To Address Common Issues

[Norture]

What I'm taking from this thread is people have played Arelith due to the EE release and have seen it has nice things, and they want nice things on the server they feel an attachment to.

[Nemesis 24]

Not me personally.  Never played on Arelith, and have no intention to.  I prefer to focus all my time and energy here.  Despite all the anger seemingly simmering here, I do love this place, I genuinely do.

[Chaoshawk]

I'm going to be blunt, if there actually is a board for ranting by DM's about players on a personal level, that's pretty horrific, and I believe a bunch of players were permanently banned for that very behaviour.  Player behaviour, sure, but personal?  Surely this isn't true, at least not any more.  That's a horrific betrayal of trust and flies utterly in the face of the 'no them, just us' mentality we should and 'need' to have.  Please tell me that it isn't true.

I did not see a board for ranting when I was DMing.

[Nemesis 24]

Thank goodness.  Appreciate that info Chaos, if such a thing once existed and its gone now, that personally feels like it links in with a lot of what Mika! said as well.  I honestly think there 'have' been improvements in a lot of things over time, and I've never found the current DM team to not be helpful and considerate.  Sometimes the answer they have to give is 'no', and no one likes hearing that, but that doesn't mean it doesn't need to be said some time.

I still think we need some more DM's, a large number more even (comparatively at least) which I believe would in fact mitigate the burnout by sharing the workload.  But for that to happen, folks need to apply.

[Ehver]

I'm going to be blunt, if there actually is a board for ranting by DM's about players on a personal level, that's pretty horrific, and I believe a bunch of players were permanently banned for that very behaviour.  Player behaviour, sure, but personal?  Surely this isn't true, at least not any more.  That's a horrific betrayal of trust and flies utterly in the face of the 'no them, just us' mentality we should and 'need' to have.  Please tell me that it isn't true.

I did not see a board for ranting when I was DMing.

That's good news.

I think Zarathustra made a good point when he said that many of the DMs that burn out do so because we have an extremely demanding and often vocally negative community. That is to say - why would a DM want to do anything for someone who spent a great deal of their time and effort forming a crusade against DMs - or, at least, against the current ones.

I think it is important that we remember that DMs are people too - unpaid people doing a very difficult and often thankless job. In one breath, people are clamoring for more more more, and in the other breath people are debasing the very same people they are demanding more from. This can be undoubtedly very difficult and very stressful, and its something we perhaps gloss over far too often.

[Iridni Ren]

Just a couple of quick comments:

In public debate, it's better not to guess at why someone has said anything but rather reply to what she has expressly said. Trying to perceive motive is a bit of an ad hominem as far as reasoning goes because you then react to the person instead of the argument. Those observing the discussion will also not understand why you have reacted the way you have, because they won't be privy to all that's gone unstated.

In private....well, there is no "private" on the Internet. Regardless of whether this DM board exists or ever existed, it's just better practice generally to communicate about someone as though you expect her someday to be reading what you've said about her. We all have the urge to vent once in a while and can't always keep our self-control (rather on a hidden board or to a confidante), but it's very rare that expressing our worst impulses and anger is a good practice that won't come back to bite us.

[JayJay]

That's good news.

I think Zarathustra made a good point when he said that many of the DMs that burn out do so because we have an extremely demanding and often vocally negative community. That is to say - why would a DM want to do anything for someone who spent a great deal of their time and effort forming a crusade against DMs - or, at least, against the current ones.

I think it is important that we remember that DMs are people too - unpaid people doing a very difficult and often thankless job. In one breath, people are clamoring for more more more, and in the other breath people are debasing the very same people they are demanding more from. This can be undoubtedly very difficult and very stressful, and its something we perhaps gloss over far too often.

 While I agree with the job of being DM is difficult, it is far from thankless. There is a an entire thread devoted to thanking DM's for any experience, That being said, the job of being a DM is a purely volunteer effort that they decided to task upon themselves, no one else told them to be a DM. I didn't join the Military with expectations for everyone to offer me thanks for doing something I volunteered to do and that is no different from becoming a DM. "Clamoring for more more more" I would argue that point and say there are people who are Clamoring for -anything-. Many players, some playing upwards of 9-10 months to a year, who have -never- had more than ten minutes of being around an active DM scene. I believe this to be a major issue that needs to be rectified.

[Ehver]

I don't disagree. Not in the slightest. But I do think that, appreciation threads aside, DMs do receive a disproportionate amount of negativity on all levels. Nearly every single problem, perceived or real, is in some fashion blamed on DMs - and often in the most base and aggressive fashion possible. I've seen it first-hand. Often.

There are problems and they desperately need to be solved. I'm not one of the blessed few to bask in the glory of DM favour. I can probably count all of the DM activity I've been involved in in the past seven years on my fingers alone.

That doesn't change the fact that the amount of shit DMs get is real.

Edit: screw autocorrect 

[Mailbox-2100]

   I don't have the energy to argue about for or against sentiments. Instead I'll speak openly:

   With EE becoming the standard soon, people, more then ever, will be able to see plainly for themselves what people complain about here, and others gloss over there. Whats hidden in the dark won't be long to come to the light. You need spend no more then a week in game to readily see for yourself the true nature of this server and community. Those who take the time to air their grievances do so out of what little hope we do still possess. Call it love, passion, ignorance, or malice; The truth is self evident.

   I'm not asking for more from DMs, just more DMs. New blood, fresh perspectives, because, frankly, the old guard is nothing new. If everyone is burnt out why not just give others a chance? I suspect (my opinion)  its the activity that goes on behind the scenes that lends such a heavy burden to allowing new people in on it.

   Look at my signature below, my roster of PCs. What do I have to gain from complaining here? I'm at risk of being labeled a 'hatemonger' or some-like. Being further 'demerited' and blackmarked. Its not that I don't care, its that I do. I hate that in expressing my feelings I'm attacked outright and old hat buzzwords and control algorithms are immediately employed to silence dissent and keep control of the masses opinion. I've been called crazy and worse things in private by staff members. Nobodies perfect, nobody, I just want to grow with the community. I know I have a lot to offer, and so many others here do too. I used to invite friends to play here- I'd tell them this was such an amazing community of 'artists' and 'creatives' but I can't do that anymore. Its not that I've grown jaded, its nothing ever grows here anymore. Things are killed rather than nurtured.

   Before a response, let me just say, once again, I don't have the energy to argue, I'm only here to state my opinion and I don't think anything will happen in this thread but circular logic. Subversive or heavy. No argument to the contrary will change my opinion. For that to change, I'll need to see things happen. Talk is meaningless and, at this point, counter-intuitive.

[peccavi]

I can't help but feel that the original point of this thread has been lost at this point. However I'm glad we've seem to come to the following conclusions:

- There should be more DMs; this requires people to apply and for the DM team to be willing to give those who apply an honest shot, regardless of the players history. (As an aside, I've noticed in my years on NWN that once a player makes an impression, it becomes incredibly hard to change. Forgiveness and guidance are in order for some players that would make excellent DMs.)

- The playerbase needs to step away from negativity, knee jerk reactions, and strange conspiracy theories. I've no solutions to this other than to encourage both the players and DMs to be more open with each other. I'm certain that if anyone has any concerns regarding issues, the team would be more than willing to clear them up. I do wonder if allowing for anonymous complaints would alleviate the fear that some people associate with going to the CC or DM team.

- There seems to be a general consensus amongst staff and players that RP XP should be raised.

- The loot situation is being slowly, but surely, addressed.

[JayJay]

   I don't have the energy to argue about for or against sentiments. Instead I'll speak openly:

   With EE becoming the standard soon, people, more then ever, will be able to see plainly for themselves what people complain about here, and others gloss over there. Whats hidden in the dark won't be long to come to the light. You need spend no more then a week in game to readily see for yourself the true nature of this server and community. Those who take the time to air their grievances do so out of what little hope we do still possess. Call it love, passion, ignorance, or malice; The truth is self evident.

   I'm not asking for more from DMs, just more DMs. New blood, fresh perspectives, because, frankly, the old guard is nothing new. If everyone is burnt out why not just give others a chance? I suspect (my opinion)  its the activity that goes on behind the scenes that lends such a heavy burden to allowing new people in on it.

   Look at my signature below, my roster of PCs. What do I have to gain from complaining here? I'm at risk of being labeled a 'hatemonger' or some-like. Being further 'demerited' and blackmarked. Its not that I don't care, its that I do. I hate that in expressing my feelings I'm attacked outright and old hat buzzwords and control algorithms are immediately employed to silence dissent and keep control of the masses opinion. I've been called crazy and worse things in private by staff members. Nobodies perfect, nobody, I just want to grow with the community. I know I have a lot to offer, and so many others here do too. I used to invite friends to play here- I'd tell them this was such an amazing community of 'artists' and 'creatives' but I can't do that anymore. Its not that I've grown jaded, its nothing ever grows here anymore. Things are killed rather than nurtured.

   Before a response, let me just say, once again, I don't have the energy to argue, I'm only here to state my opinion and I don't think anything will happen in this thread but circular logic. Subversive or heavy. No argument to the contrary will change my opinion. For that to change, I'll need to see things happen. Talk is meaningless and, at this point, counter-intuitive.

 +1 Agreed with completely.

[Iridni Ren]

DMs know what it's like to be players; they've been players themselves.

Many players, however, don't know what it's like to be a DM.

This puts DMs in the position of having a better perspective on all these arguments.

But!!

A great way to learn empathy is to experience what the other experiences. The obvious solution to much of this (including the belief in conspiracies) is more DMs. If DMs are over-whelmed, that helps them and makes them feel less lonely in their under-appreciated task. I don't think any player wishes there were fewer DMs.

So...the most constructive approach here would seem to be to figure out how we can have more (good) DMs.

[Ehver]

I can't help but feel that the original point of this thread has been lost at this point. However I'm glad we've seem to come to the following conclusions:

- There should be more DMs; this requires people to apply and for the DM team to be willing to give those who apply an honest shot, regardless of the players history. (As an aside, I've noticed in my years on NWN that once a player makes an impression, it becomes incredibly hard to change. Forgiveness and guidance are in order for some players that would make excellent DMs.)

- The playerbase needs to step away from negativity, knee jerk reactions, and strange conspiracy theories. I've no solutions to this other than to encourage both the players and DMs to be more open with each other. I'm certain that if anyone has any concerns regarding issues, the team would be more than willing to clear them up. I do wonder if allowing for anonymous complaints would alleviate the fear that some people associate with going to the CC or DM team.

- There seems to be a general consensus amongst staff and players that RP XP should be raised.

- The loot situation is being slowly, but surely, addressed.

Agreed on all points.

And I agree with Mailbox as well.

[peccavi]

I agree with Mailbox as well. His posts have been very accurate in summing things up throughout this thread.

[Exordium]

Mailbox (and few others, I guess), honestly I think your chances to be of a positive influence would be markedly improved if you tried to be a little more optimistic about the server. You speak of this like it's the end times, but I vividly remember you having a similar sentiment back in 2013, too - we're still here, 5 years later. For all I can say, we're going to be here after another 5 years later, as well.

When you want to see things change for the better, you need to build an impression that things are, or are going to be, better. Some years ago, I recall Soren linking me a clip from one of Viktor Frankl's presentations. This one:

I like the video not because Frankl had discovered some unique fundamental truth. What he says is really quite obvious, in the end. But what I love about it is his style, how he presents it. His obvious excitement about this. It spreads. And when I realized how his excitement spread to me, it dawned to me; Holy shit, that's what it's about!

But negativity and pessimism also spread. It's not a good marketing line to get prospects DMs to say that it's a sinking ship, and needs all the desperate help it can get, so forth. It's not.

It's a great ship and like all great ships, it occasionally sails into a storm. But since I trust it to have, in the end, a fairly competent crew, I'm going to put my bet on it clearing that storm.

So, peccavi summed some things up that we can look into changing. Right now, we are going to focus on the EE and the NCE: EE, though we'll continue with sorting some loot issues out. There are also things that we can talk of regarding server culture among devs (and I'm sure DMs feel likewise), but you have to understand that even if a pain point is correctly identified, it takes time to fix it. It's a subtle process. People don't change by telling them to change. To change, people need two things; Motivation and examples. They need motivation to want to change and they need examples to know what they can change to. We need to motivate each other to be better.

[Ehver]

Exordium, while I agree with much of what you say, I think some of it is unfair and dismissive. A lot of people have had building frustrations for a long, long time - myself included. This isn't people jumping to pessimism at the first sign of adversity.

A lot of us - myself included - are very tired, and feel very powerless despite having the best of intentions and sinking years of our lives into a server we love. We aren't trying to spread doom and gloom - we're trying to express the fact that we've been discontent with these problems for a long time and that this CERTAINLY isn't the first time these worries have been voiced.

Though you may not share our opinions or experiences, please do not paint us as impatient people throwing our arms up in defeat at the drop of a hat.

[emptyanima]

I've held off replying for a bit but I wanted to respond.

I am currently a player, though I have formerly been on the Community Council and on the DM Team. I completely agree that more openness between players and DMs is something to be encouraged, from both sides.

I can tell you that I spent a lot of time as a DM and on the CC talking at length with players to help mediate issues and solve problems.
I can tell you that current DMs also do this (especially Arawn, who dedicates time as a developer and a DM, and is active on the PoTM Discord, getting involved in discussions in the open channels and with players in private if needed).

I can tell you that the DM team, who are volunteers doing so on their free time, often receive many requests via Discord PMs, forum PMs and threads and endeavour to respond to all of them. I can tell you that I spent more time dedicated to admin/dealing with requests/player issues than running events, often because the energy spent on resolving issues etc. made it difficult to run anything afterwards.

I can tell you that while the DMs cannot always respond perfectly (being human), most of the negative experiences I have had playing on this server I love have come about because of fellow players. I'm not going to go into detail, but some of the things I've seen (from players long-since banned) have had me in actual tears.

DMing on PoTM is quite something. I would like to return to it, because when you can help to tell stories and see how events and interactions play out, it can be so rewarding. But it can also be a source of frustration (which I am sure is not a surprise).

DMing on PoTM also requires self-sacrifice. For reasons I can entirely understand, DMs are not permitted to have PCs involved in supported factions, and are strongly discouraged to engage in antagonistic play on their PCs. The DM's role is to support player stories and not their own. As I am sure you can imagine, most players who commit themselves to DMing are also the same sort of players who get involved in factions and driving stories on their PCs, and they do so out of love for the server.

This has a lot of bearing on why some DMs take breaks to go playerside. In addition, the amount of planning and work that goes into running events, particularly large-scale events, is huge. Often, after pulling off a big plot or three, DMs need a break to recharge their batteries and will either step down or take a break.

So, in sum, DMs have to be players who;

- Are willing and able to deal with player requests, issues and OOC conflicts (at times while trying to run events simultaneously)
- Are willing to step back from faction and antagonistic roleplay while actively DMing.
- Are creatively minded and want to support players in telling great stories.
- Are knowledgeable about the setting.
- Are willing to dedicate a lot of time to a server they love.

It's a big ask, and while rewarding as I stated above, demands a lot from individual DMs.  There is a reason why DMs burn out.

But the server culture has improved over recent years. The Discord has been something of a two-edged sword, because while having that openness, ability to quickly communicate to the playerbase and a place to plan with factions, it has also meant we 'see' a lot more of each other OOC. We have more disagreements, more conflicts over the meaning of a typed message that may or may not have been sent with the intent you ascribe.

We need to remember that we are all here out of a mutual love of storytelling, the setting, and sharing a wonderful hobby with others. We need to remember that while at times we may disagree with each other, we are all human beings behind our keyboards.

This is a creative, caring, sometimes chaotic community, and there are many reasons it's continued for so long.

Let's not lose sight of why we're here while having these discussions. Let's not throw out big accusations and try to sow discord with each other, because that won't get us anywhere.

Let's remember PoTM's cardinal rule.



(Edited for typos)

[Mailbox-2100]

   You keep referring to this person you seem to think is me, and not me. I don't know who this person in 2013 is, Exordium.

What you are experiencing from me as negativity, is 7+ years of experience. If I saw things changing for the better- BELIEVE ME. I'd be sunshine & rainbows.
I'll say this: the fact this thread hasn't become locked is testament (to me)  of growth on the community as a whole's behalf.

Spoiler: show

Thats good! Great! Excellennnnnt!

[abyssal_wyrm]

From what I can see, 4 years withdrawn from this server, is that you're running into the same problems that ebb and flow with any large playerbase: Fear of Missed Opportunity [FOMO], Toxicity, Stagnation. Know that this is not unique to POTM, or unique to this moment in time. You are expressing this because it has always in some form been present. It is simply the "Haves" and the "Have Nots" that change; someone who may be singing praises this year may become a doomsayer the next. That does not make either of their opinions invalid at the time they are having them.

People will have very different opinions and experiences of the same server based on many factors.

1. What time zone they are in/when they can play
2. How often they can play/how much time they have
3. Who they play with , if they are comfortable speaking OOCly with players
4. The type of person they are and the types of characters they like to play.
5. What they are looking for in a server.

All of this will lead to the feeling of missing out , or 'having' at different times, depending. If you play 8 hours a day, in peak times, with DM or CC players, in a faction, and seek validation through your characters actions you will have a totally different experience than someone who can play 6 hours a week, in off peak times, with whoever else is on, solo, who just wants to have some RP intruige or go to a dungeon.

The trick is not to invalidate anyone else's opinion of the server, or blow it off, because it is different than your own. What I have learned in my time here, and my time away from here, is that ultimately, No. It is not the server's job to mold in a way that suits the individual. That's lucidrous. If an individual does not 'jive' with what the server wants to be, then that individual ultimately has two choices

1. Keep the negativity to a minimum, offer suggestions but ultimately, shut up and play. Try to have fun
2. Keep the negativity to a minimum, realize that the server may not jive with what you want it to be and if the concessions would be too much to make, play somewhere else.


BUT!
BUT BUT BUT: this becomes different when a -sizable portion of long time players- start to make the same complaints. At that point, I believe that DMs, Developers, and administrators blowing players off in a way that states "This has happened before and will happen again" speaks to the stagnation that happens to every server but seems to be prevalent with this one. It does no one any benefit to ignore them. There is only a benefit to be gained from taking each and every post here into consideration and using it to become better.

Dev/Admin team; You have something unique here that keeps people, even people that are seriously troubled by the state of the server, or have a love hate relationship with it , coming back , trying to help you. You also have a unique 'problem' in that you must pair the more generalized stagnation of DM down time with the personalized 'stagnation' of a setting that is very -very- reluctant to change, and an administrative team that can (sometimes? Maybe? If we're 100% fair here?) take the 'no changing ever' thing a bit too far for the comfort of a playerbase who wants to make a mark on their beloved server.

 I'm speaking to you as a -banned player-, who -cannot- have a horse in this race. I want to see you succeed. I'm imploring you to listen to your people and take them into consideration. They want you to, you serve your best interests to do it; become the place they all love to play.

And as to the too few DMs issue. Remember, everyone can grow. Not everyone is the same person they were one, three, ten years ago. Some people have spent -decades- playing this game. Some people have -learned how to socialize- playing this game. Some people have gone through crisis or changes of identity, of friendship, of relationship, and of other very human natures, playing this game. No one stays the same forever. People grow; and you serve no one by holding to an outdated opinion of anyone. Give people a chance to grow, and give them the benefit of the doubt by seeing that they have.  I've personally made good friends with people I couldn't even imagine -talking- to a few years back by doing just this.

As to the gossip/confidentality issue:
Every server does it. Every human does it. If not on a forum then in a skype, or a discord, or a facebook message, or over a voice chat. Don't be surprised when it happens, and don't be surprised when DMs and admins are just humans; rather than a company that owes you some benefit of adhering to public relations standards. With that said. Strive to excellence and to [guitar riff] be excellent to each other:

Extend an olive branch. If you feel you've wronged someone in the past, apologize. It's extremely liberating , if nothing else.
If you feel like you could help someone in some way, offer your help politely.
If you feel like someone has learned, or grown, or become better in some way? Let them know you're proud of them.

These words go a long way.

To that extent - I am sorry to anyone I have wronged here.

I hope that these words are taken to heart, and seen for as coming from the place of love that I mean them to.


tl;dr; have a conversation, do not shun the conversation. Learn and Grow together  in a way that nourishes, not separates. Be what your players want you to be, but players , accept what the server is in a give and take.  Everyone has something to offer, and everyone means this place well or they wouldn't be here.

~IDreamofDaleks/IllusoryWitch

[Exordium]

Exordium, while I agree with much of what you say, I think some of it is unfair and dismissive. A lot of people have had building frustrations for a long, long time - myself included. This isn't people jumping to pessimism at the first sign of adversity.

I don't mean to be dismissive, but the thing is that even after you've met adversity time and time again, you still have to expect for things to become better. That's how things change.

A lot of us - myself included - are very tired, and feel very powerless despite having the best of intentions and sinking years of our lives into a server we love. We aren't trying to spread doom and gloom - we're trying to express the fact that we've been discontent with these problems for a long time and that this CERTAINLY isn't the first time these worries have been voiced.

Though you may not share our opinions or experiences, please do not paint us as impatient people throwing our arms up in defeat at the drop of a hat.

In my opening line to the post you refer to, I said referenced these concerns being voiced 5 years ago. They are voiced every year, several times every year.

I am very aware of them, but the truth is, I can't really do too much about them. A large part of them are perceptions that are difficult to change.

One thing I do know, is that I am more motivated to do dev work when people don't spread too much doom and gloom. And I also know that the more effort devs and DMs see to the server, the further we go from any real doom and gloom scenario.

You don't know what all I actually agree to here. Even if you were totally right in everything you say, I still do not believe that it's a good idea for a DM or a dev to chime in and say, "know what? everything said is right". After that, we'd have a lot of new problems but still no actual solution to them. We hope for solutions, not problems.

   You keep referring to this person you seem to think is me, and not me. I don't know who this person in 2013 is, Exordium.

Okay, come to Discord, lets talk and clear it up.

I'll say this: the fact this thread hasn't become locked is testament (to me)  of growth on the community as a whole's behalf.

Personally I think we've locked and moved threads a little too easily in recent times, but I think it's mainly due to somewhat lower moderator activity. Locking a thread is easier than defusing it.

Because I see some validity in some things claimed here, if only on the level of perceptions, I, when looking this over, chose to put considerable time - by now, several hours - in writing long, throughout answers rather than locking or moving some posts, which I think would not have been entirely unrealistic to do either. I could have used this time to flesh out new items for the server which is a project I have going now, or I could have continued on the web programming tutorial for PoTMers, or anything of the sort. But I think the time is better spent here now.

I'm going to make a post here to air my opinion, knowing that
1. This account will be banned as soon as I do
2. This post will very likely be deleted.

If that happens, it's because you're ban-circumventing, not because of the content of your post now.

[Aduial]

I. On Leveling & RP XP
Leveling is one of the largest issues encountered by new and veteran players alike. Running into a “hard cap” is a common occurrence on the server, which is often discouraging. It can take one to two months to hit level ten, which is acceptable. However, leveling hits a point of absurdity when it can take over a year to reach level twenty. For casual players, or players that do not have much time to commit to the server, the leveling process can take 3 – 6 months to hit a level of ten. This severely penalizes people for having outside commitments.

I have nothing against slow leveling, but it has become so slow that it is now an issue, the growth of your character is a part of the fun and this point can't be forgotten.

As the system currently stands, it encourages players to level until the point of hard cap, and then to set the character aside until the cap is gone due to the extremely low amount of RP XP that is currently handed out. When I first began on the server, RP XP was enough to hit level three within the span of one evening (roughly three to five hours) of nonstop roleplay. This is now impossible to achieve due to the RP XP nerf from some years ago. This implementation essentially punishes players for roleplaying, rather than dungeoning. To me, this is unacceptable. While I understand that dungeoning should be worth more XP than roleplaying, this is still a roleplaying server and RP XP should be more prominently rewarded. This is most damaging, again, to players with a limited play time, once more penalizing people for having outside commitments.


Another notable nerf of recent months is that of the delivery run XP nerfs. The XP on these has gone from reaching level three within the span of approximately six ‘Krofburg Mining Equipment’ runs, to that of thirteen or more. Considering the time and gold that goes into these, it should not have been nerfed.

I totally agree with these two points

II. On Loot
Another contentious topic is that of loot. Our loot tables have been bogged down by items for “RP flair,” or un-usable gear that is lovingly referred to as “vendor trash.” Let me begin by addressing the prominence of “RP flair” items. These seem to be the most often found items during dungeon runs currently. These are things such as random herbs, spices, useless gems/jewelry, foods, and so forth. Firstly, it is immersion breaking to find a fresh potato or a piece of woundwart within crypts that decades old. Secondly, the ratio of risk to reward is negligible. For these items, you’re likely to receive some XP (perhaps even the illustrious hard cap previously mentioned) and a one to three gp a piece for each of these “RP flair” items. While having “RP flair” items isn’t inherently a bad thing, the issue comes when most of the loot happens to be a 70/30 mix of these items and “vendor trash” items.

Agreed the loot table should be revised, but I understand that the thing is a work in progress, so I guess we should wait.

With that said, gear deemed as “good,” most notably that for rogues, has become increasingly hard to come by. On top of the issue of leveling is that of gearing a character up. “Good” items now have an outrageous price associated with them. There is also a huge divide in where and how gear is acquired for each class. For example, a cleric may become fully geared with all necessary items in Barovia alone, while a rogue is forced to travel to multiple domains to acquire a set of gear to achieve a decent (55+) Hide/MS.

I am playing a rogue character so i fully understand what you mean, however is not one of the main problems, at least for me, but I understand that we are speaking of a matter of fairness.

As an aside, the mix of finding adequate loot and the difficulty leveling is likely why we’re seeing a dramatic reduction in antagonistic characters as well as the closuring of characters. Very few people want to spend the time and energy investing in a character only to see them permanently closured.

That is quite obvious, but well said none the less

III. A Note on the Playerbase
Now onto a topic that is often sidestepped, if not outright ignored – that of the playerbase. While many people will say, “Well negativity/toxicity comes along with any NWN server,” it is unacceptable to turn a blind eye to some of what occurs on PotM. Before anyone points out my own behavior, the players themselves have bred an environment where hostility, gossip, and underhanded attacks are acceptable, if not outright applauded. I am unable to give direct examples of this without breaching trust or confidence.

I can't say I have witnessed these things so much to the point that I can see them as an issue, but I trust you are in  good faith here.

PotM is also known as one of the most difficult servers to get involved in within the NWN community. Cliques and ostracism are common for new players, with veterans often ignoring new players and refusing to assist them. I often use multiple handles on PotM, and the difference is striking with how people treat me when they know who I am, and when they do not.

This, in my opinion, is one of the greatest problems of the server
 

The amount of vitriol spewed between players is astounding. Unfortunately, a server culture is not easily changed, thus I have little recommendations for how this can be altered.

No it will not be easy to change this, but it is not impossible if everyone does his part.

IV. On DMs, Plots, & Change
PotM has a distinct lack of active DMs. While many servers have a DM ratio of one to every fifteen players, PotM has much less than that. This leads to a lack of ongoing intrigue and lowers the number of things a player, especially a new player, can become involved with. This on top of the aforementioned lack of PC antagonists leads to player boredom and disinterest. It has also become essentially impossible for many people to become DMs. For example, I have personally been told to not bother applying to the DM team again even though I was once a DM on PotM. This has occurred to other players interested in becoming DMs as well. I would suggest the administration team allow a wider array of people to join the DM team, regardless of their own personal opinions on said players.

I totally agree with that too, the server needs more DM, some good players applied in the past, the staff should give them at least one occasion to prove their skills.

Regarding DM plots, while I am aware that PotM is not a PW and that many large changes can not take place in order for the team to retain the integrity of the Ravenloft canon. For example, in the previous Dementlieu revolution ran by former DM Dread, nothing the players could have done would have allowed for them to change the dark lord away from d’Honaire. In order to stymie the feeling of futility, I would suggest DMs work with custom NPCs or organizations instead where players are allowed to make an actual change. Change goes hand in hand with this. Currently, players are unable to change the setting. The creation of organizations, groups, and player goals are often sidelined in order to, once again, protect the integrity of the Ravenloft canon. Allowing groups to claim abandoned buildings (e.g., the abandoned fishing lodge) and letting them fix it up would add an extra level of commitment and excitement to the server, rather than the usual static areas and roleplay that dominates PotM.

And I agree with this point too, if we have the server a bit more dynamic I am sure players will be more interested creating plots and goals, wich are generally quite lacking.

As you see peccavi, I basically agree with 90% of what you said, my first language is not english so I want to thank you for the time and effort you did in order to give words to what is basically even my whole idea of the server situation.

[Ehver]

Exordium, while I agree with much of what you say, I think some of it is unfair and dismissive. A lot of people have had building frustrations for a long, long time - myself included. This isn't people jumping to pessimism at the first sign of adversity.

I don't mean to be dismissive, but the thing is that even after you've met adversity time and time again, you still have to expect for things to become better. That's how things change.

A lot of us - myself included - are very tired, and feel very powerless despite having the best of intentions and sinking years of our lives into a server we love. We aren't trying to spread doom and gloom - we're trying to express the fact that we've been discontent with these problems for a long time and that this CERTAINLY isn't the first time these worries have been voiced.

Though you may not share our opinions or experiences, please do not paint us as impatient people throwing our arms up in defeat at the drop of a hat.

In my opening line to the post you refer to, I said referenced these concerns being voiced 5 years ago. They are voiced every year, several times every year.

Things don't always change just by maintaining an optimistic outlook. I disagree with you there. The point is that (completely ignoring the server is dying argument, which does indeed occur cyclically) many of these complaints have been voiced regularly, but nothing has been done to improve matters. And after being faced with the same problems, frustrations, and disappointments for YEARS, that original enthusiasm and optimism begins to wear off.

Telling us that we aren't going to get anywhere without plastering on a smile and saying everything with cheerleader pompoms in hand is very dismissive of everything we have experienced and the issues we're trying to discuss.

We love this server. We wouldn't still be here if we didn't. But there are problems that need to be taken seriously, and  telling us to just be optimistic isn't any way to answer our concerns.

Again, these frustrations haven't blossomed overnight, and this is not the first time they've been voiced. Eventually they need to be addressed in a concrete fashion.

[Chabxxu]

Things won't get better until this changes:

Why? Because people are SO. DARN. NEGATIVE. Almost everyone. Almost all the time. About everything. The amount of misinformation, rumour-mongering,and downright sh*t-spewing that goes on in recent days is utterly jaw dropping. I can’t talk to a single person without hearing conspiracy theories about this or that, about how who-and-who is a whiny meta-gamer, how so-and-so is the pet of a DM and gets special treatment, how such-and-such is a powergaming stomper out to ruin everyone’s fun. So much of it is so short-sighted and obviously biased that all it would take is reaching a hand out to your fellow player or DM to clear up the misunderstanding. But people are quick to grab their pitch-forks and make a devil out of anyone who isn’t in their “in” group.

Could hardly have explained it better than that

[bocian]

Let's remember PoTM's cardinal rule.

From my previous post:

Per rules, any sort of „personal attacks” are forbidden. Any sort of criticism, even the slightest and most cultured form of disagreement between people (I mean, criticism towards players, not the server as a whole), is eventually culled and silenced by the moderation on the grounds of personal attack, quoting that community members should be „excellent to each other”. This is, putting the matter straightforwardly, generating a form of an echo chamber, where only positive and praising comments, sometimes getting dangerously close to inanity, are allowed and encouraged.
(...)
While we should strive to keep it on meritorical terms – completely banning personal arguments from public forums will only lead to such underhandedness and „gossiping” escalating even more. When the public discussion is removed and its continuation banned, the problem does not disappear, but instead it's taken to more secretive and remote medium, where it has much less chance of being actually resolved. In real life, people disagree with each other, argue, fight, but eventually resolve their problem - if they engage in a discussion. While the participants might not fully accept each others' beliefs, they can, and very often do find a consensus and come to a mutual understanding.

[Iridni Ren]

In an ideal world, we all can learn how to make arguments without turning them personal. I don't have any problem with a moderation policy that enforces this fairly.

In fact, having a forum (and community) that could accomplish this ideal would be meritorious in and of itself in its educational function aside from our enjoyment of RP and a gothic horror environment in game.

It's true that when anything is suppressed in one place it will tend to leak to another place like dammed water.

Nevertheless and regardless of whether we fall short of the ideal, there's nothing wrong with always trying to improve the way we treat each other. Excellent can, after all, mean a lot of things as it's a pretty subjective term

An excellent teacher, for example, does more than simply praise good behavior.