Ravenloft: Prisoners of the Mist

Suggestions, Feedback & Bug Reports (OOC) => Module Feedback and Suggestions => Topic started by: Vissitude on July 28, 2011, 03:54:30 PM

Title: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Vissitude on July 28, 2011, 03:54:30 PM
Yesterday a post was made by a DM, asking that the Large Black Puddings not be led to civilization areas. Some hours later, six PCs were dead to 10-12 Large black puddings on the transition right by the Orphanage.

Today, two low levels were ambushed on the same transition by the orphanage by at least 6? DM Vixen helped, and I am grateful


I am unsure if they are supposed to spawn in the area, but there have been reports these puddings are also being spotted in the slums as well. They are very deadly, doing 13-15 damage at least to my character on one hit, so its not good for low levels.


Some of us aren't sure if this is a natural spawn now in these areas, or if they are simply being dragged to these areas where Low levels travel. Either way, I offered to make this post so the Devs and DMs were aware of the issue.


Save the Lowbies! Stop the Puddings!  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: WildPirate13 on July 28, 2011, 04:01:28 PM
Devon had puddings for lunch yesterday it was awesome.. sprinkle some sugar on them and tasty.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Ovidiu_Lacusta on July 28, 2011, 07:51:31 PM
I noticed these on the Old Svalich Road just west of Vallaki and it didn't seem like they were right for the zone - it makes sense that someone might have "pulled" them from another location... ugh
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: ethinos on July 28, 2011, 07:54:58 PM
The closest place to Vallaki that I know that they spawn is the tunnels that go between Vallaki and Dvergeheim, but those lie east of the Outskirts. Is there somewhere near the Orphanage that they can spawn? I can't imagine that they'd spawn anywhere other than underground somewhere.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Ercvadasz on July 28, 2011, 07:59:22 PM
The closest place to Vallaki that I know that they spawn is the tunnels that go between Vallaki and Dvergeheim, but those lie east of the Outskirts. Is there somewhere near the Orphanage that they can spawn? I can't imagine that they'd spawn anywhere other than underground somewhere.

they can spawn in the nearby caves as well. There are two caves that specially have a chance of triggering a pudding spawn, one is near the oprhanage just on the southern part of the map, the cave with the two levels.... the other one is in the sullen woods, the northern cave. These two caves have the chance of having pudding spawn, allthough on rare times i even saw some puddings south of vallaki in the cave....So it is the random caves that spawn them. Would be good to remove them from the random spawn/encounter table in these instances, since they are even a deadly foe above level 9....especially since they even eat wooden clubs away too....(i had two wooden clubs since they eat steel, apparantly they are not that picky!:)
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Vissitude on July 28, 2011, 08:12:05 PM
Problem is, that once they lock target they follow and keep following, which is why I think they are being dragged closer to areas like the City, Transition by the Orphanage and Outskirts. They just keep following the target that they caught sight of.

Like I said. My character is level 15, and just one of them was doing close to 13-15 Damage. For most level 2-4 Characters, that's insta-death when there's more than one of these puddings attacking them.

I agree, that it might be a good idea to take them out of the random encounter, or at least the random encounters that are around the low level dungeon areas such as the Orphanage.

my :twocents:
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: ethinos on July 28, 2011, 09:16:51 PM
Hmm. I'm surprised the random cave spawns are willing to chase so far away from their cave. Maybe we can fix that?
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Geiger on July 28, 2011, 09:43:04 PM
A while back an errant one had killed the whole of Dvergeheim. They will eat all your shield, weapon and your armor. lol.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Ercvadasz on July 28, 2011, 09:50:21 PM
A while back an errant one had killed the whole of Dvergeheim. They will eat all your shield, weapon and your armor. lol.

basicly everything, you can fight them with fists (monks go get them!) or slings or pistols, but basicly slings and run is your best option....but yeah they need some serious readjustment, many of the npcs have no blunt weapons, therefore they dont stand a chance against these creatures, i remember someone told me that just two puddings once wiped the whole town of dvergenheim, because poor sod dwarves had only pickaxes and axes and no hammers....:(
or maybe if possible they should not eat wooden things, so folks can fight them with clubs, and poke out their eyes with big stafffs(:D)
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Bluebomber4evr on July 28, 2011, 10:13:41 PM
Probably the easiest fix is to keep them from leaving the caves that they're in (we'd just place a variable on the dungeon exit that will block spawns from using it)--that's what we did for Dvergeheim. It'd help if we knew which caves that close to civilization are spawning them, though.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Swiftar on July 28, 2011, 10:45:54 PM
Probably the easiest fix is to keep them from leaving the caves that they're in (we'd just place a variable on the dungeon exit that will block spawns from using it)--that's what we did for Dvergeheim. It'd help if we knew which caves that close to civilization are spawning them, though.

They spawn in both Sullen Woods caves, and the Sullen Woods themselves on occasion.  My guess is that those areas are the culprits most of the time.  They also tend to spawn in the random caves to the south of Vallaki (The one area south of the well entrance to the sewers, and then the cave one zone further to the south).
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Norture on July 28, 2011, 11:04:17 PM
I've seen puddings in the large 2 floor cave west of Vallaki too.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Aahz on July 28, 2011, 11:14:20 PM
I confirm those places and add the cave behind the waterfall in the southern woods. Well not that cave where the bears are but the first area of the cavern's there.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: dutchy on July 29, 2011, 01:34:09 AM
do it like this folks easyer for the devs to adjust without going trough the pages just add your spot.

They spawn in both Sullen Woods caves, and the Sullen Woods themselves on occasion.  My guess is that those areas are the culprits most of the time.  They also tend to spawn in the random caves to the south of Vallaki (The one area south of the well entrance to the sewers, and then the cave one zone further to the south).

I've seen puddings in the large 2 floor cave west of Vallaki too.

 confirm those places and add the cave behind the waterfall in the southern woods. Well not that cave where the bears are but the first area of the cavern's there.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Indriya on July 29, 2011, 02:03:11 AM
They seem to be a bit much considering where they appear to be spawning and the fact they murderize high levels handily.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Kenkaku on July 29, 2011, 02:12:12 AM
I think I found part of the problem with this situation. I ran over there just a bit ago and ran into no less than twenty miniature-sized Large Black Puddings. Apparently, somebody went and had a field day with a slashing/piercing weapon then ran around like a chicken with its head cut off. They were scattered all over the zones leading toward Zeklos Keep.

I found the cave and wiped it out along with a ton of the mini ones wandering about, but there's probably more. I think we need to start some IC awareness program to the dangers of the Black Puddings. :lol:


Where they spawn:

The Variable caves in the Sullen woods
The Variable caves in the Southern Forest
The Variable caves toward Zeklos Keep (all three of them, apparently)
The long cave that connects from Vallaki to Dvergeheim


Really, I think the damage on the Puddings need to be knocked down just slightly. That'd probably help with the Pudding plague we seem to be having. The Large ones can swing for upwards of 20 damage a shot, which is pretty insane for a low-level creature.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: HellsPanda on July 29, 2011, 02:13:27 AM
black pudding meets wolf?
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Thoraion on July 29, 2011, 02:43:33 AM
The closest place to Vallaki that I know that they spawn is the tunnels that go between Vallaki and Dvergeheim, but those lie east of the Outskirts. Is there somewhere near the Orphanage that they can spawn? I can't imagine that they'd spawn anywhere other than underground somewhere.

Sullen woods - there is a connection with only one map between the two maps now


@Panda: Black pudding meets eats wolf
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Jay on July 29, 2011, 05:15:38 AM
The problem we have with the puddings is other monster/NPC's will attack the pudding on sight. 1 pudding becomes 12 and the NPC or monster runs away, dragging a dozen puddings with them, other NPC's come running to fight them and the process is repeated. The other day in question i was killing puddings across four maps, and the Slums was practically deserted because they'd killed everyone in them and in doing so had pulled puddings to the for corners of the map, likewise the other maps had the same issue.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Ercvadasz on July 29, 2011, 05:57:13 AM
the outdoor pudding spawn in the sullen woods, is due the cave has high pudding spawn.

!so to clear things up, black puddings may spawn in any random cave.!

The trigger chance they spawn is low, but it still happens. And when it does nobody dares to enter the cave, because room to fight them is lacking, so they will build up additional spawn, and thus start to appear before the cave, on the outside.
They really need a readjustment.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Ternce on July 29, 2011, 07:21:54 AM
Large black puddings are overpowered.

A single one split, repeatedly, and killed the entirety of Dvergeheim which has level 16+ NPC's.

Nerf black puddings imo.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: HellsPanda on July 29, 2011, 07:38:09 AM
what I meant was each time a pudding met a wolf, you would get 2 puddings
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: LoLJohnFerro on July 29, 2011, 09:47:20 AM
Rock also thinks paper needs a nerf, Just saying, None the less- If puddings are an issue.. get ready for it -DONT FIGHT THEM- Run away!

Who'd guess thier are dangerous and violent things in barovia, play it IC when I see a black pudding its claws up and fistacuffs at the ready, because he knows he can handle it,
Whilst a lowbie might not have the same luck. You have to run rather then fight if you see the blob slurching after you. Also, this may be the work of a griefer from what it sounds, dragging slimes to transitions?
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Swiftar on July 29, 2011, 10:20:27 AM
If puddings are an issue.. get ready for it -DONT FIGHT THEM- Run away!

The big issue at hand is that running away makes them follow you indefinitely
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Indriya on July 29, 2011, 10:26:55 AM
I think that people running from them caused the problem with the bunch that came into outskirts and slaughtered people for... what was it, hours? So once one targets you when you stumble across it in a cave, or wherever, you will drag it with you wherever you flee too. >.<
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: respawnaholic on July 29, 2011, 10:30:41 AM
The closest place to Vallaki that I know that they spawn is the tunnels that go between Vallaki and Dvergeheim, but those lie east of the Outskirts. Is there somewhere near the Orphanage that they can spawn? I can't imagine that they'd spawn anywhere other than underground somewhere.

They can randomely spawn in the cave complexes near the orphanage. As someone posting has mentioned they can be very deadly for low to moderate characters so its not uncommon for PCs without offensive spellcasting abilities to simply run when they see them. (Their really isnt any point in fighting them since their a 3cr monster that can kill a fully buffed mid-teens PC in 3-4 rounds. You gain nothing from them relative to the danger they pose.) If the PC is detected the puddings are often times fast enough to keep up with a fleeing PC thus having them wind up across transition boundaries. In an open environment their manageable, but in an enclosed environment they are probably the most dangerous thing on the server. Nice balance with those BTW.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: vlowe72 on July 29, 2011, 01:18:00 PM
I've had slimes follow me all the way from the caves in the southern woods to the outskirts.  Not sure why they're so relentless, unless it has to do with their slow movement.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Smitehammer on July 29, 2011, 06:45:09 PM
I'd say they're alright, if the CR were jacked a bit, and the things gotten from them alchemy-wise were also jacked up a bit.  Relegate them to the upper echelon of dungeons, so that people with the means to fight them will figure out ways to fight them.

Alternatively, or additionally, it would be a more winnable situation for all involved if they didn't split indefinitely.  Under non-bludgeoning damage have one LARGE turn into two MEDIUM, turn into two SMALL, and then have them die.  Even if you're using an axe or whatnot.  Have small still die outright, and medium split into two small and die.  This way, it is still winnable for the guards of Dvergeheim or what have you EVENTUALLY win out, and the universe doesn't implode upon itself with such rampant defilement of the law of conservation of mass.

Really, you start out with 5 gallons of pudding, you'll not end with infinity-gallons of pudding unless Jesus came down and mistook them for loaves of bread and fish.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Ercvadasz on July 29, 2011, 06:58:36 PM
I'd say they're alright, if the CR were jacked a bit, and the things gotten from them alchemy-wise were also jacked up a bit.  Relegate them to the upper echelon of dungeons, so that people with the means to fight them will figure out ways to fight them.

Alternatively, or additionally, it would be a more winnable situation for all involved if they didn't split indefinitely.  Under non-bludgeoning damage have one LARGE turn into two MEDIUM, turn into two SMALL, and then have them die.  Even if you're using an axe or whatnot.  Have small still die outright, and medium split into two small and die.  This way, it is still winnable for the guards of Dvergeheim or what have you EVENTUALLY win out, and the universe doesn't implode upon itself with such rampant defilement of the law of conservation of mass.

Really, you start out with 5 gallons of pudding, you'll not end with infinity-gallons of pudding unless Jesus came down and mistook them for loaves of bread and fish.

even normal oozes dont die that way.
As i noticed if you keep using slashing or piercing weapons against them, most of them just start to divide into lesser beings, once i had 22 minor oozes follow me....and i could not kill em because i did not have blunt weapons beside my fists, but with an ac of 18 it was too risky...(and could not overcome their dr with the piercing slashing weapons.)
They wont die from slashing or piercing weapons just go down to near death, where they stay invincible till blunt weapon or spell hits em.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Smitehammer on July 29, 2011, 07:01:56 PM
Right, and blunt or magic could still kill a large, medium, or small outright.  I'm just saying don't have them split forever and ever once they reach the small stage, just have them die at that point.  That way, it still makes things a lot more difficult to fight them the 'dumb way' over the 'smart way', but you will eventually kill them.  NPCs will eventually kill them, maybe.  Low levels won't be swarmed with the 20s of them upon transitioning.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: ethinos on July 29, 2011, 07:31:48 PM
This is how the black pudding (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/ooze.htm#blackPudding) (and likely other oozes) are supposed to split according to the SRD. No idea if this is how it works currently or not, as I use slings against oozes whenever possible.

Quote
Split (Ex)
 
Slashing and piercing weapons deal no damage to a black pudding. Instead the creature splits into two identical puddings, each with half of the original’s current hit points (round down). A pudding with 10 hit points or less cannot be further split and dies if reduced to 0 hit points.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Bluebomber4evr on July 29, 2011, 08:52:29 PM
The script for the black pudding splitting is just a modified version of the one Bioware made for the ochre jelly.

EDIT: the modifications were for the types of damage that affect them, eg ochre jellies split when hit by electrical attacks, black puddings do not.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: EberronBruce on July 30, 2011, 05:54:02 AM
Black Puddings weakness seem to be magic missile or the monk. And they are tough even for my lvl 12 character. They are truly a nightmare more so than a vampire. That is something wrong when you fear a pudding over a vampire.

Make it possible to make a type of muck bane.

My idea for one on this server.

Take ash or oak wood. Fashion a club or quarterstaff and cover it with treant sap to keep the ooze from eating it.

It would be a mundane club or quarterstaff except it wont take damage from the ooze:)

The wood worker making these will make a small fortune until others figure it out. ;)
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: dark_majico on July 30, 2011, 07:25:25 AM
Black Puddings weakness seem to be magic missile or the monk. And they are tough even for my lvl 12 character. They are truly a nightmare more so than a vampire. That is something wrong when you fear a pudding over a vampire.


Thats not really true, the fear of a primordial, emotionless, relentless creature can be more frightening than any creature with at least some intelligance. Hence the 1958 film the Blob, its being remade and release date is planned for 2012, watch out for that one folks  :fonzie:
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Gary T on August 01, 2011, 11:29:20 AM
I think we can work with this:

"An evil dark plague has descended on Barovia, coughed up from the bowels of the land.  The result of Pitics, Outlanders, cultists, and witches journeying where no man was meant to go.  It devours everything in sight...who or what will rise up to face this latest scourge?!"

The garda can make desperate pleas for volunteers, the cultist's can have all night pray-ins...heck it may even get desperate enough to call Strahd down from yon high to lead the charge...at night of course:).
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: respawnaholic on August 01, 2011, 07:49:47 PM
I think we can work with this:

"An evil dark plague has descended on Barovia, coughed up from the bowels of the land.  The result of Pitics, Outlanders, cultists, and witches journeying where no man was meant to go.  It devours everything in sight...who or what will rise up to face this latest scourge?!"

The garda can make desperate pleas for volunteers, the cultist's can have all night pray-ins...heck it may even get desperate enough to call Strahd down from yon high to lead the charge...at night of course:).

Yeah. good luck with that. My characters will take a vacation in Port Lucine until the wizards deal with ti.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Draxiss on August 01, 2011, 09:06:33 PM
I'd be scared if dessert tried to eat me, too.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Soren / Zarathustra217 on August 02, 2011, 05:47:58 AM
Our version of the black puddings actually only eat up metal weapons, so wooden weaponry is likely the way to go.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: respawnaholic on August 02, 2011, 08:08:39 AM
Our version of the black puddings actually only eat up metal weapons, so wooden weaponry is likely the way to go.

Running from them is the way to go.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Ercvadasz on August 02, 2011, 09:26:18 AM
Our version of the black puddings actually only eat up metal weapons, so wooden weaponry is likely the way to go.

Running from them is the way to go.

i agree.
Wooden weaponry is not working they eat it up, like the rest of the stuff. As i mentioned on the first page, i kept two clubs on my char. Wooden ones just for the black puddings.
They ate it up, and hickuped and said, now it is time for your chain shirt! That is when i ran. So, no, wooden weaponry did not work:(

and are they cr7 as well? cuz someone mentioned that the large black puddings are cr 3 here, and the link Blue posted said they are cr 7.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Aahz on August 02, 2011, 10:45:34 AM
I remember back when I first started, we had a group of four 6th level characters encounter a cave system full of Ocher Jellies. We put our weapons away and stomped our way through them. We didn't have any protection from elemental damage, only occasionally got hit, and was damaged around 8 hp per hit. Good times.

Now of course I don't dare melee with them. Even with elemental protection, they rarely miss and do 11-15 points of damage when they hit.  They also manage to stay right on my heels when I run so unless I have a huge open area to run around it I do not dare try an use a sling. Black puddings? Death incarnate, I run at the first sight of them.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Ternce on August 04, 2011, 01:34:52 AM
I keep a quarterstaff on me for random encounters with Black Puddings.  I've never had a problem with them.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Aahz on August 04, 2011, 12:30:03 PM
I keep a quarterstaff on me for random encounters with Black Puddings.  I've never had a problem with them.

I'm happy for you. For my characters, they are insanely deadly.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: dark_majico on August 06, 2011, 06:10:40 AM
I keep a quarterstaff on me for random encounters with Black Puddings.  I've never had a problem with them.

I'm happy for you. For my characters, they are insanely deadly.

I defeat Black Pudding with my mitie Frying Pan of Imobilization (+1), once stunned I fry it gently over a low/medium heat for 10 minutes where I finish it off with a handfull of mushrooms, a side of hienz baked beans, and plumb tomotaoes. Not so scary if you have the right gear.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: respawnaholic on August 06, 2011, 12:38:36 PM
I keep a quarterstaff on me for random encounters with Black Puddings.  I've never had a problem with them.

I'm happy for you. For my characters, they are insanely deadly.

I defeat Black Pudding with my mitie Frying Pan of Imobilization (+1), once stunned I fry it gently over a low/medium heat for 10 minutes where I finish it off with a handfull of mushrooms, a side of hienz baked beans, and plumb tomotaoes. Not so scary if you have the right gear.

Not so scarey if your a monk.
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Kagetora on August 06, 2011, 01:50:32 PM
As for where they can spawn....I have seen them in every cave around Vallaki at one time or another, from Zeklos to Midway, except for the Hobgoblin cave and the wolf cave to the East of the Elf enclave.  Those are the ONLY exceptions that actually come to mind.  In every other cave, its literally been, at one point, walk in, see oozes/puddings, walk back out.  Seriously.  Obviously they don't spawn in the actual dungeons themselves (Zeklos, Crypts, Ruined Monestary, etc.), but every place where the spawn can be random seems to generate them.

And as for how to deal with them...Well, as was mentioned, running is usually the best option if you don't have a monk.  One buffed monk, however, runs through them like a hot knife through butter.  My L10 wizard buffed a L10 monk and just stood back, watching her kill WELL over 100 Large and Medium Ochre Jellies in a particular location one dungeon run.  I literally got bored watching her carnage and would throw in an occaional Magic Missile, Flame Arrow, or Firebrand just to liven things up on my end.

So, it seems puddings/oozes literally are Paper, monks are Scissors, and the rest of us are just Rocks.   :lol:
Title: Re: Large Black Puddings
Post by: Gary T on November 23, 2011, 02:30:43 PM
Yeah, Carina gets bored fighting black puddings:) She can take like 5 of the large ones at a time. It's those damn Hook Horrors that cut through her.  But isn't that the way it is supposed to be, so that we are all interdependent on each other?