Ravenloft: Prisoners of the Mist
Suggestions, Feedback & Bug Reports (OOC) => Module Feedback and Suggestions => Topic started by: shadymerchant on December 28, 2012, 07:50:03 PM
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One of the newer quirks I've seen pop up during NCW week is low levels with access to this very powerful item. I've heard of it used more for griefing and poorly planned PVP than I have any legitimate purpose and I'm curious if anyone else is of the opinion that this doesn't really belong? It's powerful, common, and one use can end a player in the current arena of low level players. It may end up useless against high level players, but that still means it is primarily a tool for low levels to kill other low level players.
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I brought this up in another thread...
I found a candle with level 18 flamestrike in the beetle cave. Anyone want to get my Duergar angry?
That should be single-use, so it's okay. Are you sure it's level 18?
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As I recall that's a bugged loot item, it's suppose to be in higher level areas such as dementlieu and nowhere near the skirts. Which I do recall the reported location, and the fact it's broken as all iadul.
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I saw this item at Caster Level 18, one time a day.
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I found two .. and used em to kill some bodaks.. it was great fun.. ;p
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i dont even know what these are:)
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I see what the problem is. I will boost the item cost so it will not be so common. Apparently torches aren't priced the same way as other items and skew too low.
Sorry about all this.
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Noooooo it was so useful to kill those damn shadows and other fiends! Oh well :D
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Flame candles are awesome! The only item with charges in the loot table (aside from shield candles, enchanted whetstones, and brooches of shielding) that I have ever used instead of selling. Them's be the swaggiest, yo.
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proof that all anyone cares about is items useful to kill things instead of rp.... :lol:
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Well, it's good when you missclick when using it. Rada almost wiped her party with it because of one missclick :)
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Well I finally know what this talk is about.
I managed to find at least three just in a regular run.
I think these items are actually pretty damn powerfull, maybe even more powerfull than they should be.
One of this makes more damage per turn, then say a dual wielding ranger. Also it definetly hits. (15d6 damage, that is huge!)
And is quite usefull against undead, and since half the server houses undead enemy, this item is VERY powerfull, also it has AOE damage if i am not mistaken, making it
an awesome dungeon cleering device.
If i may ask, i would ask for these itmes to be seriously toned down.
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I'm going to echo the sentiment above(And repeat it for timestop scrolls) for three reasons:
Low magic server
Easily farmable
BOOM. Headshot.
Neither of these items promote rp, they're just used for breaking things and reduce the need for magical assistance.
Plus if some measly lvl two gets ten of them he can kill half of the outskirts. These items seem irresponsibly powerful.
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The reflex save on these things is 17, just so you guys know. I've had 4 used on me, never once took any damage. It's no more dangerous than the Hold Person essence or Fear essence that we have had for a while now without any large abuse.
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I would say that is completely untrue. I have heard of multiple instances of these used as single use kill devices by low levels against other low levels that can't make a 17 dc save. As stated, it's also easy to get multiple candles and spam them. My level 8 has two, but i expect in a week he'll carry around 6 at this rate.
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The reflex save on these things is 17, just so you guys know. I've had 4 used on me, never once took any damage. It's no more dangerous than the Hold Person essence or Fear essence that we have had for a while now without any large abuse.
Hold person essence has 14 or 15 dc.
Phantasmal killer has like 15 or 16 (but gives two saves, also since it is instakill you will just get to 0, or be damaged for 3d6)
Sadly for a ranger a reflex save of 17 is not that easy to achieve. The max i can obtain is 13(currently). And i have quite decent dex. (this 13 includes two items that both give +2 reflex, having my cats grace its max 5 bonus and using a universal save +1 item, i have luck of heroes but not lightning reflexes yet.) And you should not forget, that non rogues and non monks, still get damaged by the spell, and it is effectively still 7.5d6 damage. Which on a single item is still quite a good damage output.
Also actually whereas it is quite abuseable in PVP, its true and horrendous power comes out in dungeon farming.
Just to give you an example, with a high ac guy, and someone stocked up with these candles you can easily farm dungeons not meant for your level.
AC guy blocks the door, whereas due to the listen script every moving enemy will come at you folks, and when in mass, you just use up your candles.
5 or 7 such candles can clear out whole dungeons. And i did not even put real thought how this item can be elsewise used or abused.
Sullen woods is a great example, but i can think on at last two other dungeons, which are a lot more rewarding considering loot and xp wise, for a very very long time.
(also undeads have low reflex saves.)
Basicly i could just stock up on these candles, and use them instead of meleeing since, i deal more damage this way, than...i will ever be with my ranger.
(level 20 ranger has 9 attacks, usually having d8/d8 or d10/d6 damage +str bonus, +varnish+enchantment. You can usually get half of these attacks sitting. Which is around half of the damage this candle is able to make!)
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I would say that is completely untrue. I have heard of multiple instances of these used as single use kill devices by low levels against other low levels that can't make a 17 dc save. As stated, it's also easy to get multiple candles and spam them. My level 8 has two, but i expect in a week he'll carry around 6 at this rate.
Yeah, my example was not that great. What you said is completely true, also. But then again, a crafty level 2 can just as easily talk a powerful character into doing it for him. I once saw a weapon master kill a lvl 14 character at full health with a single great axe crit. I don't really see the item as being a huge problem. People killed each other before it, and if you remove it they will just find other ways. But then again, I'm not saying I really feel one way or another about the item. I just don't see it really changing much.
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The item has a nice write up, but I don't suspect it will receive any actual roleplay. A class limitation to make it only usable by Druids who have the "Spell completion" requirement, and this item would be roleplayed by and for those who should use it most. Other classes could try it with UMD.
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My NCW rogue, Marie. Was killed by one. She had no chance, even with her big reflex save. I agree something must be done regarding this.
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I like it, because it gives me an ace in the hole. Like the Mirror Masks, it's something that I value and consider long and hard when to use it. Too valuable to be wasted on an idle sortie.
Marie did rather provoke that lol. I know ganking is the point with Rogues, but what you do unto others just ends up being returned tenfold in my experience.
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I like it, because it gives me an ace in the hole. Like the Mirror Masks, it's something that I value and consider long and hard when to use it. Too valuable to be wasted on an idle sortie.
Marie did rather provoke that lol. I know ganking is the point with Rogues, but what you do unto others just ends up being returned tenfold in my experience.
nope. Even if their value will be adjusted, i think it will still be quite easy to obtain.
Also something that does 15d6 per click...is just...too much on a supposedly low magic.
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I like it, because it gives me an ace in the hole. Like the Mirror Masks, it's something that I value and consider long and hard when to use it. Too valuable to be wasted on an idle sortie.
Marie did rather provoke that lol. I know ganking is the point with Rogues, but what you do unto others just ends up being returned tenfold in my experience.
Marie had four on her. Even when she tried to kill him :). I rather not use these items except against mobs in desperate situations. In pvp... it's just not fair, especially that magic bypasses the subdual mode, which I always use.
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...I still don't understand why all can use this thing. An item with "Spell completion" works based upon whether or not the bearer of the item speaks the Activation Word.
I don't think everyone knows the last few words to Flame Strike.
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And this is why I have UMD :D And arcane caster levels lol.
But not everyone enjoys such.
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Too valuable to be wasted on an idle sortie.
Again, not true. They still drop frequently in the areas surrounding Vallaki. There are dozens if not a hundred or more in circulation at this point.
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Seeing as I had around 10 on my main and I have not been out looting, that's what I was able to pick up at the vendor, they aren't a good sale item so I'm sure they're being stockpiled (low weight) to form pages and pages of insta-win.
ICly, my character will view the use of this item as reckless, pagan, and something that needs to be dealt with immediately. (Considering one use of the thing could kill every NPC layperson at mass.)
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ICly, my character will view the use of this item as reckless, pagan, and something that needs to be dealt with immediately. (Considering one use of the thing could kill every NPC layperson at mass.)
YAY! :D:lol::D who needs those filthy ezrites anyhow? :P
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Seeing as I had around 10 on my main and I have not been out looting, that's what I was able to pick up at the vendor, they aren't a good sale item so I'm sure they're being stockpiled (low weight) to form pages and pages of insta-win.
ICly, my character will view the use of this item as reckless, pagan, and something that needs to be dealt with immediately. (Considering one use of the thing could kill every NPC layperson at mass.)
Good! Then we can report that Ezrites are murdering folks as it was told all along!:)
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Personally of the opinion that no Ezrite should use this item since it is based on Druidic (pagan) roleplay. And I can stock pile them and use them to wax my boots, so the boots shine when they stomp on somebody for using these.
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Personally of the opinion that no Ezrite should use this item since it is based on Druidic (pagan) roleplay. And I can stock pile them and use them to wax my boots, so the boots shine when they stomp on somebody for using these.
Probably, however in Barovia, you do not have that kind of power, and killing someone for the use of the candle could and should be considered as an act of murder.
Also there are a number of paganist chars i think.
In portalucine you can most likely execute someone for useing it though. OFC it is just imho.
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Personally of the opinion that no Ezrite should use this item since it is based on Druidic (pagan) roleplay. And I can stock pile them and use them to wax my boots, so the boots shine when they stomp on somebody for using these.
Probably, however in Barovia, you do not have that kind of power, and killing someone for the use of the candle could and should be considered as an act of murder.
Also there are a number of paganist chars i think.
In portalucine you can most likely execute someone for useing it though. OFC it is just imho.
Now I said stomp, I didn't say anything about killing anybody... :twisted: Though if the power of these items becomes more well known IC, Barovians might beg for the users of such to be lynched! Well, that's my take on it anyway. And I guess just a general promise of treating this very seriously in the context of religious roleplay.
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If it becomes a concern, if you survive the initial blast of instant win, you might be able to kill the offender and icly remove every last item they have. Although if you're fighting a stockpiler, you'll probably wind up a pile of ash.
Which really enhances the plotline of an entire populace of stockpiling nukes. We could play cold war in the middle ages.
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If it becomes a concern, if you survive the initial blast of instant win, you might be able to kill the offender and icly remove every last item they have. Although if you're fighting a stockpiler, you'll probably wind up a pile of ash.
Which really enhances the plotline of an entire populace of stockpiling nukes. We could play cold war in the middle ages.
The Barovian Badger VS The Dementlieu Dandy.
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If it becomes a concern, if you survive the initial blast of instant win, you might be able to kill the offender and icly remove every last item they have. Although if you're fighting a stockpiler, you'll probably wind up a pile of ash.
Which really enhances the plotline of an entire populace of stockpiling nukes. We could play cold war in the middle ages.
Actually...we are allready stockpileing. I managed to find 4 in a single run.
Now a few moments ago, i could have probably decimated the guarda faction with the use of one or two such candles. But since i am one openly talking against the item, would have been quite a hypocrite to do so.
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They should be much rarer after the last update, only appearing in high-level areas.
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the protection from evil candles are still spawning with no charges.
also iv not found a single shield or flame candle since the update..perhaps too rare?
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the protection from evil candles are still spawning with no charges.
also iv not found a single shield or flame candle since the update..perhaps too rare?
I don't understand how they spawn with no charges, they have charges when I see them in the toolset.
The other two candles have a more appropriate gp value now, so now they're appropriately rare.
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considering Iv not found one since the update with constant looting. they just might became more rare then a brooch
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considering Iv not found one since the update with constant looting. they just might became more rare then a brooch
Maybe we should ask George Bush to find em. [Bad joke is bad]
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considering Iv not found one since the update with constant looting. they just might became more rare then a brooch
Considering how powerful the items in question are, that isn't a bad thing.
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the protection from evil candles are still spawning with no charges.
I've figured out the issue. It will be fixed in the next update.
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As of the 1/28/2013 update, the flame candle now only has a 1% chance of appearing in the loot tables.
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As of the 1/28/2013 update, the flame candle now only has a 1% chance of appearing in the loot tables.
Glorious.