Suggestion - Make Wiki Main Source for Information

[Ehver]

With the transition to EE on the horizon and the prospect of attracting both new and returning players on its heels, I think it would be a wise use of resources to expand the Wiki with updated, condensed, and organized information that is currently scattered across various threads, posts, pages, topics, and sub-topics throughout the forums.

I cannot speak for anyone else, but personally, I find the forums nearly impossible to use when it comes to finding relevant information on a topic that is not currently "hot". Despite using these forums for the better part of 6 years, I have not managed to master the convoluted channels in which useful information is shared, and I surely haven't the slightest idea how to get the search function to work in any passable fashion. In general, I do not think forums are particularly well-suited as a place to post rules and general resource information. Forums are a place to discuss, to converse, to share a discourse - all of which are great in their own right, but not necessarily helpful for someone looking for a quick bullet-list that they can skim in a time of need. Having to wade through pages of discussion, in which half the server chimes in with their personal opinion, can be frustrating when you just want to get to the point. And having that information split and buried in various topics and sub-topics when the search function isn't well-tuned only makes matters more difficult. I feel like the forums are an excellent place for community discussion, but are too unwieldy and bogged down as a place to set down rules and resources.

I would love to see the Wiki becoming a more "official" space where pertinent information can be easily found and summarized. I feel like doing so would not only be helpful for long-existing players, but it would be a huge boon to new players who are less familiar with the forums and more likely to get lost along the way.

My suggestion, therefore, is that rules and official RP resources and/or guides should be condensed and transferred to the Wiki and that, furthermore, future rules and RP resources and/or guides should be posted to the Wiki FIRST, and can be discussed on the forums as usual, with perhaps a link to the Wiki in a thread.

I'm pleased to see that this seems to be happening more often of late, but I think that expanding those efforts would be a worthwhile use of resources in preparation for the future.

I hope that no one responds to this suggestion with "the Wiki is free for everyone to use, so you can do this yourself!" If this is the case, then I can only say that I appreciate your enthusiasm, and while I certainly wouldn't mind committing some time here and there towards doing so, it isn't my intention to continually scour the forums for updated information to feed the Wiki as a solo-effort.

[Exordium]

I agree that some information is very hard to find. For example, if you're a relatively new player (or even established player with a poor memory, like myself) and are rolling a Barovian, it's pretty likely you wont be aware of the recent'ish thing with Lyssa von Zarovich, even though it would be expected that most Barovians would have heard of this. Having a wiki pages about server-specific history for Barovia and other domains would be very useful.

I know it isn't a satisfying answer, but ultimately it's down to someone going through the initial effort of adding server history and the like to the wiki. In my opinion, we should however pay mind to only adding information that is expected to be known by characters and players. Information that is relatively easy or fruitful to find out IC should be kept IC, since the very act of seeking that information creates interaction and makes for a good roleplaying experience.

[Folly]

I hopefully will try to organize and add to the wiki. I believe in a good aesthetic and methodical organization, however I've really no good experience in wiki/wikias.

I too do not like scrambled hard to find information.

[Arawn]

Indeed, this is a good and worthy endeavor, but it's a question of time--we invite the whole community to pitch in and make sure our wiki has all the content you'd like to see on it.

[modderpunk]

as for the search function here on the forum. I think it is best to check in which thread you are when you try the search. If you want to search as broad as possible you have to be in Ravenloft: Prisoners of the mist>> only otherwise you only search the section you are in at the moment

[Iridni Ren]

I've figured out how to use the Search function pretty well, but what I've run into more is that practice doesn't always match what's stated on the forum--especially for older posts.

Over time custom and current DM interpretation takes precedence.

Part of this is that some DMs (and authorities like Soren and Bluebomber) are more detached than in the old days. Part of it is for old content you don't know whether the person who stated it was an actual authority. Or a conclusion was never reached.

As an example, I recently observed a discussion about the paladin guidelines in which the consensus was that those guidelines were completely deprecated.

[Arawn]

Not deprecated, just not from 3E. Meph’s working on a revised set, I believe, to bring them up to date.

[ViktorYouFool]

I'm just going to second this in general, with the addition that once we switch to EE I'd love to see the PotM wiki also include the information about the mechanics for the core game as well. For instance, when trying to look up feat information it's frustrating if you don't already have an encyclopedic knowledge of which feats came from where and what from where and which might have been changed.

It'd also be nice to see things like the application rules, forms, subrace data that is publicly available, all of that to be posted somewhere. The stuff people really need to know when trying to make a character.

if you're a relatively new player (or even established player with a poor memory, like myself) and are rolling a Barovian, it's pretty likely you wont be aware of the recent'ish thing with Lyssa von Zarovich, even though it would be expected that most Barovians would have heard of this.

This is the exact reason that despite my curiosity about port, I will likely never have a port-oriented character. I can't even keep track of the stuff that's happening in the last six months Ive been actively playing the server, let alone all of the nonsense that happened in the space between where the gazeteer left off and now.

[McNastea]

People talk a lot about wanting the wiki to include this and that, the fact is, as people have said, that what he wiki says is reliant on people updating it. On the first big hak update myself and a handful of others spent a lot of time making sure that happened. While the wiki still survives, it seems like most people want it to simply update without realizing it isn't going to do it on it's own. The dev team doesn't do it, the dm team doesn't do it, the CC doesn't do it - no one on the RL team has any official capacity on the wiki.

The wiki is simply a place where the -players- add all the information about the server. I really don't have the time I used to have in order to make that happen and if the wiki isn't updating as you'd like to see it do so then I'd say the others who were originally involved haven't either.

It's a wiki, if there's something you want to see on there then by all means, add it. No one asked me to add barbarian pages, I took what was posted on the forum and made them in to cohesive pages on the wiki so people would easily see and understand them. The same goes for all the spells, feats and classes. Players took their own time and initiative to see this information added.

If you want it added, do it. If you don't have time to, that's understandable - I certainly don't. It's the hurdle that the wiki is facing at the moment - how to remain relevant without anyone willing or able to update it. Thing is, anyone can... I would encourage anyone who does have the time and urge to put it in. You will likely not ever be recognized or appreciated for it, but it's a living wiki - growing with every update, so long as the players themselves continue to contribute to it far past those who originally did so.

[Nemesis 24]

I really do need to figure out how to contribute to the Wiki.

I must admit there are things up above that would absolutely make sense to be included in the Wiki as either 'Major Changes to the Lore' or 'Recent Events'.  It would be a list of entries that would describe the War of Copper Knives, the Revolution of Port, Lyssa's short lived reign, the Drow attack on the Blue Water, events that have had long reaching consequences.  People would be able to add them and edit them as needed.  I admit most of these major events I am rather ignorant on myself, when IC I probably shouldn't be.

[Arawn]

As McNastea said—I think people are missing what a wiki is! You think certain info belongs there, add it!

[APorg]

Opposition to creating an IC timeline usually falls foul of the "FOIC" argument. Personally I think there can be a happy medium where some sense of server history and continuity is helped by having generally known events while having all the details to be FOIC.

[Exordium]

Opposition to creating an IC timeline usually falls foul of the "FOIC" argument. Personally I think there can be a happy medium where some sense of server history and continuity is helped by having generally known events while having all the details to be FOIC.

I haven't heard any reasonable opposition for this to be honest. Even DM and Dev members have been meaning to collect a sort of a timeline for the server events.

It's just about someone actually doing it. Of course we wont include information that wouldn't be known to the common man, but anything that is reasonable for the average person to know is alright to include to the wiki. This includes brief overlooks of Zeklos history, Blue Bell massacre, the Port revolution, et cetera.

[Arawn]

Opposition to creating an IC timeline usually falls foul of the "FOIC" argument. Personally I think there can be a happy medium where some sense of server history and continuity is helped by having generally known events while having all the details to be FOIC.

Indeed, by definition, if it’s major enough that new characters would know it (Wachter, etc) then it’s no longer FOIC.

[APorg]

Alright then, I'll get us started.

http://nwnravenloft.wikia.com/wiki/IC_Timeline

[Exordium]

Oh, also, I don't personally think people need to be too worried about something being edited out or adding something that is not actually very noteworthy..

Once there's enough to get started with, wiki moderators (that is, devs and DMs) can prune articles. If someone accidentally writes something that gets deleted by a mod, it's no biggie, it happens with projects like this.

[Arawn]

Oh, also, I don't personally think people need to be too worried about something being edited out or adding something that is not actually very noteworthy..

Once there's enough to get started with, wiki moderators (that is, devs and DMs) can prune articles. If someone accidentally writes something that gets deleted by a mod, it's no biggie, it happens with projects like this.

This, exactly.