to represent the Underworld in Dementlieu, I thought I would make some suggestions regarding the in-game representation of the severe poverty and decay of the Quartier Ouvrier.

The Quartier Ouvrier is the notorious skeleton in Port-à-Lucine's closet. It's the one thing that acts as evidence regarding how horrible the living conditions are for the lower classes in the city. There are about half a dozen shacks with a slew of beggars. Crime is rampant at night. There's even a Berlin-esque wall between the Savant and Ouvrier, which further suggests the Ouvrier is just one big ghetto.

One mild issue though is that myself, and I'm pretty sure others, have noticed that it's still a bit easy to forget that it's a cesspool altogether. While it may fall to the players to support the setting and atmosphere, I think it would go a long way if the area of the Quartier Ouvrier and the area beyond the Savant wall could be revised and spruced up a little, for purely decorative and immersion-enhancing purposes.

Stuff like adding a corpse cart or two, maybe bringing the beggars closer to the front where people walk rather than the very back wall. Maybe some filth and downtrodden NPCs taking shelter in the shadow of the Savant Gate. Maybe even an official checkpoint around it to give it the look of a no man's land. Dunno, just some ideas.

Bump
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: RickDeckard on October 23, 2021, 12:53:51 AM
With the addition of new facilities to represent the Underworld in Dementlieu, I thought I would make some suggestions regarding the in-game representation of the severe poverty and decay of the Quartier Ouvrier.

The Quartier Ouvrier is the notorious skeleton in Port-à-Lucine's closet. It's the one thing that acts as evidence regarding how horrible the living conditions are for the lower classes in the city. There are about half a dozen shacks with a slew of beggars. Crime is rampant at night. There's even a Berlin-esque wall between the Savant and Ouvrier, which further suggests the Ouvrier is just one big ghetto.

One mild issue though is that myself, and I'm pretty sure others, have noticed that it's still a bit easy to forget that it's a cesspool altogether. While it may fall to the players to support the setting and atmosphere, I think it would go a long way if the area of the Quartier Ouvrier and the area beyond the Savant wall could be revised and spruced up a little, for purely decorative and immersion-enhancing purposes.

Stuff like adding a corpse cart or two, maybe bringing the beggars closer to the front where people walk rather than the very back wall. Maybe some filth and downtrodden NPCs taking shelter in the shadow of the Savant Gate. Maybe even an official checkpoint around it to give it the look of a no man's land. Dunno, just some ideas.

Bump

+1
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: PlatointheCave on October 23, 2021, 01:30:49 AM
With the addition of new facilities to represent the Underworld in Dementlieu, I thought I would make some suggestions regarding the in-game representation of the severe poverty and decay of the Quartier Ouvrier.

The Quartier Ouvrier is the notorious skeleton in Port-à-Lucine's closet. It's the one thing that acts as evidence regarding how horrible the living conditions are for the lower classes in the city. There are about half a dozen shacks with a slew of beggars. Crime is rampant at night. There's even a Berlin-esque wall between the Savant and Ouvrier, which further suggests the Ouvrier is just one big ghetto.

One mild issue though is that myself, and I'm pretty sure others, have noticed that it's still a bit easy to forget that it's a cesspool altogether. While it may fall to the players to support the setting and atmosphere, I think it would go a long way if the area of the Quartier Ouvrier and the area beyond the Savant wall could be revised and spruced up a little, for purely decorative and immersion-enhancing purposes.

Stuff like adding a corpse cart or two, maybe bringing the beggars closer to the front where people walk rather than the very back wall. Maybe some filth and downtrodden NPCs taking shelter in the shadow of the Savant Gate. Maybe even an official checkpoint around it to give it the look of a no man's land. Dunno, just some ideas.

Bump

+1

+1
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Ghost Love Score on October 23, 2021, 08:22:16 AM
With the addition of new facilities to represent the Underworld in Dementlieu, I thought I would make some suggestions regarding the in-game representation of the severe poverty and decay of the Quartier Ouvrier.

The Quartier Ouvrier is the notorious skeleton in Port-à-Lucine's closet. It's the one thing that acts as evidence regarding how horrible the living conditions are for the lower classes in the city. There are about half a dozen shacks with a slew of beggars. Crime is rampant at night. There's even a Berlin-esque wall between the Savant and Ouvrier, which further suggests the Ouvrier is just one big ghetto.

One mild issue though is that myself, and I'm pretty sure others, have noticed that it's still a bit easy to forget that it's a cesspool altogether. While it may fall to the players to support the setting and atmosphere, I think it would go a long way if the area of the Quartier Ouvrier and the area beyond the Savant wall could be revised and spruced up a little, for purely decorative and immersion-enhancing purposes.

Stuff like adding a corpse cart or two, maybe bringing the beggars closer to the front where people walk rather than the very back wall. Maybe some filth and downtrodden NPCs taking shelter in the shadow of the Savant Gate. Maybe even an official checkpoint around it to give it the look of a no man's land. Dunno, just some ideas.

Bump

I would even love to see rentable shops be added to the Ouvrier (I don't think there are any as far as I know?). They could be affordable but really shitty; I think it could add a lot of roleplay opportunities and attract some more players to the area. Players could set up a soup-kitchen; a makeshift doctor's office; or a pawnstore -- just to name a few examples. Personally I have a few ideas in mind I'd love to do if I could get my hands on a run down rentable. Along with all the struggles that comes with trying to run a business/establishment in the Ouvrier.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: JustMonika on October 23, 2021, 11:55:55 AM
With the addition of new facilities to represent the Underworld in Dementlieu, I thought I would make some suggestions regarding the in-game representation of the severe poverty and decay of the Quartier Ouvrier.

The Quartier Ouvrier is the notorious skeleton in Port-à-Lucine's closet. It's the one thing that acts as evidence regarding how horrible the living conditions are for the lower classes in the city. There are about half a dozen shacks with a slew of beggars. Crime is rampant at night. There's even a Berlin-esque wall between the Savant and Ouvrier, which further suggests the Ouvrier is just one big ghetto.

One mild issue though is that myself, and I'm pretty sure others, have noticed that it's still a bit easy to forget that it's a cesspool altogether. While it may fall to the players to support the setting and atmosphere, I think it would go a long way if the area of the Quartier Ouvrier and the area beyond the Savant wall could be revised and spruced up a little, for purely decorative and immersion-enhancing purposes.

Stuff like adding a corpse cart or two, maybe bringing the beggars closer to the front where people walk rather than the very back wall. Maybe some filth and downtrodden NPCs taking shelter in the shadow of the Savant Gate. Maybe even an official checkpoint around it to give it the look of a no man's land. Dunno, just some ideas.

Bump

I would even love to see rentables be added to the Ouvrier (I don't think there are any as far as I know?). They could be affordable but really shitty; I think it could add a lot of roleplay opportunities and attract some more players to the area. Players could set up a soup-kitchen; a makeshift doctor's office; or a pawnstore -- just to name a few examples. Personally I have a few ideas in mind I'd love to do if I could get my hands on a run down rentable. Along with all the struggles that comes with trying to run a business/establishment in the Ouvrier.

There are rentable rooms, but not rentable shops.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: mooner on October 23, 2021, 12:11:22 PM
would making the ouvrier even more grim not be a little too much on the nose? it's already worse than vallaki's slums, and especially when you have the savant right next to it for comparison. a checkpoint wouldn't be bad but corpse carts would give off pathologic vibes, rather than being an indicator of squalor imo
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Ghost Love Score on October 23, 2021, 12:57:10 PM
would making the ouvrier even more grim not be a little too much on the nose? it's already worse than vallaki's slums, and especially when you have the savant right next to it for comparison. a checkpoint wouldn't be bad but corpse carts would give off pathologic vibes, rather than being an indicator of squalor imo
Yeah corpse carts seem a bit over the top. It is still a fairly modern city in comparison to a lot of other settings within the core. For me, my main gripe with the Ouvrier is that it feels kinda empty and gray, but I could also see how that would be intentional. I'd like to see some more details be added, and it doesn't have to look "pretty" per say, just more... lived in I guess? But rentable stalls/stores is the first thing that comes to mind for me. As well as some general detailing to make the Ouvrier feel more lively, humane, claustrophobic, whatever the case.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: of clover and thistle on October 23, 2021, 01:37:35 PM
would making the ouvrier even more grim not be a little too much on the nose? it's already worse than vallaki's slums, and especially when you have the savant right next to it for comparison. a checkpoint wouldn't be bad but corpse carts would give off pathologic vibes, rather than being an indicator of squalor imo

You invoke pathologic as though it were a bad thing.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: mooner on October 23, 2021, 01:48:11 PM
a bad thing in the sense that i don't think it would suit the atmosphere. the aim is to show that it's a destitute part of the city, not they're suffering a lethal epidemic
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: SardineTheAncestor on October 23, 2021, 02:03:23 PM
I think it being on the nose is the point, what with the Berlin-esque wall Haeresis mentioned. I'm pretty sure the vibe is that poor people don't exist in Dementlieu except to be exploited. A few PCs doing fundraisers periodically, whether we're talking thousands or millions of gold, tends not to change anything there, so just imagine how deeply rooted the problem is.

It would actually make more sense for beggars to be where they can be seen though, and disease always runs rampant in urban environments. Modern medicine hasn't hit Dementlieu, the hospice workers can only perform so many miracles a day. I don't think the corpse carts would be that absurd, we're talking peasants with awful diets who work 12 hours a day, have little time or money for luxury and comfort, many of whom are homeless, children in an unregulated workforce without parents or guardians beyond violent gang members. It's pretty bad. Vallaki doesn't oppress and ignore its working poor to the same extent Dementlieu does, they just exist as a consequence of their environment.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: mooner on October 23, 2021, 02:19:17 PM
that wasn't quite the impression I got, there's one gate there that even still could probably be attributed to the location of the gendarmerie HQ. there are no such dividers between the ouvrier and the docks and respectively no divider between the publique and the docks. i am not sure you can bring in the donation argument considering the player economy is obviously not designed to represent the wages or conditions of actual commoners

if it is supposed to be very on the nose and so exaggeratedly obvious then it probably wouldn't be a bad addition. however, if it goes to the point where the conditions in the ouvrier are so bad that corpses are frequently being carted out? i think that surely removes any remaining nuance for characters such as good aligned nobles or lawful commoners - i can't really think of any reasons why anybody would try to defend that even just from a pragmatic viewpoint
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: SardineTheAncestor on October 23, 2021, 02:39:36 PM
I bring in the donation argument for the same two reasons you bring in the alignment argument: suspension of disbelief and setting sensibility. Good aligned nobles justifying the Ouvrier's conditions are not of good alignment. And the fact of the matter is that no matter how much money was poured into a project like saving the Ouvrier, it would take years to see returns anyway due to corruption and the actual problem of getting people to clean it up and then rebuild it in a more people-friendly manner. The setting sensibly supports such stagnancy, it's a complete loop.

The reason we don't see a divider between the Ouvrier and the Marchand (and the Publique) is probably because it's supposed to be a bit more of a gradual depression as you go deeper. Despite this, you can get transition ganked by Caliban brutes and gang leaders when walking between the two districts or even just exiting buildings. The docks aren't supposed to be perfect either and certainly not safe at night, but mostly the layout and scale issues that prevent the city from being 100% lore accurate are mostly due to expedience. Like how those hostile NPCs that will immediately spot you entering the docks cannot follow you into the Publique unless the script bugs. It's been built in a super-compressed manner and no dev has risked their sanity to expand it.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on October 23, 2021, 03:37:14 PM
would making the ouvrier even more grim not be a little too much on the nose? it's already worse than vallaki's slums, and especially when you have the savant right next to it for comparison. a checkpoint wouldn't be bad but corpse carts would give off pathologic vibes, rather than being an indicator of squalor imo
Yeah corpse carts seem a bit over the top. It is still a fairly modern city in comparison to a lot of other settings within the core. For me, my main gripe with the Ouvrier is that it feels kinda empty and gray, but I could also see how that would be intentional. I'd like to see some more details be added, and it doesn't have to look "pretty" per say, just more... lived in I guess? But rentable stalls/stores is the first thing that comes to mind for me. As well as some general detailing to make the Ouvrier feel more lively, humane, claustrophobic, whatever the case.



Plague carts shouldn't be common unless we are running a plot about a plague IMO.

Quote from: Gazeteer III
To the Northeast lie the Quartier Marchand(Merchant's Quarter), which houses many places of Business, and the salacious Port district which is most certainly unsafe for women. By day, the docks are an extraordinary busy area, bustling with carts attempting to transport goods through the narrow streets of the city. At night, the area becomes almost deserted, except for ruffians and the occasional drunken sailor. The road that runs alongside the bay is known as the Widow's walk - some say this is because of the number of murders that occur late at night in this area, but others claim that the name is for the frequency of suicides from people jumping into the bay. Just to the south of this area, large buildings house the workshops where much of the poor population earns its meager keep.

To the southeast, the squalid Quartier Ouvrier (Worker's Quarter) is a mess of ramshackle, multistory wooden buildings packed with multudes of the poor. The magnanimous Dementlieuse belief that they provide for their poor would be sorely tested if any of the wealthy ever had to visit or live in this area. Buildings are constructed at the absolute minimum cost and maximum capacity, and they occasionally collapse. Infrequent government food providers and small hospices of Hala are scattered throughout the quarter. In contrast, the opulent aristocratic residences in the southwest cover three times as much area as the tenements, yet houses only a third of the population.[

The Quartier Savant(Noble Quarter) contains elegant three to four story terraces, all perfectly maintained, with parks filled with floral gardens providing the accessional respite from the narrow streets. In the wealthiest areas, alongside the Government Quartier, large houses crowd for space next to each other. Numerous expensive shops operate in this district, catering for all tastes of fashion, food, and jewelry.

The most impressive area of the city is the Quartier Publique (Or Government Quarter), which surrounds the wide Rue du Soleil, leading from Ste. Mere des Larmes down to the Place de Leon, in front of the Ruling Palace by the bay. When one considers the small population of this city, the sheer enormity and number of elaborate buildings of the arts and government are quite a mystery.


For flavor, while this is about Paris it is from Regime Dioblique(aka three Musketeers + gothic horror, ie perfect insperation for Dementlieu IMO)and I do think that this description can apply rather well to Port-a-Lucine. It also helps with the fact that Dementlieu is a Baroque / Roccoco city not a modern city(though much more so than many others). This comes from the Paris Gothique book, the book for flavor for Paris from that RPG game

Spoiler: show

Quote from: Mud and Status
As it is impossible to walk into the streets of Paris without getting some of la boue de Paris soiling your clothes, it is an easy way to mark one as not being noble, as most nobles can afford carriages to protect them from the mud (as well as the side benefit of flinging mud on their lessers from the spokes of their carriage wheels). this is why many bourgeois make a private carriage one of their first purchases.

Still, even traveling by carriage is not a guarantee that you won’t get soiled, so another sign of nobility is to bring a second set of clothes and shoes with you to change into once you’ve arrived at your destination. this separates the pretenders (who may have simply hired a carriage) from those with true status and wealth. it can be a great source of shame for a wealthy man if he is robbed on the way to his destination and the robbers run away with his party clothes, as traveling clothes, even if clean, are hardly suitable for a social gathering.

Quote from: Parisian Streets
Parisian streets are treacherous. most are unpaved and the dirt is mixed with excrement and other human and animal waste, which gets even worse in the rain. it’s nearly impossible to walk through Paris for any length of time without getting one’s clothes soiled from la boue de Paris, especially if a carriage passes by too quickly. in addition, pedestrians have to watch out for falling flower pots, as many are precariously balanced on window ledges. Worse still is the waste often flung out of windows onto the streets below. an oblivious pedestrian could easily get showered in urine and excrement.

Parisian streets are busy. most business is conducted on the street. open street markets are the norm, where vendors set up temporary booths to hawk their wares. Prostitutes openly proposition clients. City criers also walk the streets announcing products and other information while the printing presses generate pamphlets, most residents are still illiterate. showmen entertain passersby with their antics, and a good showman could effectively block an entire street as a crowd forms to watch.

Quote from: Parsian Water
Waterkeeping a home supplied with water is a difficult undertaking in Paris. most of Paris still doesn’t have plumbing. only the palaces, schools, monasteries, and wealthy hôtels had access to private aqueducts. some homes had private wells but these were often so badly contaminated that they were hardly used. most residents make do by either getting water from the seine, purchasing it from water sellers, or going to the nearest public fountain. Public fountains are scattered throughout the city although they don’t resemble the beautiful flowing fountains of private gardens, as Paris’ poor water pressure won’t allow it. most fountains are simply monuments with taps set around it that trickle water when the handle is turned. many fountains have places to stand above them, making a fountain a good place for a character to go if he wants to survey the immediate area or meet someone.

Quote from: Buildings
Unless you are attempting to find an easily recognizable building like the louvre or the notre dame cathedral, finding a particular house is no easy task. With the recent exception of the houses along the Pont notre dame, none of the houses in Paris have street numbers. a place of business, such as an inn, might have a sign hanging outside, but most homes are identified by street, façade description, or relation to a landmark. most Parisians are in the habit of asking those nearby where a particular house is located.

The center of activity in any house, rich or poor, is the room with the fireplace. during the colder months, bourgeoisie families gathered in the kitchen to eat and socialize, while nobles could afford multiple chimneys to heat various parts of the house. shopkeepers often used the front room of their residences to conduct business. such rooms are unheated and on cold days the shopkeepers continually duck back into the room with the fireplace.Wax candles are expensive in the 17th century. only wealthy bourgeoisie and nobles use them and then only sparingly. most candles are made of suet, or animal fat, which gives off an unpleasant smell. Candles and lanterns are not generally lit outside at night unless the occupant is expecting a visitor.





If it was up to me I would revise the city to be bigger, and so that certain canon things could be like they are meant to(ie the Rue de Soliel is supposed to go straight from the Cathedral to the Palais). Below are some maps, a 2nd edition map, a 5th edition map, as well as the fraternity fof shadows map(their PDF image is in much greater detail). Also its worth noting that in Van Richten's guide to the walking dead their is a fifth Quartier, Quartier Tenements mentioned.


2nd edition map

Spoiler: show

(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/839597362195988532/846088831135383582/unknown.png)


5th edition map
Spoiler: show

(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/839597362195988532/855124184510627930/map-3.4-dementlieu.jpg)


Fraternity of Shadows fan map
Spoiler: show

(http://www.fraternityofshadows.com/Mausoleum/Port-a-Lucine.jpg)



So with all this said. What are the things if I had the power to redesign Port-a-Lucine would I do. So the most obvious thing would be making the whole city much bigger in terms of the map size complete with more alleys, side streets, all the cafes, inns, and so on from canon like the Abuerge de la Premiere, and some of the netbook cafes and places, such as the The Navigator's Bliss(used by the Celestines). I would bring in some things from 5th edition, namely the aquarium and the hospital. I would also probably include some more sea food shops(port-a-lucine is a port town after all) and resturants from other parts of the world(sri raji, Souragne, Mordent, Borca, Richemulot, Lamordia, etc)

The biggest thing probably would be remaking the whole map to contain a bunch of winding streets and side streets off the main boluvards and avenues, their quality reflecting what sort of side of Dementlieu that you are in. There would be fountains and squares for people, the quality of which can vary. With very fancy baroque fountains in the Publique and Savant and crappy ones in the Savant. There also would be various street signs to try and help people get around but it still should be a tad confusing to navigate unless you are rather familiar with the area(see 2nd edition map).

The idea for all the side streets would be so that criminals could use that and make getaways and then escape through them and perhaps change into a disguise or cancel it, along with potential MPCs using it to stalk people and have hidden areas for rp. The squares/fountains serving as exterior hubs for RP. The Savant and Publique would even have chairs and benches for the nobles to sit and relax in.

For the Ouverie specifically, I would add snake oil salesmen and other con-men there who are selling strange miracle elixers. I would add more dirt, perhaps animals. The streets would also be more made of dirt than and less well kept. There still would be water fountains in the Ouvier as people need to drink but they should be poor and poorly maintained.

Of the Quartiers, the one to spruce up and would be part of such changes would be the Marchand which far from the throngs of people bustling about with carts and goods, going about their day it is often empty. So at the Marchand Squares you would see far more merchants hawking their wares out in the public. I would likely move the Grand Bazaar to the center of the Marchand and let it be the center piece, let it be easier to get to and more where shops build up.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Dardonas on October 28, 2021, 09:19:41 PM
Could we perhaps move the Vistani Caravan in Port-a-Lucine to the crossroads on the eastern gate between Port and the University?  This will make it so that outcasts who go to Port to enchant aren't disruptive to running through the Publique while invisible or otherwise.  Also, it would make more sense if people arriving to Port saw the poorer parts of the city first to highlight the disparity in the setting.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on October 28, 2021, 09:21:12 PM
Could we perhaps move the Vistani Caravan in Port-a-Lucine to the crossroads on the eastern gate between Port and the University?  This will make it so that outcasts who go to Port to enchant aren't disruptive to running through the Publique while invisible or otherwise.  Also, it would make more sense if people arriving to Port saw the poorer parts of the city first to highlight the disparity in the setting.

It used to be there but it was problematic because of the night spawns. Moving it west made it much easier for roleplay.

There's a safe route through the sewers that gets outcasts on the other side of Port-à-Lucine.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on November 26, 2021, 05:46:21 PM
Could OCR in Dementlieu be changed so that Sorcerer and similar OCR is a flat OCR and doesn't rise up for casting, and without the NPCs commenting on things, so that way the NPCs can't metagame that a character is a Sorcerer. They have the OCR from being a Sorcerer without it being so explicit, and it allows for more wiggle room here.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: PlatointheCave on November 26, 2021, 10:43:00 PM
Could OCR in Dementlieu be changed so that Sorcerer and similar OCR is a flat OCR and doesn't rise up for casting, and without the NPCs commenting on things, so that way the NPCs can't metagame that a character is a Sorcerer. They have the OCR from being a Sorcerer without it being so explicit, and it allows for more wiggle room here.

+1

It's most absurd when the wait staff in Club l'Artiste shout at a sorceror doing stage magic.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: PrimetheGrime on November 26, 2021, 10:43:39 PM
Could OCR in Dementlieu be changed so that Sorcerer and similar OCR is a flat OCR and doesn't rise up for casting, and without the NPCs commenting on things, so that way the NPCs can't metagame that a character is a Sorcerer. They have the OCR from being a Sorcerer without it being so explicit, and it allows for more wiggle room here.

That sounds great
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Devil's Moon on November 26, 2021, 10:43:45 PM
+1

And my axe.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: foxtale on November 26, 2021, 10:44:33 PM
I like that idea!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Dardonas on November 26, 2021, 10:45:23 PM
Considering Beguilers and Warmages do not use spellbooks to my understanding, the point that sorcerers are identified via that doesn't make much sense.  I'm in support of removing the OCR message and the suggestion.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: JustMonika on November 27, 2021, 07:58:10 AM
Considering Beguilers and Warmages do not use spellbooks to my understanding, the point that sorcerers are identified via that doesn't make much sense.  I'm in support of removing the OCR message and the suggestion.

Are not Beguilers on the 'Do Not Like' list for port too?

Warmages are okay, because they're taught at the University.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: ASymphony on November 27, 2021, 08:36:14 AM
I believe I have seen beguilers casting spells within Port-a-Lucine without triggering an OCR reaction, though I may be mistaken.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on November 27, 2021, 10:00:47 AM
Could OCR in Dementlieu be changed so that Sorcerer and similar OCR is a flat OCR and doesn't rise up for casting, and without the NPCs commenting on things, so that way the NPCs can't metagame that a character is a Sorcerer. They have the OCR from being a Sorcerer without it being so explicit, and it allows for more wiggle room here.

We could give them auto-hostile OCR but I'm not sure that'd really make things better? And a flat OCR will let them cast freely without consequences, whereas they're meant to be forced to hide their talents.

I'm very open to better text for reactions but the reaction to sorcerer spellcasting won't go away.

Beguilers are intelligence-based casters, and warmages are university-trained (though most of their spells will likely trigger OCR since they're damage spells anyway).
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Lexica on November 27, 2021, 10:56:40 AM
Could OCR in Dementlieu be changed so that Sorcerer and similar OCR is a flat OCR and doesn't rise up for casting, and without the NPCs commenting on things, so that way the NPCs can't metagame that a character is a Sorcerer. They have the OCR from being a Sorcerer without it being so explicit, and it allows for more wiggle room here.

We could give them auto-hostile OCR but I'm not sure that'd really make things better? And a flat OCR will let them cast freely without consequences, whereas they're meant to be forced to hide their talents.

I'm very open to better text for reactions but the reaction to sorcerer spellcasting won't go away.

Beguilers are intelligence-based casters, and warmages are university-trained (though most of their spells will likely trigger OCR since they're damage spells anyway).
Perhaps a good compromise might be that casting in front of NPCs no longer triggers any text response from them, but /does/ still raise OCR and gives the sorcerer some yellow text letting them know their OCR increased. This would let Sorcerers have some wiggle room to RP and participate more in the setting by using magic in a sparing and limited way (say for magic shows), while not having NPCs somehow instantly know their class. Instead, it feeds more into the idea that a Sorcerer, while visually not immediately distinguishable, does have an aura of sorts that sets them apart.

Under this system, a caster that wasn’t very sparing and careful with their casts, especially if they mean to do something like magic shows, would quickly end up with hostile OCR that triggers text reactions on its own. I think it would be a good compromise.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: herkles on November 27, 2021, 12:33:33 PM
Could OCR in Dementlieu be changed so that Sorcerer and similar OCR is a flat OCR and doesn't rise up for casting, and without the NPCs commenting on things, so that way the NPCs can't metagame that a character is a Sorcerer. They have the OCR from being a Sorcerer without it being so explicit, and it allows for more wiggle room here.

We could give them auto-hostile OCR but I'm not sure that'd really make things better? And a flat OCR will let them cast freely without consequences, whereas they're meant to be forced to hide their talents.

I'm very open to better text for reactions but the reaction to sorcerer spellcasting won't go away.

Beguilers are intelligence-based casters, and warmages are university-trained (though most of their spells will likely trigger OCR since they're damage spells anyway).

Could EVERY character be given the ability to know that a caster is a sorcerer or not just like a random person in the port can; ie if you are a sorcerer then everyone will know. or are the NPCs the only ones who able to metagame this. since it feels weird that level 20 Wizards with 80 spellcraft can't tell that Person X is a sorcerer but a random flower girl or nobleman in the publique is able to?

It feels weird that they can know but if you are playing as a native to enforce this when you can't know unless you metagame. If you want to be true to the setting you either have to metagame or wait for the NPCs to shout at them but you can't detect yourself. Not to mention that Wizards don't cast by having their spellbook equiped either. Yes they read from it when they prepare but they aren't needing one equiped to cast magic. Or should wizards need to have a spellbook out at all times to cast their spells?

Not to mention the various stage magicians that are out on the street are not reading from a spellbook and going "look at the amazing alchemical polaris reversing magic that I read from this highly arcane book that I am doing" but are saying they got real powers. Should those guys be removed or replaced with book nerds who speak in magical technical jargon?

The NPCs don't shout at Characters who are in armor, yet we have incentivized people not doing that. or could the NPCs shout at them as well.

However, I think the easier option instead of coding that would be to just make it a flat OCR and if the PCs find out that they are a sorcerer by talking about their bloodline or stuff to ostracize them like with armor wearers or drow or caliban?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: ViktorYouFool on November 27, 2021, 03:05:13 PM
Could OCR in Dementlieu be changed so that Sorcerer and similar OCR is a flat OCR and doesn't rise up for casting, and without the NPCs commenting on things, so that way the NPCs can't metagame that a character is a Sorcerer. They have the OCR from being a Sorcerer without it being so explicit, and it allows for more wiggle room here.

We could give them auto-hostile OCR but I'm not sure that'd really make things better? And a flat OCR will let them cast freely without consequences, whereas they're meant to be forced to hide their talents.

I'm very open to better text for reactions but the reaction to sorcerer spellcasting won't go away.

Beguilers are intelligence-based casters, and warmages are university-trained (though most of their spells will likely trigger OCR since they're damage spells anyway).

Could EVERY character be given the ability to know that a caster is a sorcerer or not just like a random person in the port can; ie if you are a sorcerer then everyone will know. or are the NPCs the only ones who able to metagame this. since it feels weird that level 20 Wizards with 80 spellcraft can't tell that Person X is a sorcerer but a random flower girl or nobleman in the publique is able to?

It feels weird that they can know but if you are playing as a native to enforce this when you can't know unless you metagame. If you want to be true to the setting you either have to metagame or wait for the NPCs to shout at them but you can't detect yourself. Not to mention that Wizards don't cast by having their spellbook equiped either. Yes they read from it when they prepare but they aren't needing one equiped to cast magic. Or should wizards need to have a spellbook out at all times to cast their spells?

This has been my argument from the beginning. My main problem with the Port sorc hate-on is that it's both inconsistent and icky and meta-gamey. Everything else in the game is some form of WYSIWYG, and acting on OOC knowledge you couldn't have IC from the information presented to you by role-play or the system itself is cheesing and rule breaking.

Unless you're Jeanne, the random flower girl who comes from a society that only half-believes in the supernatural, but nonetheless has such precise and superior powers of arcane insight that she can tell the difference between a sorcerer, hex blade, bard beguiler, wizard, war mage, instantly on the spot from a single spell cast.

If you're going to argue that sorcerers have some kind of aura when they cast that makes it immediately obvious to every NPC in the area regardless of their background or education level, then that needs to be somehow represented in the game. Full stop. There's no reason that the guy hocking merch at the front gate should have greater arcane discernment than is possible from any PC regardless of background or experience. You need some kind of examine option or some kind of combat log notice. Something that lets PCs tell as well. Or you're going to need to give some very, very strong reason why only the NPCs of Port-a-lucine have such astounding arcane attunement.

But since I have my doubts anyone is actually going to script such a thing, I'm going to offer a more obvious solution: Why not make the average NPC in Port freak out about all spell casters? Really? Timmy the street sweep is going to understand instinctively the difference between a bard and a sorcerer? really?

And for that matter, why are bards and hex blades not given the exact same treatment? All three are charisma-based arcane spell casters without spell prep whose very blood is justification for an RDD path. You're going to tell me that only sorcerer spells give people the unique willies when hex blades are alignment locked out of being Team Good Guy and get their primary power set by cursing people?
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: JustMonika on November 27, 2021, 03:13:15 PM
I am pretty sure Hexblade casting triggers the same thing.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: BlankStare on November 27, 2021, 03:16:22 PM
Perhaps some sort of disguise, influence, or even sleight of hand check could be incorporated into this script? Maybe opposing the NPCs spot? It would make sense to me that a sorcerer ought to be able to masquerade as another type of spellcaster. Particularly if they invest in such skills.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: ViktorYouFool on November 27, 2021, 03:19:31 PM
I am pretty sure Hexblade casting triggers the same thing.

If so, cool. Then that leaves bard to be explained.

And returns us to the three propositions:
1. You make all arcane casting spooky to NPCs.
2. You make Cha-arcane casting put out some kind of combat log message letting the PCs also know it's spooky and different than int casting.
3. Someone gets to come up with some military grade bovine manure to explain to me precisely why the NPCs of port are uniquely gifted in arcane perception in a way that even dementlieuse PCs are incapable of learning. I will not accept "it's not cheating when the NPCs do it" as an answer. 
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on November 27, 2021, 03:24:25 PM
Quote
3. Someone gets to come up with some military grade bovine manure to explain to me precisely why the NPCs of port are uniquely gifted in arcane perception in a way that even dementlieuse PCs are incapable of learning. I will not accept "it's not cheating when the NPCs do it" as an answer.

Sorcerers always stand out; their innate magic generated by their extreme force of will is noticeable. That's not just from Ravenloft, that's part of the class description. They stand out, they're noticeable, flashy. I know most people tend to play them like spontaneous casting wizards, but they're not, they're very different.

We could also have a system where the longer the sorcerer spends in an area, the more uncomfortable NPCs are, and it raises their OCR, but that'd remove even more player agency. Instead we have an imperfect system that serves the intended purpose, which is forcing sorcerers to hide their talents. Here's the complete description from Complete Arcane:

Quote
Like bards, sorcerers tend to attract attention, but (unlike bards) rarely of the positive kind. Where a wizard might hobble into town and seem little more than a weatherbeaten traveler, revealing his true nature only at his own discretion, a sorcerer tends not to remain anonymous for long, because his personal intensity and charisma draw the eye and linger in the memory. An indefinable but tangible difference often separates the sorcerer from the rest of the world - and when difference is sown, suspicion often grows.

Where a high noble might look to her court wizard for advice and scholarly insight into the doings of her rivals, sorcerers generally have little in the way of a wizard's formal education and training. Though most sorcerers rarely feel the need to find themselves a patron or to place themselves at a lord's disposal, those who do often find themselves regarded as more of an arcane weapon than a fount of knowledge, less suited to roles as counselor and tutor than as an elite bodyguard or highly valued special agent.

In the end, whether they are evil or good, most sorcerers simply choose to exist outside the normal circles of human society. Like elemental forces of nature, the most powerful sorcerers will never be directed, either by the concerns of the common folk or the commands of a king.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Dardonas on November 27, 2021, 03:31:17 PM
We could also have a system where the longer the sorcerer spends in an area, the more uncomfortable NPCs are, and it raises their OCR, but that'd remove even more player agency. Instead we have an imperfect system that serves the intended purpose, which is forcing sorcerers to hide their talents.

Could we perhaps get a message in the combat log stating whether a Hexblade or a Sorcerer is casting a spell?  I think the big disconnect is that PCs are left out of the way that NPCs detect a sorcerer's spellcasting.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on November 27, 2021, 03:35:35 PM
Quote
Could we perhaps get a message in the combat log stating whether a Hexblade or a Sorcerer is casting a spell?  I think the big disconnect is that PCs are left out of the way that NPCs detect a sorcerer's spellcasting.

The Examine tool works for that since, if your Wisdom is high enough, it reveals traits about the person, such as their personal magnetism vs intelligence. The dimwitted flamboyant caster is most likely a sorcerer.

Technically players should know when a bard casts since "every bard spell has a verbal component (singing, reciting, or music)", unlike other arcane classes.

Spoiler: show
Quote
Spells
A bard casts arcane spells, which are drawn from the bard spell list. He can cast any spell he knows without preparing it ahead of time. Every bard spell has a verbal component (singing, reciting, or music). To learn or cast a spell, a bard must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a bard’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the bard’s Charisma modifier.

Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: ViktorYouFool on November 27, 2021, 03:43:26 PM
I find that description difficult to apply in a handful of ways. Not least because:

1. There are a lot of high charisma folks walking around. My paladin has more charisma than many starting sorcerers. So force of personality is not itself the metric. And port is a place where most characters are trying to stand out and be flashy.

That sounds like a description of IC actions. Not mechanics. If it is a thing specific to mechanics, then it would make way more sense to be based off of straight charisma score than have anything to do with casting at all, unless we're going to claim that an 18 cha sorcerer and an 18 cha paladin and an 18 cha favored soul and an 18 cha bard and an 18 cha hex blade and an 18 cha blackguard all have the same flashy force of personality, but sorcerer is the one uniquely giving off vibes for Reasons™.

2. That doesn't fix the underlying issue of it being something that only applies to NPCs, which is what makes it feel like metagame nonsense. If we're going to say that sorcerers give off Vibes®™ when they cast, and we are dead set on that being some unique silliness to that class, then that information has to be available to PCs or someone has to come up with a reason that the NPCs of port are uniquely capable of perceiving information that I, as a player, IC or OOC, cannot. Unless someone has an old ravenloft article somewhere that's like "yeah, no, those cats in Portalucine are like carrier pigeons. They have a bit of Arcanium in their skulls that tingle in the presence of sorcerers. True facts, my dude," there is no way to "it's the setting" around that fact and it's my main issue with the entire thing.

If I knew OOC that someone was a sorcerer without knowing it IC, and I acted on that, that's metagaming. If I claimed I could tell from a single spell they cast, that's cheesing, because there is no way to do that in the system. It doesn't make it not cheating because the NPCs are scripted with supernatural perceptions.

Quote
Could we perhaps get a message in the combat log stating whether a Hexblade or a Sorcerer is casting a spell?  I think the big disconnect is that PCs are left out of the way that NPCs detect a sorcerer's spellcasting.

The Examine tool works for that since, if your Wisdom is high enough, it reveals traits about the person, such as their personal magnetism vs intelligence. The dimwitted flamboyant caster is most likely a sorcerer.

Technically players should know when a bard casts since "every bard spell has a verbal component (singing, reciting, or music)", unlike other arcane classes.

Spoiler: show
Quote
Spells
A bard casts arcane spells, which are drawn from the bard spell list. He can cast any spell he knows without preparing it ahead of time. Every bard spell has a verbal component (singing, reciting, or music). To learn or cast a spell, a bard must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a bard’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the bard’s Charisma modifier.



The examine tool does not work for that. If I have 18 charisma and cast bulls strength it is absolutely mechanically indistinguishable from a sorcerer who didn't minx their attribute spread. A wizard that took high int and high charisma for rp purposes is 100% indistinguishable from a sorcerer who did the exact same thing for the exact same reasons. If Colette the bored debutante, whose entire existence is standing idly in the middle of street playing with her umbrella can tell the difference between those two with 100% accuracy, instantaneously, 100% of the time from a single spell cast, then you are also saying that it is such a remarkable difference in the way those two cast their spells that I should not be reading tea-leaves from my examine tool trying to guesstimate whether maybe they are more likely one or the other.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Lexica on November 27, 2021, 03:45:56 PM
Quote
Could we perhaps get a message in the combat log stating whether a Hexblade or a Sorcerer is casting a spell?  I think the big disconnect is that PCs are left out of the way that NPCs detect a sorcerer's spellcasting.

The Examine tool works for that since, if your Wisdom is high enough, it reveals traits about the person, such as their personal magnetism vs intelligence. The dimwitted flamboyant caster is most likely a sorcerer.

Technically players should know when a bard casts since "every bard spell has a verbal component (singing, reciting, or music)", unlike other arcane classes.

Spoiler: show
Quote
Spells
A bard casts arcane spells, which are drawn from the bard spell list. He can cast any spell he knows without preparing it ahead of time. Every bard spell has a verbal component (singing, reciting, or music). To learn or cast a spell, a bard must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a bard’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the bard’s Charisma modifier.

Depending on the spell being cast though, even given the point about bards having a specific different tell, what's to differentiate, say... A favored soul and a sorcerer? If both cast bull's strength, I don't know how you would be able to distinguish them with the examine tool. Perhaps there should be an OCR reaction for casting a spell that a sorcerer's int wouldn't allow them to cast if they were a wizard, if that's possible. Allowing low level but not high level magic.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: ASymphony on November 27, 2021, 03:59:03 PM
Quote
Could we perhaps get a message in the combat log stating whether a Hexblade or a Sorcerer is casting a spell?  I think the big disconnect is that PCs are left out of the way that NPCs detect a sorcerer's spellcasting.

The Examine tool works for that since, if your Wisdom is high enough, it reveals traits about the person, such as their personal magnetism vs intelligence. The dimwitted flamboyant caster is most likely a sorcerer.

Technically players should know when a bard casts since "every bard spell has a verbal component (singing, reciting, or music)", unlike other arcane classes.

Spoiler: show
Quote
Spells
A bard casts arcane spells, which are drawn from the bard spell list. He can cast any spell he knows without preparing it ahead of time. Every bard spell has a verbal component (singing, reciting, or music). To learn or cast a spell, a bard must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a bard’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the bard’s Charisma modifier.


An 18 INT 14 CHA wizard is to my knowledge, even with the examine tool and high wis indistinguishable from a 14 INT 18 CHA sorcerer.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Dhelindria on March 14, 2022, 07:44:49 PM
Could the area called "Dementlieu - Baie de Pernault - Crossroads" have some herb spawn points added to it? It seems like some should grow there.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: EO on March 15, 2022, 05:21:51 PM
Could the area called "Dementlieu - Baie de Pernault - Crossroads" have some herb spawn points added to it? It seems like some should grow there.

Makes sense. I'll add some herbs.
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: Snarling_Badger on May 10, 2023, 10:12:46 AM
I'd just like to say that I love the Val de Luxémont areas in Dementlieu. These are wonderfully detailed, from the village, to the lake, to the farmlands, to the woodlands. Thematically, they are wonderfully lit, especially at night, and really compliment the gothic horror theme. Great work, devs!

I have two suggestions and requests concerning these areas -

1 - An addition of shops/taverns/inn. As far as I am aware, none of the buildings in the village are accessible. I think it would be great to add in some small shops here that sell unique goods, such as fruits, vegetables, and other foodstuffs or supplies. Perhaps those that are produced in the locality. A small tavern or inn would also be most welcome, adding more RP locations for the area, and promoting more visitations from characters.

2 - More countryside/wilderness areas spreading from Val de Luxémont. There are some wolf-caves and wolf spawns on the edge of the Val de Luxémont areas, and those are awesome. They provide lower level characters with a chance to get a little XP, hunt, and find crafting materials. I'd like to see these areas expanded with some more wilderness areas a bit further away from the village. More caves/creeks/glades? It'd be nice to have some more variation and some more niches for RP and exploration. Maybe some forest paths or abandoned shacks and such where characters could hideout or meet.

Looking forward to what comes next out in Dementlieu!
Title: Re: Dementlieu Feedback V2
Post by: ladylena on May 10, 2023, 02:23:15 PM
Got to see the secret drug shop in the thieves ally. Goodness that entire place the highway and the shop are just beautiful