Incoming change - tying enchanted gear to the target drained

[snowfox]

Why not just remove enchanting and tie the greatest of the gear to DMs and their Events?

Because this severely disadvantages all those of us that do not participate in events.

[Arawn]

Wing's post is essentially what I was getting at, just much more in depth.  I suppose I'm just struggling to see how simply making one or two new rules to encompass the perceived issue wouldn't have been a better initial response.

I really hope that this new system doesn't come with a blanket assumption that all old enchanted items were made by the wearer, from an IC perspective.

We had rules; they were regularly flouted, regardless of how many times we caught it. This is the only mechanical way to enforce it.

To your second point, of course not. All that is IC remains IC. No retroactive continuity is required here.

[Merry Munchkin]

You can still have unique gifts -- I have asked DMs to make items for me for RP purposes (basically taking existing items and giving them new icons, new names, new descriptions, so that they are customized for the person I am giving them to).  I would assume that it might still be possible to arrange for an enchanted item to be created for such gift purposes (with a good reason and backstory or plot purpose) with the help of a DM, but this helps ensure that it is not abused to just give top gear to low levels, etc.  DM involvement could ensure that everything would be RP'd, IC, and consistent with the spirit of the setting.

[Tycat]

You can still have unique gifts -- I have asked DMs to make items for me for RP purposes (basically taking existing items and giving them new icons, new names, new descriptions, so that they are customized for the person I am giving them to).  I would assume that it might still be possible to arrange for an enchanted item to be created for such gift purposes (with a good reason and backstory or plot purpose) with the help of a DM, but this helps ensure that it is not abused to just give top gear to low levels, etc.  DM involvement could ensure that everything would be RP'd, IC, and consistent with the spirit of the setting.

In addition to this, you can actually work with a DM to create something uniquer. I had spent a lot of time collecting various things that were magical and had some ideal properties, and wrote a dm asking if they were reforged, could they be a ring, and I asked for reasonable stats based on the original items, name, and a description. I spent gold, went to the jeweler, and it was a lot of rp, but the staff approved it. If you're reasonable, I think it's an option. I got the idea from reading some old posts about it.

I really don't know if enchanted gear can trump the thought put into something like that.

I have a question regarding the old gear being tied to the current possessor:

If I drop my enchanted sword and enchanted shield, like say on death or over full inventory, how will that work being tied/bound to me?

I am still curious about this.

[Arawn]

You can still have unique gifts -- I have asked DMs to make items for me for RP purposes (basically taking existing items and giving them new icons, new names, new descriptions, so that they are customized for the person I am giving them to).  I would assume that it might still be possible to arrange for an enchanted item to be created for such gift purposes (with a good reason and backstory or plot purpose) with the help of a DM, but this helps ensure that it is not abused to just give top gear to low levels, etc.  DM involvement could ensure that everything would be RP'd, IC, and consistent with the spirit of the setting.

In addition to this, you can actually work with a DM to create something uniquer. I had spent a lot of time collecting various things that were magical and had some ideal properties, and wrote a dm asking if they were reforged, could they be a ring, and I asked for reasonable stats based on the original items, name, and a description. I spent gold, went to the jeweler, and it was a lot of rp, but the staff approved it. If you're reasonable, I think it's an option. I got the idea from reading some old posts about it.

I really don't know if enchanted gear can trump the thought put into something like that.

Exactly as these two posts state. If you want to personalize an item or make a unique gift, I've personalized, renamed and redescribed dozens if not hundreds of items in my time as a DM (even custom things like printing new books or combining two pieces of jewelry for a custom appearance). Send me a PM, I'll see what can be done.

[Arawn]

If I drop my enchanted sword and enchanted shield, like say on death or over full inventory, how will that work being tied/bound to me? I am still curious about this.

The item remembers who owns it, no matter how many inventories or locations it might pass through. It could be put in a chest, then taken by someone else and carried across the server, then dropped on the ground; if you find it, you can still equip it.

[herkles]

Wouldn't it be easier to just remove Enchanting?

[Tycat]

There's no point in removing it. i think that this change fixes all the issues there were with it.

[Iluvatar / Madness]

Wouldn't it be easier to just remove Enchanting?

Why would you removing enchanting?

It's not solving the problem it's feeling the problem. The new system is a good idea I think

[Snipehunt]

While I don't like the idea of it, since I think it will lessen RP opportunities for gifts or fights over enchanted items, I do agree with everyone else that it's a small price to pay to prevent the rule breaking mentioned at the top of the thread.

[DM Brimstone]

Such events should be overseen by a DM anyway

I completely disagree with this statement.  The DMs are busy enough as it is and I wouldn't expect them to oversee every player event.  As players, we should be able to take the initiative without requiring DM oversight.   

[Nemesis 24]

Wouldn't it be easier to just remove Enchanting?

Even as someone who hasn't done enchanting for anything yet, this is a horrible idea.  You're either asking no one else be allowed to catch up the playing field, or asking everyone who's worked hard to get the gear they have to have it stripped from them.  That's not the slightest bit fair to either party.  This ruling is -much- easier than dealing with that sort of logistical and public relations utter debacle.

[Syl]

Fade I don't think we know exactly when this effect is taking place. so you might still have time to pass the boots of to the winner of the lovely underbrawl.

That said This does sorta tip the scale back towards balance. Seeing people level 10 and under have ah enchanted piece of armor or weapon is ah bit disheartening since all they did was spend gold where as the rest spent Time and gold.... ah LOT of time... and that means not many things posed as much of ah threat since now they do not need magic weapon or GMW since they now have ah +2. First piece of enchanted gear I got was at 13.. was ah gift but I was 90% the way there. and in return I was the battery for their shield when I was higher. The rest of the gear I have enchanted I was my own battery. and doing so makes them all the more worth wild to have.

[Soul Suspect]

Love this change.

I haven't been a fan of people making gear for others with their EXP. Just seemed unfair and people would more than likely do it out of OOC friendships rather than IC roleplay. And besides there is already a level restriction on enchanting need to be Lvl 14 to have your exp drained.

As for prizes for things like underbrawl what's the harm in asking a DM to make a grand prize item or pull one from the loot tables?
Better to go on a mini quest in search for a famous fist fighters gloves or belt ect and use that as a Grand prize rather than make one, adds more story, character and depth to the prize and give the organizers a fun DM quest to go on, Indiana Jones like.

Best change so far

[Iluvatar / Madness]

As for prizes for things like underbrawl what's the harm in asking a DM to make a grand prize item or pull one from the loot tables?

That I'm not a fan of idea like this though, if you want to give a prize I say go get it yourself IG. If you want a DM to give you something, at least work for it. Otherwise I feel it's cheating.

[Arawn]

As for prizes for things like underbrawl what's the harm in asking a DM to make a grand prize item or pull one from the loot tables?

That I'm not a fan of idea like this though, if you want to give a prize I say go get it yourself IG. If you want a DM to give you something, at least work for it. Otherwise I feel it's cheating.

I think that's what he meant. There are any number of items in the palette, anyway, that would make good prizes. Hector's Wary Tread, Cloak of Elvenkind, Abber Moccasins, and so forth, or the equivalent in coin.

[Syl]

rofl WAY to name the top stealth gear Arawn LOL! Those are hell of some awesome prizes Don't forget Hector's knuckle duster, or umm.....Ummm......yeah I don't have anything else for ah prize lol

[Tarmikos1]

I like the change because it avoids a mechanical advantage people can have over lower levels, though what is being said about finding ingame
items is something we have done for events, but most items have a background and lore to them already, I feel it takes away the possibility of making
an item ingame that can be passed down as qwerty said that can build up a story of its own, I have also asked before about the specific rules of
asking a dm to make an item, besides having the background changed and name anything with stats or abilities is against the rules I believe.

Also those items are insanely hard to find and would make good prizes just not unique ones for special player made events, we can still just
make an actual trophy however, rewards do not need to be something we can use.

[Pagliacci]

I was actually unaware this server had enchanted gear until I saw this thread.

[Iluvatar / Madness]

As for prizes for things like underbrawl what's the harm in asking a DM to make a grand prize item or pull one from the loot tables?

That I'm not a fan of idea like this though, if you want to give a prize I say go get it yourself IG. If you want a DM to give you something, at least work for it. Otherwise I feel it's cheating.

I think that's what he meant. There are any number of items in the palette, anyway, that would make good prizes. Hector's Wary Tread, Cloak of Elvenkind, Abber Moccasins, and so forth, or the equivalent in coin.

Yeah... it makes more sense   hehe  Anyway, I don't think a DM would give out item for free

[DrXavierTColtrane]

In terms of the stated goals of this change, it sounds like a good idea.

Like Nemesis, I don't have any enchanted gear (and actually know little about it), but getting rid of enchanting altogether would seem grossly unfair to those who have devoted the time to learn it.

I feel it takes away the possibility of making an item ingame that can be passed down as qwerty said that can build up a story of its own

A more complicated (but also more creative) way of implementing the change would be to tie the item to an owner *but* allow ownership to transfer at great risk. That would make for true artifacts and items with "stories of their own."

For example:

Paladin P has an enchanted longsword made for him and acts as its battery. It is now tied to Paladin P. The enchanted item also has a "value" variable used for things like Lore that reflects how powerful it is.

Blackguard B comes along and manages to acquire P's sword. When B tries to equip it the first time, he makes a check based on his level versus some function of the value of the item. If he succeeds, the ownership transfers to B. If he fails, however, various bad things could happen based (for example) on how badly he failed.

1-5 B loses a level, but now the item is owned by B.
6-10 B loses a level, and the item remains owned by P.
> 10 B is killed, and the item is still tagged as owned by P.

Perhaps every 5 levels of one's lore skill could modify the roll. An added wrinkle would be that every time an enchanted item changes owner it has a chance of losing its enchantment.

A system like this would allow PCs to create truly legendary artifacts that only the most powerful have any hope of bending to their will. In fact, I can see storylines in which unsuspecting characters are tricked into picking up an item enchanted too powerfully for them to "cope."

[Pagliacci]

So, question. If you're going to do this, I'd be curious if you're planning on making the alignment of the character at the time of enchantment matter on weighing what the dice roll for the enchantment. A LG character probably shouldn't want a vampiric regeneration sword, just saying <_<

[greeneggs]

Hey there,

Just gonna put my 2 cents in.  I believe that this will fix all the problems from the initial post.  However, I do believe that enchanting in a way is extremely powerful.  It ruins immersion in some sense as well.  If enchanting were to be completely removed from the game, I would think it would be good thing.  But, players do need the opportunity for great gear.  I personally, have no enchanted items because I don't like them.  It's just personal preference. 

[Dumas]

Kronos, I think the idea you have of a character attempting to equip someone else's enchanted item is very intriguing. I'd hate for an RP avenue of stealing an enchanted weapon to vanish because of the ownership script. Having these potentially very damaging events happen from the attempted equipping seem like a good risk penalty. The only thing I would consider differently is the use of Lore vs another skill. UMD might be appropriate because that skill lets a character equip items out of their alignment and class.

[EO]

There's an option in the system for DMs to let some items change hands but that'd have to be handled with a DM and we'll discuss such requests among the team if they arrive.