Detailed List of New Feats - Hak Update (2)

[EO]

-Added Elemental Shape and Primeval Wild Shape.

[Ken14]

I'm loving the two new feats for druids, but I do have my doubts:

Elemental Essence
1d6 extra damage + resistance? Sweet! But that duration, though...You'd need to be level 10 to get even a tenth the duration of your average varnish. And druids only get 5 uses of wildshape, with no way of increasing it. Maybe up the duration to turns/level? Giving more uses of wild shapes ( through feat or otherwhise) might work as well.

I'm curious though, will you be able to apply this while in animal shape?

Primeval Shape
THIS. ALL OF THIS. I love shapeshifting to fight, and this'll give an edge, for sure. Though, even with the extra strength, it won't do too much. Wild shape animal forms (even the dire ones) do mediocre damage and piercing at that.

Maybe add a cold damage buff as well? If the elemental essence stacks with it, then it'll certainly turn you into an elemental beast! Pun fully intended.



Also, yes, more shapes and/or pets choices would be awesome.

At any rate, keep up the good work, developers. Loving all the effort that goes into all this.

[Ercvadasz]

Hm the new single weapon fighting compared to the Shield Parry is...welll not that good.

I got my ranger with all the feat requirements for allmost all of the new feats.
I usually walk with him using a single handed medium or small weapon, when he is required to fight melee.

He has TWD and ITWD, funny thing is the bonuses still apply as long as you are NOT using a shield. So currently with 25 parry he can get 5 AC and +2 from ITWD.
Now let us see how this turns out with the new feats:
-Shield Parry Gets +4 AC due to the ACP from the shield reducing it to 23 of course can counter it with a single parry item so let us go with +5 as well. Add to it the shields +2 (large shield) and a random priests magic vestment say of +3/+4....and wow...
-New TWD feat: out of range 19 dex requirementis just too much....also rangers do not receive it for free like the other two feats.
-The duelist path seems quite intriguing and welcoming however, 3 feats for a ranger is too much especially considering that the prerequisite is already weapon finesse.(still dont understand why this is a prereq!) Which effectively makes it 4 feats. You do get dodge bonus which seems decent, however flat footedness is still troublesome, and not to mention, my char would get the full bonus...so basicly +8.

So considering all these a chain shirt wearing ranger still can get about....+11/12 AC from shield parry.

Shield parry in comparision to the other two is just...WAY TOO OP. Not to mention prereq is 15 dex only?
So for TWD to get the +3 bonus you need 3 feats. For duelist bonuses you need 4 feats. Also for both the required abilities.
For shield just 15 dex and get a huge boost to your AC?
I see this as something that is VERY good for rogues, rangers and bards...and elven clerics/paladins.

The new feats are nice touch but shield parry is just too OP.

[EO]

-Shield Parry Gets +4 AC due to the ACP from the shield reducing it to 23 of course can counter it with a single parry item so let us go with +5 as well. Add to it the shields +2 (large shield) and a random priests magic vestment say of +3/+4....and wow...

No, the max Parry that can be counted pre-ACP is 30, so when using a large shield, you can't get more than 22 Parry after ACP to calculate the AC you get, so your max AC from a large shield + varnishes + Parry is 10 (2 Base + 4 from Varnish + 4 from Parry). There's another thread with more specific information about the most recent Parry changes. In comparison a two-weapon character would be able to get 9 AC total with the feats (3 from feats, 6 from Parry if they hit 30 Parry and use leather armor), same for a one-handed character.

[EO]

-Although not a new feat, we will be bringing Imp Expertise more in line with PnP and add a BAB 6+ requirement to it.

[Jamila]

I'm loving the two new feats for druids, but I do have my doubts:

Elemental Essence
1d6 extra damage + resistance? Sweet! But that duration, though...You'd need to be level 10 to get even a tenth the duration of your average varnish. And druids only get 5 uses of wildshape, with no way of increasing it. Maybe up the duration to turns/level? Giving more uses of wild shapes ( through feat or otherwhise) might work as well.

Could be worse. You could only get it for only 2 rounds like all the new monk stuff. 

[EO]

I'm loving the two new feats for druids, but I do have my doubts:

Elemental Essence
1d6 extra damage + resistance? Sweet! But that duration, though...You'd need to be level 10 to get even a tenth the duration of your average varnish. And druids only get 5 uses of wildshape, with no way of increasing it. Maybe up the duration to turns/level? Giving more uses of wild shapes ( through feat or otherwhise) might work as well.

I'm curious though, will you be able to apply this while in animal shape?

I'm not 100% sure whether it will be useable in wild shape form but you can use it before switching. I'll also change the duration to turns/level but capping at 10 like Elephant's Hide since you get so few uses of it in the first place.

Primeval Shape
THIS. ALL OF THIS. I love shapeshifting to fight, and this'll give an edge, for sure. Though, even with the extra strength, it won't do too much. Wild shape animal forms (even the dire ones) do mediocre damage and piercing at that.

Maybe add a cold damage buff as well? If the elemental essence stacks with it, then it'll certainly turn you into an elemental beast! Pun fully intended.



Also, yes, more shapes and/or pets choices would be awesome.

At any rate, keep up the good work, developers. Loving all the effort that goes into all this.

There's also Savage Mobility that already provides a 20% movement speed increase. I don't know if there are other feats that provide boosts to wild shape in PnP though. We may at a later point add more shapes for druids and shifters down the road.

[EO]

-Added Hawk's Vision, Expanded Aura of Courage, Sacred Vitality, Shield Maiden's Grace.

[Silas Rotleaf]

You know, I haven't noticed much new feats for rogues... did my eye skip it or are they lacking a bit in new goodies as compared to the other classes which received their overhaul?

[Ercvadasz]

-Shield Parry Gets +4 AC due to the ACP from the shield reducing it to 23 of course can counter it with a single parry item so let us go with +5 as well. Add to it the shields +2 (large shield) and a random priests magic vestment say of +3/+4....and wow...

No, the max Parry that can be counted pre-ACP is 30, so when using a large shield, you can't get more than 22 Parry after ACP to calculate the AC you get, so your max AC from a large shield + varnishes + Parry is 10 (2 Base + 4 from Varnish + 4 from Parry). There's another thread with more specific information about the most recent Parry changes. In comparison a two-weapon character would be able to get 9 AC total with the feats (3 from feats, 6 from Parry if they hit 30 Parry and use leather armor), same for a one-handed character.

Ok just noticed the ACP changes thread.

[Grendlykins, Simp of Azalin Rex]

Just noticed this; the feat Shared Fury doesn't offer up an alternative option for the feat Wolverine's Rage previously added in the last slew of hak feat updates. Perhaps make it compatible with that also, as an alternative to taking barbarian levels and as further incentive to taking the Wolverine's Rage feat?

[EO]

Just noticed this; the feat Shared Fury doesn't offer up an alternative option for the feat Wolverine's Rage previously added in the last slew of hak feat updates. Perhaps make it compatible with that also, as an alternative to taking barbarian levels and as further incentive to taking the Wolverine's Rage feat?

Good idea. Will change it.

[EO]

-Added Necromantic Presence, Necromantic Might and Sacred Boost

-Also reworked some feats slightly (changed requirement for Bonetti from Weapon Finesse to Expertise to more closely match the PnP's version of a similar feat).

[Grendlykins, Simp of Azalin Rex]

For the three charisma/influence based Fighter feats, I'd suggest for the earliest two adding some kind of scaling to them. Perhaps additional bonuses that scale off Influence ranks and Fighter levels. Their efficacy severely drops off as you increase in level, such that even at the levels they're available they're not particularly amazing; nice, but not worth a feat I'd say. Adding that scaling encourages further development of a character in that avenue while also providing a tangible benefit to having the feat in the first place.

On Unorthodox Flurry; could it be expanded to include Quarterstaves which are a staple of D&D Monks? The weapon itself only deals d6 bludgeoning damage and is a large category weapon, hence you can't dual wield them and they don't deal staggering amounts of damage.

Finally; a lot of the aura-type spells or AOE effects don't have ranges listed, which are important.

[EO]

On Unorthodox Flurry; could it be expanded to include Quarterstaves which are a staple of D&D Monks? The weapon itself only deals d6 bludgeoning damage and is a large category weapon, hence you can't dual wield them and they don't deal staggering amounts of damage.

Alas this is hardcoded; that feat is a renamed Disciple of Shou feat. There is also another feat like that that allows Flurry of Blows to work with all melee weapons but we've decided not to add it (Greatsword wielding monk somehow felt wrong).

Finally; a lot of the aura-type spells or AOE effects don't have ranges listed, which are important.

Will add the radius in the description.

Also, added Urban Stealth for stealthers.

[ViktorYouFool]

On Unorthodox Flurry; could it be expanded to include Quarterstaves which are a staple of D&D Monks? The weapon itself only deals d6 bludgeoning damage and is a large category weapon, hence you can't dual wield them and they don't deal staggering amounts of damage.

Alas this is hardcoded; that feat is a renamed Disciple of Shou feat. There is also another feat like that that allows Flurry of Blows to work with all melee weapons but we've decided not to add it (Greatsword wielding monk somehow felt wrong).

Sad! Greatsword monk is a bit odd, but katana monk would be perfect.

[Always_a_hero]

Seems like Bonetti's Defense new requirement (Expertise, Dex 12+, Int 13+) Has not been added on the test serve yet. It's still Weapon Finess, Dex 12+, Int 12+.

It's 14:30 EST at the moment. Just mentioning.

[EO]

Seems like Bonetti's Defense new requirement (Expertise, Dex 12+, Int 13+) Has not been added on the test serve yet. It's still Weapon Finess, Dex 12+, Int 12+.

It's 14:30 EST at the moment. Just mentioning.

That’s normal. We haven’t yet updated the hak on the test server.

Also, I added Profane Boost and made slight changes to Sacred Boost.

[noah25]

I'm loving the two new feats for druids, but I do have my doubts:

Elemental Essence
1d6 extra damage + resistance? Sweet! But that duration, though...You'd need to be level 10 to get even a tenth the duration of your average varnish. And druids only get 5 uses of wildshape, with no way of increasing it. Maybe up the duration to turns/level? Giving more uses of wild shapes ( through feat or otherwhise) might work as well.

I'm curious though, will you be able to apply this while in animal shape?

Primeval Shape
THIS. ALL OF THIS. I love shapeshifting to fight, and this'll give an edge, for sure. Though, even with the extra strength, it won't do too much. Wild shape animal forms (even the dire ones) do mediocre damage and piercing at that.

Maybe add a cold damage buff as well? If the elemental essence stacks with it, then it'll certainly turn you into an elemental beast! Pun fully intended.



Also, yes, more shapes and/or pets choices would be awesome.

At any rate, keep up the good work, developers. Loving all the effort that goes into all this.

Few notes on this:
1) I would assume if elemental essence works in wildshape it would work in elemental shape as well and vise verse? what about shapechange?
2) I love the idea of elemental essence but mechanically I have some concerns.  It just seems really good assuming that it does work in druids or shifters other forms, maybe the resistance and damage should be separate feats. I love druids and love the idea, it just feels like druids got a huge pump in the last update and that this is pretty significant for a single feat.
3) Primeval shape is a really cool idea and will help out pre-level 16 druid out a lot. However, its worth noting it wouldn't really ever get used after 15th.  You end up spending all your time in elemental form, shapechanged, or combat casting and using your wildshape charges on your other cool new abilities .
4) New wiz/sorc feats would be kinda cool. Especially some type of metamagic/arcane defense counter for timestop if possible. Just a thought.
5)If you guys do get around to new shapes I would love to see mist elementals become an elemental option, could open up a lot of room for a half vistani mist hag type of character which i think would be exciting. Also giving the previous elementals more special abilities would be fun. The air elemental gets one and so does the water but not fire or earth. A not powerful rock throw and burning hands respectively could be nice and give some flavor to those forms.

[EO]

Few notes on this:

1) I would assume if elemental essence works in wildshape it would work in elemental shape as well and vise verse? what about shapechange?

It's like any buff; it'll work in whatever shape/form the person is in.

2) I love the idea of elemental essence but mechanically I have some concerns.  It just seems really good assuming that it does work in druids or shifters other forms, maybe the resistance and damage should be separate feats. I love druids and love the idea, it just feels like druids got a huge pump in the last update and that this is pretty significant for a single feat.

I've given it some thought and am comfortable with its power level. Keep in mind that druids get limited uses of wild shape so you can't really stack it forever. It caps at 10 minutes.

3) Primeval shape is a really cool idea and will help out pre-level 16 druid out a lot. However, its worth noting it wouldn't really ever get used after 15th.  You end up spending all your time in elemental form, shapechanged, or combat casting and using your wildshape charges on your other cool new abilities .

Yeah, Primeval works in Greater Wild Shape and Wild shape but not Elemental Shape. Enhance Wild Shape (new spell) and Savage Mobility, though, work in all shapes.

4) New wiz/sorc feats would be kinda cool. Especially some type of metamagic/arcane defense counter for timestop if possible. Just a thought.

Technically they got the whole line of summoning feats. We gave wizards a plethora of new spells last hak update so figured we'd give other classes some love this time around. I'll probably eventually add wizard/sorcerer feats; there are some pretty cool flavourful ones.

5)If you guys do get around to new shapes I would love to see mist elementals become an elemental option, could open up a lot of room for a half vistani mist hag type of character which i think would be exciting. Also giving the previous elementals more special abilities would be fun. The air elemental gets one and so does the water but not fire or earth. A not powerful rock throw and burning hands respectively could be nice and give some flavor to those forms.

I'd have to check if Elemental Shape is modified in Ravenloft but in PnP, it's clarified (and been clarified by WOTC) that Elemental Shape only works for those four elementals. Mist Elemental (Blood, Grave and Pyre too) is essentially a "mist" version of the regular Air Elemental. It would be cool though. At some point we may add more wild shapes but it takes more time to implement those properly so not this time around anyway.

[noah25]

Few notes on this:

1) I would assume if elemental essence works in wildshape it would work in elemental shape as well and vise verse? what about shapechange?

It's like any buff; it'll work in whatever shape/form the person is in.

2) I love the idea of elemental essence but mechanically I have some concerns.  It just seems really good assuming that it does work in druids or shifters other forms, maybe the resistance and damage should be separate feats. I love druids and love the idea, it just feels like druids got a huge pump in the last update and that this is pretty significant for a single feat.

I've given it some thought and am comfortable with its power level. Keep in mind that druids get limited uses of wild shape so you can't really stack it forever. It caps at 10 minutes.

3) Primeval shape is a really cool idea and will help out pre-level 16 druid out a lot. However, its worth noting it wouldn't really ever get used after 15th.  You end up spending all your time in elemental form, shapechanged, or combat casting and using your wildshape charges on your other cool new abilities .

Yeah, Primeval works in Greater Wild Shape and Wild shape but not Elemental Shape. Enhance Wild Shape (new spell) and Savage Mobility, though, work in all shapes.

4) New wiz/sorc feats would be kinda cool. Especially some type of metamagic/arcane defense counter for timestop if possible. Just a thought.

Technically they got the whole line of summoning feats. We gave wizards a plethora of new spells last hak update so figured we'd give other classes some love this time around. I'll probably eventually add wizard/sorcerer feats; there are some pretty cool flavourful ones.

5)If you guys do get around to new shapes I would love to see mist elementals become an elemental option, could open up a lot of room for a half vistani mist hag type of character which i think would be exciting. Also giving the previous elementals more special abilities would be fun. The air elemental gets one and so does the water but not fire or earth. A not powerful rock throw and burning hands respectively could be nice and give some flavor to those forms.

I'd have to check if Elemental Shape is modified in Ravenloft but in PnP, it's clarified (and been clarified by WOTC) that Elemental Shape only works for those four elementals. Mist Elemental (Blood, Grave and Pyre too) is essentially a "mist" version of the regular Air Elemental. It would be cool though. At some point we may add more wild shapes but it takes more time to implement those properly so not this time around anyway.

Well, it all sounds really cool thanks for all the work you guys are doing EO.

[APorg]

Armor Skin
Type of Feat: General
Prerequisite: Fighter 17+, Con 15+, Toughness.
Specifics: The character gains a natural +2 bonus to armor class.
Use: Automatic.

First off I really love that this suggestion has been taken up. Thank you. It's high time pure Fighters got some love and this is a great way to do it!

I've been thinking about the Con 15+ requirement however and I think this is possibly a bit harsh. For Dwarves or any race with +Con, it's a What-I-Was-Going-To-Do-Anyway -- a requirement that's not really an obstacle. For Humans and most races, it requires an investment of one Attribute level-up or spending 2 Attribute points at creation; and for Elves and such with -Con, it represents a serious investment indeed.

Yet I think Human, Elf, etc. Fighters could all benefit from a boost as much as Dwarf Fighters. Thus I would argue for removing or lowering the Con requirement (how about 13? This requires some investment in CON without making it excessively punitive for Elves) and adding a Feat requirement (e.g. Great Fortitude) to make up for it.

[ViktorYouFool]

Armor Skin
Type of Feat: General
Prerequisite: Fighter 17+, Con 15+, Toughness.
Specifics: The character gains a natural +2 bonus to armor class.
Use: Automatic.

First off I really love that this suggestion has been taken up. Thank you. It's high time pure Fighters got some love and this is a great way to do it!

I've been thinking about the Con 15+ requirement however and I think this is possibly a bit harsh. For Dwarves or any race with +Con, it's a What-I-Was-Going-To-Do-Anyway -- a requirement that's not really an obstacle. For Humans and most races, it requires an investment of one Attribute level-up or spending 2 Attribute points at creation; and for Elves and such with -Con, it represents a serious investment indeed.

Yet I think Human, Elf, etc. Fighters could all benefit from a boost as much as Dwarf Fighters. Thus I would argue for removing or lowering the Con requirement (how about 13? This requires some investment in CON without making it excessively punitive for Elves) and adding a Feat requirement (e.g. Great Fortitude) to make up for it.

Agreed on this point. Even just dropping it to 14 would make it easier. You already have to drop a feat and cross-class tumble to get the same AC benefit that tumble would provide alone for other classes.

[booksarefun666]

You can put points into con instead of straight str.

[APorg]

You can put points into con instead of straight str.

Yes, that's literally true. Are you offering a balance counter-argument?